That's fine you disagree but the point is he hasn't at least been tried else where. Say for example a young up and coming JvR was struggling early in his career back in 2010 but was without rope from Laviolette. So JvR spends the year playing with Betts and Powe while continuing not to produce. Fourth line players aren't really expected to produce offensively. They are expected to generate enery and be responsible defensively within their limited minutes. This isn't a Vincent Lecavalier role. This is also not very good roster with even worse player placement by the coach. You at least give the opportunities when they've been earned and take them away when they aren't deserved.
- SuperSchennBros

Fair enough, I just think he's lost a step since the back injury and just can't compete at a high level anymore, but your point certainly is valid.

there really is no need for him if all three of Frenchy, White, and Vande are back with us next year. Better of giving roster spot to young guy
- arichardson22

Agree 100%

Were you the originator of the Homgren as interim coach idea? Cause I love that idea.
- Feanor

I believe so. poop, he built this dumpster fire of a roster, let him coach it.

For me, it's less about Rinaldo specifically, and more about them being forced to have 3rd-pairs/bottom-six forwards filled w/ replacement-level guys because they're spending wastefully elsewhere.

Seems like the teams better than us have more depth of talent... even if they have a 4th-line of bangers, theirs are more talented than ours. Clutterbuck > Rinaldo, for example.
- Tomahawk

That's very true, but the Islanders traded a guy who's now a top 6 LW to get him.

Mariano Rivera might be the greatest closer of all-time. He failed as a starter. So did Goose Gossage, Lee Smith, John Franco, and a bunch of others. A bunch of them failed on very good teams.

Putting a player in a role in which he is clearly not comfortable, even if it's with tremendously talented players around him, is not necessarily a fair opportunity. He needs a chance in the role to which he is best suited, with players that complement him. Hint, Simmonds is not one of those guys.

Then, if he doesn't step up, it's on him.
- TheGreat28

His skill set isn't that of a center. He isn't a great playmaker and really isn't a sniper either. He is a tweener. He isn';t a powerforward but does play best when playing like one.

I look at Raffl. Anywhere he is placed he seems to do good things. Schenn should be able to do that too and he just doesn't.

Now I am not just dumping. maybe another coach might be able to get more. But if I get a good trade I have to really look at it. I actually think a trade to WPG for Burmistrov would be something I look into.

I believe so. poop, he built this dumpster fire of a roster, let him coach it.
- BiggE

let the fans rip him apart all game!

His skill set isn't that of a center. He isn't a great playmaker and really isn't a sniper either. He is a tweener. He isn';t a powerforward but does play best when playing like one.
- J35Bacher

He's actually not a bad playmaker (makes some really nifty passes from time to time), and he's got one of the best wristers on the team (bar-down ding). He's just hasn't been put in a position to take advantage, since Chief's got him pigeonholed as a net-front presence.

Tops of the circles and camped 10-ft from the right-post... those were his spots coming up. He's got the hands to score from distance.

let the fans rip him apart all game!
- arichardson22

It would liven things up a bit for sure!

I'll probably get lambasted for this, but if we win the lottery and Buffalo has the 2nd pick, I'd offer to swap #1 for #2 and their other 1st round pick, as long as Buffalo takes VLC, Umberger and Pronger off our hands.

We'd still get a 1st line center in Eichel, another 1st in a strong draft and all of our cap problems would basically be solved.
- BiggE

I'd be ok with doing the flip, but I'd want a different package.

To Buffalo:
#1, Schenn, VLC

To Philadelphia
#2, 1st in 2015, Zadorov or Ristolainen, and Deslauriers

He's actually not a bad playmaker (makes some really nifty passes from time to time), and he's got one of the best wristers on the team (bar-down ding). He's just hasn't been put in a position to take advantage, since Chief's got him pigeonholed as a net-front presence.

Tops of the circles and camped 10-ft from the right-post... those were his spots coming up. He's got the hands to score from distance.
- Tomahawk

Agreed, he'd be better off on the 2nd unit in Jake's spot at the top of the right circle. The problem is, once they moved Hartnell, they had no one who really fit into his spot on the 1st team pp. It's a real credit to Streit, Giroux, Jake and Simmonds that they've done as well as they have.

He's actually not a bad playmaker (makes some really nifty passes from time to time), and he's got one of the best wristers on the team (bar-down ding). He's just hasn't been put in a position to take advantage, since Chief's got him pigeonholed as a net-front presence.

Tops of the circles and camped 10-ft from the right-post... those were his spots coming up. He's got the hands to score from distance.
- Tomahawk

I agree. Simmonds is actually a pretty decent passer. he does a lot of small lthings that go completely unnoticed as well. And he's a terror on the boards.

They can't pick second, the lottery only determines the first pick. Even if they lose every game left this season, unless they win the lottery, they won't pick higher than 6th.
- BiggE

Unless they trade up.

The Flyers' two 1st rounders plus Moran to Edm for Eichel?

I'd be ok with doing the flip, but I'd want a different package.

To Buffalo:
#1, Schenn, VLC

To Philadelphia
#2, 1st in 2015, Zadorov or Ristolainen, and Deslauriers
- TheGreat28

I'd be down with that, but I'd insist on Ristolainen, I want the right hand shot.

Unless they trade up.

The Flyers' two 1st rounders plus Moran to Edm for Eichel?
- 77rams

The way MacT overvalues his assets, he'd probably want us to throw in Giroux and jake too

His skill set isn't that of a center. He isn't a great playmaker and really isn't a sniper either. He is a tweener. He isn';t a powerforward but does play best when playing like one.

I look at Raffl. Anywhere he is placed he seems to do good things. Schenn should be able to do that too and he just doesn't.

Now I am not just dumping. maybe another coach might be able to get more. But if I get a good trade I have to really look at it. I actually think a trade to WPG for Burmistrov would be something I look into.
- J35Bacher

Yet this all could be said about Couturier and lots of folks are convinced that he's our future 2nd line center.

Put it this way, if you put Schenn with Mitch Marner and a skilled, 2-way LW not on this roster, and I think you'd have a killer 2nd line.

Actually, check out some of the studies on the subject.

The study will be published in the June issue of the Journal of Quantitative Analysis in Sports. Brander's co-authors are Edward Egan and Louisa Yeung. They analyzed peak performance in a number of ways, but the statistics they relied on were regular season points scored and plus-minus for skaters and save percentage for goalies.

For goalies, they found that:

- Performance varies little by age.

- At every age between 20 and 37, their save percentage is between 90 per cent and a tiny fraction over 91 per cent.

- 28 is their most common age, with 26-29 very similar.
- TheGreat28

This, however, has to be limited to the small pool of goalies that even GET to the NHL in their early 20s because many don't make to stay until their mid-20s or even late-20s.

See the recent NHL.com article: Only one goaltender leaguewide drafted in the last EIGHT drafts (Braden Holtby) has reached 150 games played in the NHL by this point. That doesn't include someone like Bobrovsky, who was an undrafted rookie free agent but even that speaks to how inexact a science it is scout and develop goalies.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=751852

He's actually not a bad playmaker (makes some really nifty passes from time to time), and he's got one of the best wristers on the team (bar-down ding). He's just hasn't been put in a position to take advantage, since Chief's got him pigeonholed as a net-front presence.

Tops of the circles and camped 10-ft from the right-post... those were his spots coming up. He's got the hands to score from distance.
- Tomahawk

He has made a few nice passes. So has Rinaldo. The problem I have is he just isn't consistent. Yes He plays some good games but then he goes a week or two unnoticed. If not scoring he still needs to do other things.

Unless they trade up.

The Flyers' two 1st rounders plus Moran to Edm for Eichel?
- 77rams

The problem with this is, they really need Morin to be a cornerstone on D. Sanheim is not as physical, and Ghost, well, is Ghost.

I'd consider it with Laughton substituted for Morin.

Don't think the other team would do it though. I think you'd have a better shot of trading up to #3 - 5 from 6-8. I'd do it for Strome or Marner in a heartbeat.

EDIT: To clarify, I wouldn't give up that much to move up to get Strome or Marner. But I would try to trade up, and would give up something decent (Laughton or Cousins, with maybe a pick coming back).

His skill set isn't that of a center. He isn't a great playmaker and really isn't a sniper either. He is a tweener. He isn';t a powerforward but does play best when playing like one.

Now I am not just dumping. maybe another coach might be able to get more. But if I get a good trade I have to really look at it. I actually think a trade to WPG for Burmistrov would be something I look into.
- J35Bacher

Schenn is definitely more of a power-forward if anything. While he may not fit perfectly into any particular mold, he does know his way around the offensive zone. He knows how to produce points and I'd say he's even a better playmaker than people give him credit for. His biggest issues are his lack of defensive prowess, foot-speed, and just overall inconsistency.

I'm torn as to whether he's a center or a wing. I like him at center because his lack of foot speed seems to hinder his ability to produce offense at wing. However, I also like him at wing because he's a very north-south kind of player and while not horrible defensively, I certainly would not label him a stalwart.

All things considered, I think he fits into either role much better if he can just be more consistent. There are times when he is engaged and playing quite physical and there are times when he's just kind of "floating". I also think he needs to shoot WAY more, as I've noticed he has a pretty heavy shot.

I'm actually starting to think his shot is the key to unlocking some of his potential. If he's at wing, start shooting more on the rush; either pick your spot or shoot for rebounds. If he's at center, wait in the high slot for drop passes and rip it. I really, really like the way he shoots.....he just doesn't do it nearly enough.

I wouldn't be opposed to moving him, but it shouldn't be "for the sake of doing so" (Burmistrov - way beter deal out there than that).

He has made a few nice passes. So has Rinaldo. The problem I have is he just isn't consistent. Yes He plays some good games but then he goes a week or two unnoticed. If not scoring he still needs to do other things.
- J35Bacher

He looked a lot more impressive, more often, under Lavi... that's all I'm sayin'.

Not surprised at the logic, coming from a Haddon Twp resident. Lot of smart people from that burg
- Jsaquella

10 min drive to the practice rink.

Seravalli's take on 5 days that sank the Flyers season.

http://www.philly.com/phi...that_sank_the_Flyers.html

I don't agree with them all, but some good points were made.

This, however, has to be limited to the small pool of goalies that even GET to the NHL in their early 20s because many don't make to stay until their mid-20s or even late-20s.

See the recent NHL.com article: Only one goaltender leaguewide drafted in the last EIGHT drafts (Braden Holtby) has reached 150 games played in the NHL by this point. That doesn't include someone like Bobrovsky, who was an undrafted rookie free agent but even that speaks to how inexact a science it is scout and develop goalies.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=751852
- bmeltzer

I agree on Goalies. I postulated a theory a while ago that I'd NEVER draft a goalie, and instead do a Bernier or Schneider kind of trade. I'd still stick to that philosophy.

And the article, pasted below, did also mention that elite players tend to age better.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/wh...-hockey-metrics-1.2646054

Yet this all could be said about Couturier and lots of folks are convinced that he's our future 2nd line center.

Put it this way, if you put Schenn with Mitch Marner and a skilled, 2-way LW not on this roster, and I think you'd have a killer 2nd line.
- TheGreat28

I don't see Coots as anything better than a 3rd line center and I'm OK with that. If they do get a legit 2nd line center, they'll be set down the middle for years.

Coot's feet, and especially his hands, are a little too slow for me to be effective 2nd line pivot.

Fair enough, I just think he's lost a step since the back injury and just can't compete at a high level anymore, but your point certainly is valid.
- BiggE

I'm disagreeing with your reasoning. Your correct and I'm meeting you in the middle by si.ply saying it's another Berube move I disagree with. Example, an undiscipline, skillis player like Zac Rinaldo has more rope then Lecavalier. In fact I'll go a little further. If you asked me who has been better this year between Lecavalier and Umberger, Illinois choose Lecavalier every time. Lecavalier has produced more in a part time fourth line role then RJ Umberger has in a full time role on this roster. Umberger couldn't even crack an already bad PK and he's supposed to be a PK regular.