I Mother Earth?

Nash, Carter, Richards.


Anyone eat salary in those deals?
- Feeling Glucky?

carter and richards had cap hits that were like 3 mil less than kessel........and the return for nash was nowhere near what leaf fans are expecting to get for kessel.

nash was traded for two 2nd liners and a late 1st

nobody is going to give up an elite young player, grade A prospect, and a 1st PLUS take on an 8 million cap hit

I think other teams' fans are going to be eating their words a little bit.

If the returns are truly as bad as what most people predict, then the Leafs simply will not make deals.

Getting sick of EVERY trade suggestion involving the Leafs including "retaining some salary". Bozak is not overpriced. Kessel is not overpriced, even Phaneuf is not very much overpriced given what other, lesser d-men have signed for the last couple years.

The ENTIRE TEAM had a horrible collapse. There is definitely more going on than what people hear about. Other GM's may try to throw the Leafs an anchor but these players don't all have negative value.

Hell, I heard someone say a couple days ago that Van Reimsdyk wouldn't fetch much.

Or how about Detroit offering Weiss for Phaneuf IF the Leafs retain some salary and the comment was Toronto would not be getting much more from Detroit...

So let me get this straight, You get a #2, EASILY a good #3 Dman for free and the Leafs pay his salary basically.

Some really stupid opinions around here the last couple months.
- Aetherial

i never said the leafs wouldn't get anything................i said the options, IMO, were likely that they'd get a real good return if they ate salary OR they would not eat salary and get less than they hoped for.

they aren't going to dump the entire salary AND get an incredible return.

carter and richards had cap hits that were like 3 mil less than kessel........and the return for nash was nowhere near what leaf fans are expecting to get for kessel.

nash was traded for two 2nd liners and a late 1st

nobody is going to give up an elite young player, grade A prospect, and a 1st PLUS take on an 8 million cap hit
- sensarmy_11

Cut the poop about the contract; yeah it's hefty, but a team WILL pay if they need scoring. It's a part of the game.

Cut the poop about the contract; yeah it's hefty, but a team WILL pay if they need scoring. It's a part of the game.
- Conquest

sure they'll pay, but it won't be what was suggested earlier.........it will be similar to what cbj got for nash

sure they'll pay, but it won't be what was suggested earlier.........it will be similar to what cbj got for nash
- sensarmy_11

i agree 100%.

i never said the leafs wouldn't get anything................i said the options, IMO, were likely that they'd get a real good return if they ate salary OR they would not eat salary and get less than they hoped for.

they aren't going to dump the entire salary AND get an incredible return.
- sensarmy_11

OK great thanks

OK great thanks
- Aetherial

it makes me laugh how defensive some of you guys get when anyone suggests that moving kessel isn't going to fetch a franchise altering return.

I Mother Earth?
- James_Tanner

No, you're James Tanner...

Do we need to give you the genital cuff?

No, you're James Tanner...

Do we need to give you the genital cuff?


- geta02it

i (frank)ing love that movie

it makes me laugh how defensive some of you guys get when anyone suggests that moving kessel isn't going to fetch a franchise altering return.
- sensarmy_11

i'm of the opinion if you DON"T move kessel because the return is bad, it's even worse than a poor return. he was a top 10 scorer for years for us; how did that work out? strip away the rest of the team, it will continue to be useless. a 1st rounder (we'll get more but still) is more valuable in theory to us than kessel is for where we are headed. i dont think he has many good years left to be honest. he's 27/28, usually that's the peak of offensive players.

it makes me laugh how defensive some of you guys get when anyone suggests that moving kessel isn't going to fetch a franchise altering return.
- sensarmy_11

Makes me laugh how people can't fcuking wait to log into the threads of other teams to tell everyone exactly what they are going to get in return and why.

Go back and read your assessment of trade value.

It amounts to "The return will be better if the Leafs retain salary".

Thanks! Earth-shattering stuff right there. I am glad fans of other teams are able to enlighten us all.

How about I put this more simply... nobody give a flying F what you or any other fan of another team thinks about what we are going to get in return. If we are out to lunch in our expectations, fine, feel free to quote us later and laugh about it for days and days with the other trolls.

Last time a fan base had a huge dispute about what was going to happen in a trade THEY ended up looking like a bunch of idiots, not the Leafs fans.

Sorry this rant was taken out on you specifically. It has been a long time coming, reading a lot of crap from the idiots around here.

i'm of the opinion if you DON"T move kessel because the return is bad, it's even worse than a poor return. he was a top 10 scorer for years for us; how did that work out? strip away the rest of the team, it will continue to be useless. a 1st rounder (we'll get more but still) is more valuable in theory to us than kessel is for where we are headed. i dont think he has many good years left to be honest. he's 27/28, usually that's the peak of offensive players.
- clark_griswold

I am of the opinion that if the deals truly are as bad as what other fans can;t wait to suggest to us, then their won't be trades.

it makes me laugh how defensive some of you guys get when anyone suggests that moving kessel isn't going to fetch a franchise altering return.
- sensarmy_11

makes me laugh that people like your crawl out of your holes and pretend to be of some superior knowledge when we suggest something but yet for the 2 years of luongo for kadri, gardiner, and a 1st you were no where to be seen or telling us how that was a good trade... take a hike

makes me laugh that people like your crawl out of your holes and pretend to be of some superior knowledge when we suggest something but yet for the 2 years of luongo for kadri, gardiner, and a 1st you were no where to be seen or telling us how that was a good trade... take a hike
- DarcyTucker16

yeah you're right, this is the first time i've ever posted on here about anything.....was definitely hiding in a hole

Makes me laugh how people can't fcuking wait to log into the threads of other teams to tell everyone exactly what they are going to get in return and why.

Go back and read your assessment of trade value.

It amounts to "The return will be better if the Leafs retain salary".

Thanks! Earth-shattering stuff right there. I am glad fans of other teams are able to enlighten us all.

How about I put this more simply... nobody give a flying F what you or any other fan of another team thinks about what we are going to get in return. If we are out to lunch in our expectations, fine, feel free to quote us later and laugh about it for days and days with the other trolls.

Last time a fan base had a huge dispute about what was going to happen in a trade THEY ended up looking like a bunch of idiots, not the Leafs fans.

Sorry this rant was taken out on you specifically. It has been a long time coming, reading a lot of crap from the idiots around here.
- Aetherial

why would i want to laugh. i was trying to have a civilized conversation......you're the one who's getting all bent out of shape

i'm of the opinion if you DON"T move kessel because the return is bad, it's even worse than a poor return. he was a top 10 scorer for years for us; how did that work out? strip away the rest of the team, it will continue to be useless. a 1st rounder (we'll get more but still) is more valuable in theory to us than kessel is for where we are headed. i dont think he has many good years left to be honest. he's 27/28, usually that's the peak of offensive players.
- clark_griswold

it all depends on how bad the offers are..........i think if they get a return comparable to Nash ( a couple of solid 24-25 year olds and a 1st) then there's nothing wrong with that.........but if the offers are complete poop (like what we got for heatley) then you're definitely better off holding on to him.

yeah you're right, this is the first time i've ever posted on here about anything.....was definitely hiding in a hole
- sensarmy_11

ya thats what i said... my words were you've never posted on here about anything... you can't even troll properly..

ya thats what i said... my words were you've never posted on here about anything... you can't even troll properly..
- DarcyTucker16

so i'm a troll because i never got involved in the stupidity between clowns like you, and vancouver fans and then had a discussion about potential trade vaue today...................ok there bud.

I Mother Earth?
- James_Tanner

I Mother Earth?
- James_Tanner

Edwin

why would i want to laugh. i was trying to have a civilized conversation......you're the one who's getting all bent out of shape
- sensarmy_11

Like I said, I am sorry that this got taken out on you. You are far from the worst offender. This is MONTHS of hearing this crap.

We ALL know Kessel has his warts and a one-dimensional game etc. Of course that one dimension is the most rare, and least "teachable" aspect of playing hockey.

However, since we are fond of making the Nash comparison and Nash is also not known as a defensive or checking paragon of strength, let's look at the 5 years leading up to their trades, assuming Kessel is traded this off-season...


Kessel scored 10% more points (shortened season points pro-rated)

Average Scoring rank... Kessel 20.2, Nash 36.6 ... and that includes seasons when they were 23 years old AND includes the complete Leafs organizational collapse of this year, where the TEAM set a record for low scoring in a month. I did not pull any punches here.

The real kicker is this... in the 3 years total before this Leafs abortion, Kessel was 2nd overall in scoring. Nash has never, ever been anywhere near that, in any 3-year period in his career and definitely not leading up to when he was traded.

Nash cap hit = 7.8, Kessel = 8 ... not bad at all considering inflation.

Nash is not Lucic. He is a scoring forward and his numbers and where he ranked in the league are not all that close to Kessel.

so i'm a troll because i never got involved in the stupidity between clowns like you, and vancouver fans and then had a discussion about potential trade vaue today...................ok there bud.
- sensarmy_11

Honestly, if I don't have you confused with someone else, you have never really been a troll.

In this case you are a troll simply because Leafs fans are sick of the team, sick of the media, sick of Kessel, sick of the season, and real sick of years of endless, idiotic, trolling.

i (frank)ing love that movie
- sensarmy_11

Underrated comedy classic

... he loves to just run and run

Honestly, if I don't have you confused with someone else, you have never really been a troll.

In this case you are a troll simply because Leafs fans are sick of the team, sick of the media, sick of Kessel, sick of the season, and real sick of years of endless, idiotic, trolling.
- Aetherial

fair enough, i understand that some people are likely very sensitive.

my question initially wasn't asked with trolling in mind, but i get that perhaps some people would take it that way...........i just get bored at work, and like to talk hockey, any hockey