I agree on Schenn. At this point, you either have to give him a FAIR shot at 2nd line Center with wingers that complement him, or trade him for a comparable asset that better fits the roster. It's ludicrous to say he has no value. Actually, we truly don't know what he brings because he hasn't been given a fair shot.

To me, keeping him in LW Limbo is just stupid.
- TheGreat28

Fair shot?

He has been routinely been placed on the top line and top powerplay. Eventually he has to take the next step.

I agree. They are 2 to 3 years away in my mind. I think you could fix the forwards if you could draft Strome or Marner, and make one other off-season move. But if it's Marner, he's probably 2 years away. Strome might be able to make the team next year. Maybe.

But even if you could quick-fix the forwards, the defense is more problematic. You are forced to wait on the young guns and pray that at least 2 of them become very very solid contributors.

There are times when I think they'd almost be better to Hinkie the mother(frank)er.
- TheGreat28

Haha! Don't Hinkie it just yet. I think if they are able to develop a franchise Dman and a couple of the other D prospects turn into good pros, the team could develop into a contender. It's usually much easier to find skilled forwards in UFA too, if need be. So by the time the D prospects develop and hopefully the cap is in better shape. Giroux and Jake will be in their early 30's and hopefully still playing effective hockey at a high level.

A lot of things have to go right in that scenario, but it isn't like there's a higher chance of success doing it the Hinkie way, right? I just try to be optimistic, otherwise it isn't much fun for me.

Wouldn't Ryan Miller be viewed not as highly if solely judged off wins/losses with Buff?
- arichardson22

lol exactly

I think Berube knows he's done at seasons end, and he's trying to sabotage the Flyers on his way out. Just (frank)ing get rid of the guy now. Let Holmgren coach the last 8 games. It's his mess to begin with.

Fair shot?

He has been routinely been placed on the top line and top powerplay. Eventually he has to take the next step.
- J35Bacher

Mariano Rivera might be the greatest closer of all-time. He failed as a starter. So did Goose Gossage, Lee Smith, John Franco, and a bunch of others. A bunch of them failed on very good teams.

Putting a player in a role in which he is clearly not comfortable, even if it's with tremendously talented players around him, is not necessarily a fair opportunity. He needs a chance in the role to which he is best suited, with players that complement him. Hint, Simmonds is not one of those guys.

Then, if he doesn't step up, it's on him.

Haha! Don't Hinkie it just yet. I think if they are able to develop a franchise Dman and a couple of the other D prospects turn into good pros, the team could develop into a contender. It's usually much easier to find skilled forwards in UFA too, if need be. So by the time the D prospects develop and hopefully the cap is in better shape. Giroux and Jake will be in their early 30's and hopefully still playing effective hockey at a high level.

A lot of things have to go right in that scenario, but it isn't like there's a higher chance of success doing it the Hinkie way, right? I just try to be optimistic, otherwise it isn't much fun for me.
- kellyblaise7

Everyone needs to cool themselves about g and jake entering their 30's... G still has 3 more years before he hits 30... jake still has like 5 years... Did they have a wasted year of production from them? Yeah you could absolutely say that. But they're both extremely good players. Just cuz they hit 30 doesn't mean their production is going to immediately fall of a cliff.

Fair shot?

He has been routinely been placed on the top line and top powerplay. Eventually he has to take the next step.
- J35Bacher

agreed. Schenn time on the top line and pp should have given him plenty of chances and time to showcase himself. ESPECIALLY if you are playing with Jake and G. There just so many instances while I'm watching the game he just stands out there like a deer in the headlights. completely clueless. He has good attributes all around imo, but nothing specifically really stands out in his game. Really thought he would pick up his scoring this year and he just doesn't posses the skill i think. So many good shot chances and he either completely misses the net or shoots it right at the goalies mitt. especially that one timer on the PP that Hartsy used to sink like it was his job

Everyone needs to cool themselves about g and jake entering their 30's... G still has 3 more years before he hits 30... jake still has like 5 years... Did they have a wasted year of production from them? Yeah you could absolutely say that. But they're both extremely good players. Just cuz they hit 30 doesn't mean their production is going to immediately fall of a cliff.
- benjichronic

if anything I'm more excited for Jake next year. The shape he got in for this season can only get better for this off-season training and conditioning,. unless he goes back to mama's pasta....

Time for another Richards/Carter trade

Time for another Richards/Carter trade
- Streit2ThePoint

please god no. its too soon

That's a great analogy. By Berube's rationale, the Phils would have traded Hamels last year for Aumont, Gillies and Ramirez. Oh wait...
- TheGreat28

He comes across a bit like Tortarella did... bemoaning guys spending time on the trainers' table... suck it up an play, stop being a wussy mentality.
- Tomahawk

And look at what Vancouver did as soon as they fired Torts.

I will admit I am one who has been saying trade B Schenn, but when we get a new coach, I wouldn't trade Schenn or Couts. I'd like to see them used in another coach's style and system. Then assess their play and pull trigger on trade, even around the deadline.

Haha! Don't Hinkie it just yet. I think if they are able to develop a franchise Dman and a couple of the other D prospects turn into good pros, the team could develop into a contender. It's usually much easier to find skilled forwards in UFA too, if need be. So by the time the D prospects develop and hopefully the cap is in better shape. Giroux and Jake will be in their early 30's and hopefully still playing effective hockey at a high level.

A lot of things have to go right in that scenario, but it isn't like there's a higher chance of success doing it the Hinkie way, right? I just try to be optimistic, otherwise it isn't much fun for me.
- kellyblaise7

Seriously, I don't think they should and would do this. In the NBA it might work because 5 or 6 guys play a disproportionate amount of minutes. You pretty much need 2 or 3 superstars to be a serious contender. It the NHL, it would be very risky.

But it does worry me that G and Jake will be in their 30's. I'm slightly in the Joe Banner school of aging players. It's why I hated the Pronger trade the day they made it, and still to this day.

I think Berube knows he's done at seasons end, and he's trying to sabotage the Flyers on his way out. Just (frank)ing get rid of the guy now. Let Holmgren coach the last 8 games. It's his mess to begin with.
- PLindbergh31

I've been saying that since mid January, LOL

Everyone needs to cool themselves about g and jake entering their 30's... G still has 3 more years before he hits 30... jake still has like 5 years... Did they have a wasted year of production from them? Yeah you could absolutely say that. But they're both extremely good players. Just cuz they hit 30 doesn't mean their production is going to immediately fall of a cliff.
- benjichronic

That's what I'm saying too man! Barring career ending injuries or something like that, they should be fine by the time the young D prospects develop into pros. Even if it takes Sanheim (or someone else) 5-6yrs from now to become a franchise Dman, Giroux and Jake should still be able to contribute IMO.

if anything I'm more excited for Jake next year. The shape he got in for this season can only get better for this off-season training and conditioning,. unless he goes back to mama's pasta....
- arichardson22

After playing with this team all season, I'm more afraid he's going to go to gulping cheap whiskey and smoking crack.

That's what I'm saying too man! Barring career ending injuries or something like that, they should be fine by the time the young D prospects develop into pros. Even if it takes Sanheim (or someone else) 5-6yrs from now to become a franchise Dman, Giroux and Jake should still be able to contribute IMO.
- kellyblaise7

and by then we also would have drafted other offensive talent as well perhaps. I'm not worried about it honestly. Giroux in his 30s is still going to be a great play maker.

After playing with this team all season, I'm more afraid he's going to go to gulping cheap whiskey and smoking crack.
- BiggE

Everyone needs to cool themselves about g and jake entering their 30's... G still has 3 more years before he hits 30... jake still has like 5 years... Did they have a wasted year of production from them? Yeah you could absolutely say that. But they're both extremely good players. Just cuz they hit 30 doesn't mean their production is going to immediately fall of a cliff.
- benjichronic

Let's not forget that there's likely going to be another generation of (great) offensive players to come up behind them... like the Red Wings couldn't score a goal after Yzerman hit 30, or something.

please god no. its too soon
- arichardson22

Everyone needs to cool themselves about g and jake entering their 30's... G still has 3 more years before he hits 30... jake still has like 5 years... Did they have a wasted year of production from them? Yeah you could absolutely say that. But they're both extremely good players. Just cuz they hit 30 doesn't mean their production is going to immediately fall of a cliff.
- benjichronic

Actually, check out some of the studies on the subject.

The study will be published in the June issue of the Journal of Quantitative Analysis in Sports. Brander's co-authors are Edward Egan and Louisa Yeung. They analyzed peak performance in a number of ways, but the statistics they relied on were regular season points scored and plus-minus for skaters and save percentage for goalies.

Brander's team also found that forwards:

- Improve more quickly than they decline and typically begin "a significant decline in their early 30s."

- Perform within 90 per cent of their peak from 24 to 32 years old.

- 25 is their most common age, with 24-27 very similar.

Defencemen, the co-authors report:

- Improve and decline more slowly than forwards and do so very symmetrically.
Perform within 90 per cent of their peak from 24 to 34 years old (two years longer than forwards).

- 26 is their most common age, with 25 and 27 very similar.

For goalies, they found that:

- Performance varies little by age.

- At every age between 20 and 37, their save percentage is between 90 per cent and a tiny fraction over 91 per cent.

- 28 is their most common age, with 26-29 very similar.

Looking at the rest of our schedule, as well as Blue Jackets and Devils, where do you think we will finish place wise? All three of us have games against contenders so it should be interesting.

Let's not forget that there's likely going to be another generation of (great) offensive players to come up behind them... like the Red Wings couldn't score a goal after Yzerman hit 30, or something.
- Tomahawk

Yeah, but the general level of talent in the Red Wings system over the last dozen years has been markedly better than the Flyers.

and by then we also would have drafted other offensive talent as well perhaps. I'm not worried about it honestly. Giroux in his 30s is still going to be a great play maker.
- arichardson22

Exactly. is there some reason to worry about it? Yeah, look at vinny, umberger, mike Richards, havlat- it happens to some players. But like I mentioned earlier, g and jake are extremely talented players. And like you said, hopefully by then we've drafted some more offensive talent, and you hope that cousins, laughton, and coots have rounded out their offensive game in the nhl and contribute as well. And of course our d prospects. Things will be fine.