Let the poopshow begin.

Have to wait to see who wins the draft lottery

Have to wait to see who wins the draft lottery
- senstroll

What if neither team wins?

What if neither team wins?
- golfingsince

Edmonton has a better starting point right now and will have a higher pick this draft, The leafs still need to convert some players to picks and prospects if possible (Dion, Lupul, Bozak) and maybe Kessel

the biggest difference is that the leafs have overhauled the Management and brought in several smart people to guide the team through drafting and developing players over buying talent (overpaying)

I give the leafs the edge now since Edmonton doesn't appear to have figured out that part yet.

Edmonton has a better starting point right now and will have a higher pick this draft, The leafs still need to convert some players to picks and prospects if possible (Dion, Lupul, Bozak) and maybe Kessel

the biggest difference is that the leafs have overhauled the Management and brought in several smart people to guide the team through drafting and developing players over buying talent (overpaying)

I give the leafs the edge now since Edmonton doesn't appear to have figured out that part yet.
- senstroll

We'll see. I wouldn't be too quick to guarantee who's been hired is smart just because they're better- not even that is guaranteed yet- than prior management. The returns they get for players like Kessel, Phaneuf, and who else they move will tell a lot. Who they end up keeping may also prove to be equally important.

We'll see. I wouldn't be too quick to guarantee who's been hired is smart just because they're better- not even that is guaranteed yet- than prior management. The returns they get for players like Kessel, Phaneuf, and who else they move will tell a lot. Who they end up keeping may also prove to be equally important.
- MaximumBone

I think we can see there is a huge change in Philosophy since last July (the Dubas mark). You cant get worse than Nonis, Loiselle and Poulin.. they were imo the most damaging to the org in the past 10 years. JFJ included.

I wanted to move Dion at the deadline, but it may have been a smart move to keep him... the return might end up being much better now.

We will see

I think we can see there is a huge change in Philosophy since last July (the Dubas mark). You cant get worse than Nonis, Loiselle and Poulin.. they were imo the most damaging to the org in the past 10 years. JFJ included.

I wanted to move Dion at the deadline, but it may have been a smart move to keep him... the return might end up being much better now.

We will see
- senstroll

That we will. Hopefully the Oilers can get some momentum building now that their young D have some experience in the pro ranks.

Oilers are definitely in a better position right now.


We can all agree though, that both teams are in a better position than the Sens.

i would say that in terms of players in the organization (both prospects and at the NHL level) the oilers are in a better position....that being said, i have zero confidence that their management group is smart enough to take them that next step forward.

oilers players > leafs players

leafs management ( minus nonis ) > oilers management

Oilers are definitely in a better position right now.


We can all agree though, that both teams are in a better position than the Sens.
- Feeling Glucky?

you're so very sad.....you and prock and dopps must have all gone to the same "School of Fail"

you're so very sad.....you and prock and dopps must have all gone to the same "School of Fail"
- sensarmy_11

I should have gone with the nucks, based on the creator of the thread


I'm not just saying that though... looking at Ottawa, I don't see a team built to go far. They're riding a hot goalie, and it's boosting their confidence, which feeds into their game. That's a good thing, obviously, but they're bound to come back down to earth... and they missed out on acquiring elite-level talent early in the rebuild.

And the owner is still a cheap-o. That's probably the biggest reason why I don't think they're in a good position.

I should have gone with the nucks, based on the creator of the thread
- Feeling Glucky?

that would have been better trolling..........but still very false.

that would have been better trolling..........but still very false.
- sensarmy_11

Not really... their best players are nearing the ends of their careers... doubtful they win a cup with this group, so they too will need to go through a full rebuild, which won't happen for a few more years.

Not really... their best players are nearing the ends of their careers... doubtful they win a cup with this group, so they too will need to go through a full rebuild, which won't happen for a few more years.
- Feeling Glucky?

They've had 4 1st round picks in the past 2 drafts, they're ahead of the Leafs on the rebuild.

They've had 4 1st round picks in the past 2 drafts, they're ahead of the Leafs on the rebuild.
- golfingsince

Not really... their best players are nearing the ends of their careers... doubtful they win a cup with this group, so they too will need to go through a full rebuild, which won't happen for a few more years.
- Feeling Glucky?

maybe, but they still have some quality young (or younger) players.....

virtanen, shinkaruk, horvat, bonino, kassian, tanev, sbisa, markstrom, demko, vey etc.


they don't have the #1 system in the league by any stretch.....but their cupboards aren't bare either. i would argue that the canucks have as many quality prospects/young players as the leafs do.

maybe, but they still have some quality young (or younger) players.....

virtanen, shinkaruk, horvat, bonino, kassian, tanev, sbisa, markstrom, demko, etc.


they don't have the #1 system in the league by any stretch.....but their cupboards aren't bare either. i would argue that the canucks have as many quality prospects/young players as the leafs do.
- sensarmy_11

Virtanen seems like the only quality player of the bunch, though. Only one with potential to be more than a 2nd line/2nd pairing kinda guy.

And again, based on where they are as a team, they're more likely to trade some of those guys, and some picks to try and win the cup before their top players fall off the map completely.

Leafs at least have a potential top line forward and a potential top pairing d-man in their system, and in all likelihood will add another one in this draft, and likely in next year's draft as well... and several young established NHLers who will continue to develop with the rest of the team as the rebuild progresses.

Virtanen seems like the only quality player of the bunch, though. Only one with potential to be more than a 2nd line/2nd pairing kinda guy.

And again, based on where they are as a team, they're more likely to trade some of those guys, and some picks to try and win the cup before their top players fall off the map completely.

Leafs at least have a potential top line forward and a potential top pairing d-man in their system, and in all likelihood will add another one in this draft, and likely in next year's draft as well... and several young established NHLers who will continue to develop with the rest of the team as the rebuild progresses.
- Feeling Glucky?

like who?

-kadri is as good as gone
gardiner....well if you believe what you read, is one of the worst d-men in the league
-neither goalie has been able to stop a beachball for the better part of 3 monhts now

JVR is solid, reilly has tons of potential, and nylander will be an offensive sparkplug, but beyond that...........

not saying the leafs are in bad shape, but i also wouldn't say that they're ahead of the canucks.......if you get mcdavid, fine, but beyond that i would say your systems are pretty damn close to even.

like who?

-kadri is as good as gone
gardiner....well if you believe what you read, is one of the worst d-men in the league
-neither goalie has been able to stop a beachball for the better part of 3 monhts now

JVR is solid, reilly has tons of potential, and nylander will be an offensive sparkplug, but beyond that...........
- sensarmy_11

We'll see about Kadri. He's an advanced stats beast, and with the Leafs' new focus on those things, I doubt they move him without getting something similar in return.


Gardiner will never be a top pairing d-man, doesn't seem to have the smarts for it. But he'll be good in a protected role. Again, his advanced stats are very good, he just needs to play a more instinctual game. Seems whenever he tries to think he just freezes up.

Connor Brown and Andreas Johnsson are two more high-potential prospects in the Leafs' system. It'll be interesting to see how they develop over the years.


And then you gotta look at the return for guys like Phaneuf and Kessel(if both are traded).... minimum 2 more 1sts/high end prospects coming from those trades(combined, not each).


Again, Leafs are at in a position where they'll be adding youth for the future, and have the money and apparent change in philosophy with the new management group to support their development.

Vancouver is going to be haemorrhaging youth to try and stay competitive a few years more... and they're not going to be winning anything with their current NHL group.

Virtanen seems like the only quality player of the bunch, though. Only one with potential to be more than a 2nd line/2nd pairing kinda guy.

And again, based on where they are as a team, they're more likely to trade some of those guys, and some picks to try and win the cup before their top players fall off the map completely.

Leafs at least have a potential top line forward and a potential top pairing d-man in their system, and in all likelihood will add another one in this draft, and likely in next year's draft as well... and several young established NHLers who will continue to develop with the rest of the team as the rebuild progresses.
- Feeling Glucky?

We'll see about Kadri. He's an advanced stats beast, and with the Leafs' new focus on those things, I doubt they move him without getting something similar in return.


Gardiner will never be a top pairing d-man, doesn't seem to have the smarts for it. But he'll be good in a protected role. Again, his advanced stats are very good, he just needs to play a more instinctual game. Seems whenever he tries to think he just freezes up.

Connor Brown and Andreas Johnsson are two more high-potential prospects in the Leafs' system. It'll be interesting to see how they develop over the years.


And then you gotta look at the return for guys like Phaneuf and Kessel(if both are traded).... minimum 2 more 1sts/high end prospects coming from those trades(combined, not each).


Again, Leafs are at in a position where they'll be adding youth for the future, and have the money and apparent change in philosophy with the new management group to support their development.

Vancouver is going to be haemorrhaging youth to try and stay competitive a few years more... and they're not going to be winning anything with their current NHL group.
- Feeling Glucky?

Except this is the exact opposite approach for the past 2 years. Vancouver is still a fairly attractive place for a UFA, they don't trade prospects for aging vets. Benning has said he won't, and wants to continue to add picks/prospects.

Except this is the exact opposite approach for the past 2 years. Vancouver is still a fairly attractive place for a UFA, they don't trade prospects for aging vets. Benning has said he won't, and wants to continue to add picks/prospects.
- golfingsince

Oh, well if he said that, I'm sure it'll happen.


The Sedins and whoever the League's 2 top-3 goalies are will lead Vancouver to the cup! DYNASTY!

Oh, well if he said that, I'm sure it'll happen.


The Sedins and whoever the League's 2 top-3 goalies are will lead Vancouver to the cup! DYNASTY!
- Feeling Glucky?

Bernier (the next Carey Price) and Reimer don't play for Vancouver.


Edit: But you'll take the Leafs word at face value.

Bernier (the next Carey Price) and Reimer don't play for Vancouver.


Edit: But you'll take the Leafs word at face value.
- golfingsince

Great observation!

Do you want a star sticker, or a happy face?

Great observation!

Do you want a star sticker, or a happy face?
- Feeling Glucky?

You must piss blue you're such a homer.

You've been arguing for 6 years that the Leafs are in a better position than the Sens, and you're now just entering a rebuild without having made the playoffs once during a full season in over a decade.

Every Canadian team is miles ahead of the Leafs, except for possibly the Oilers which is why this thread has been created.