OK, I will play with this second graph. So, we have zero help in the top six to 71-87-72. Imagine if we had Staal as out third line center at 6 million, as opposed to Sutter at 3.2 or whatever. Our roster would be worse due to cap problems and Jordan Staal wouldn't have competent wingers at all. He would be lugging around Ebbett and Megna.

A serious change in philosophy needs to happen. Semin and Sharp aren't answers.
- Oneonta Penguin

But I wanted geno traded then instead of staal...I believe staals game would have continued to trend up playing for DB...and the haul for geno would have been amazing. Easier to have traded him then than now. Cant do much about it all now. But even if you keep staal and geno...you then move on from tanger. ..he isnt worth that cap hit...and he had a lot of value coming off a noris nom. Ive always maintained we need to move a big piece to fix things...staal wasnt a big piece.

Fine, but you have to pony up for him


hes playing with Crosby at the worlds too
- DDM-Coga

So, now, you are asking us to pony up for a third line center making 6 million that becomes a ufa after next season and is nothing more than money whore. If he doesn't get what he wants, he bails to the KHL? This is one of the easiest passes there is. I have zero desire to see ROR and his negotiating tactics anywhere near here. Makes zero sense.

Semin at 3.5 can't be that much worse than Sutter at 3.3...he may find that playing with Malkin ignites his motivation, which could make him extremely dangerous. Even better would be if CAR bought him out and PIT was able to get him at 2.5 or so...but I wouldn't complain at 3.5. It sounds as he could be had for next to nothing anyway, so why not try Sutter+low/mid-level prospect for Semin (@3.5)+2nd rnd pick (#35) or even a 3rd (#66)+4th(#93)? I think that's a low-risk, high reward scenario. I'm not crazy about Sharp - cap hit sucks and he's a bit injury prone.

As for FA, I like Stafford or Frolik if we don't overpay. I'm not too keen on Tlusty as I think he's too soft and not quite to the talent level we want to acquire. I would really like to see Condra and perhaps Belesky...(assuming Dupuis isn't back). I really like Petry as a #3/4 though, I think he could be had for less than $5mil/per, maybe 4.5ish.

Perron - Crosby - Hornquist
Semin - Malkin - Frolik
Bennett - Spaling - Kunitz
Condra - Sunquist - Winnik

Letang - Maatta
Pouliot - Petry
Demoulin - Cole
Chorney/Harrington

So, now, you are asking us to pony up for a third line center that becomes a ugh after next season and is nothing more than money whore and if he doesn't get what he wants, he bails to the KHL? This is one of the easiest passes there is. I have zero desire to see ROR and his negotiating tactics anywhere near here.
- Oneonta Penguin

You clearly dont know much about ROR, the avs, and im going to assume Western Teams if you think hes a 3rd line C. Hes not bailing for the KHL, hes going to get paid either by the Avs or another team that trades for him. Guy is a legit complete Top 6 player the brings one of the better 2 way games in the league either at C or on the Wing.

Plus you dont have much to trade for him anyways

What would you have offered for Seguin back when the Stars dealt for him? Probably nothing close to the package Dallas gave up....now you wouldn't get Seguin for Malkin straight up. High risk high reward.
- rangerdanger94

Seguin already had a 29goal 67point season on his resume when he was traded. There wasn't alot a risk involved in trading for him. I don't know how you can compare him to Yakapov.?

The question ... are you proposing Sharp for Harrington or Dumo straight up? Pittsburgh can't do that. Adding Sutter to that mix, I'd want Chicago to add.
- Oneonta Penguin

I guess it depends what Chicago wants. They don't need another center with toews, tuevo, shaw, and Kruger. I'd say dumo and our 2nd to get the ball rolling, but that's not going to happen with the 2nd round pick being all we have.

But I wanted geno traded then instead of staal...I believe staals game would have continued to trend up playing for DB...and the haul for geno would have been amazing. Easier to have traded him then than now. Cant do much about it all now. But even if you keep staal and geno...you then move on from tanger. ..he isnt worth that cap hit...and he had a lot of value coming off a noris nom. Ive always maintained we need to move a big piece to fix things...staal wasnt a big piece.
- taleisyreXIII

I won't disagree with you. Malkin's value isn't as high as it was two years ago. I'm still not sold that Staal would have been the answer at 2C, but we would have a more complete, more balanced roster of talent if that had happened.

Tanger needed to be sent packing two years ago. His trade value has plummeted.

You clearly dont know much about ROR, the avs, and im going to assume Western Teams if you think hes a 3rd line C. Hes not bailing for the KHL, hes going to get paid either by the Avs or another team that trades for him. Guy is a legit complete Top 6 player the brings one of the better 2 way games in the league either at C or on the Wing.

Plus you dont have much to trade for him anyways
- DDM-Coga

Id love ROR on the pens. A change for him could be just what he needs to really blast off. He is solid and is always all over the scorecard. Id pick apart the avs if I could get my hands on some of their young players.

You clearly dont know much about ROR, the avs, and im going to assume Western Teams if you think hes a 3rd line C. Hes not bailing for the KHL, hes going to get paid either by the Avs or another team that trades for him. Guy is a legit complete Top 6 player the brings one of the better 2 way games in the league either at C or on the Wing.

Plus you dont have much to trade for him anyways
- DDM-Coga

I don't know why everyone bashes him. His salary holdout gave him a bad rep, but the guy is a dark horse selke nominee every year. He's incredibly versatile as well. Use him on the wing at first, but if Malkin or Sid are injured you can move him to center to dampen the loss

Id love ROR on the pens. A change for him could be just what he needs to really blast off. He is solid and is always all over the scorecard. Id pick apart the avs if I could get my hands on some of their young players.
- taleisyreXIII

He wont be cheap but Sakic and Roy said they are going to try and resign him this summer but wont let this drag into next season, they dont want to have another Stastny situation of will he stay or will he go throughout next season.

Either he is signed long term or he will be on another teams roster by open game 2016, based on what they have said in the media a few weeks ago

You clearly dont know much about ROR, the avs, and im going to assume Western Teams if you think hes a 3rd line C. Hes not bailing for the KHL, hes going to get paid either by the Avs or another team that trades for him. Guy is a legit complete Top 6 player the brings one of the better 2 way games in the league either at C or on the Wing.

Plus you dont have much to trade for him anyways
- DDM-Coga

I graduated from the University of Denver. Yep, I don't know anything about the Avs. I know all I need to know about ROR.

And, you bring up us ponying up major assets for a guy that is due to make 6 million and bolt after one year? Yep, you don't know me as a poster at all. That doesn't fly with me. Then again, you are talking about an organization willing to give up prime assets for a one year rental, which ROR is.

Again, I pass. Not worth it. People who think its worth it, I question.

Vrbata with Sid or Geno is a legit threat for 35+ goals

Dude can snipe. Probably comes cheaper than young top 6 forwards that are under contract past next year.

5M cap hit.
- Nucker101

I actually agree with this.. Vrbata is a solid player as long as he's not on a long term deal.

I won't disagree with you. Malkin's value isn't as high as it was two years ago. I'm still not sold that Staal would have been the answer at 2C, but we would have a more complete, more balanced roster of talent if that had happened.

Tanger needed to be sent packing two years ago. His trade value has plummeted.
- Oneonta Penguin

Yup...I wanted tanger traded instead of re-upped...but who am I really. Where he is now though was predictable. ..he in injury prone..always has been. He had massive appeal league wide when we cut him a huge paycheck. Staal was also offered too much..and got over paid. But even at 6mil as a second center. I could live with it. Also if u had traded tanger at peak...you clearly are getting a solid center at least plus a few youngsters.

So, now, you are asking us to pony up for a third line center making 6 million that becomes a ufa after next season and is nothing more than money whore. If he doesn't get what he wants, he bails to the KHL? This is one of the easiest passes there is. I have zero desire to see ROR and his negotiating tactics anywhere near here. Makes zero sense.
- Oneonta Penguin

I dont agree with you on, well, anything, but this. ROR is at best a second liner and he will lineup for a 6+ million dollar payday. Not worth it.

I don't know why everyone bashes him. His salary holdout gave him a bad rep, but the guy is a dark horse selke nominee every year. He's incredibly versatile as well. Use him on the wing at first, but if Malkin or Sid are injured you can move him to center to dampen the loss
- drummer829

I dont even fault him for holding out, it was coming out of the lock out and there were a bunch of RFA forwards who did all the say thing, refused to sign until a CBA is done. Stepan, Benn being the other 2 bigger names in that group.

They signed and ROR didnt want to do the bridge deal that Dutch did, he wanted the long term deal of 5x5m like Benn. Old avs management refused to budge too. It was just 2 stubborn parties not using common sense.

This current contract he didn't hold out, team elected arbitration, they negotiated until the arb date, and got a contract done.

I don't know why everyone bashes him. His salary holdout gave him a bad rep, but the guy is a dark horse selke nominee every year. He's incredibly versatile as well. Use him on the wing at first, but if Malkin or Sid are injured you can move him to center to dampen the loss
- drummer829

He is a UFA after this year. Trading the assets it would take isn't worth it. He is a one year rental. We don't have the assets it would take. He is a very good player. I know full well what you get out of him. Plays a solid two-way game. Make a deal for him, you set our franchise back a decade once he walks.

I won't disagree with you. Malkin's value isn't as high as it was two years ago. I'm still not sold that Staal would have been the answer at 2C, but we would have a more complete, more balanced roster of talent if that had happened.

Tanger needed to be sent packing two years ago. His trade value has plummeted.
- Oneonta Penguin

And back to not agreeing!! All is right in the world again.

As for blog...

Id take semin for geno at 3mil..ish

Id never take sharpe for anything...too much about locker room cancer worries me. Last thing this teams needs is more of that crap.

I won't disagree with you. Malkin's value isn't as high as it was two years ago. I'm still not sold that Staal would have been the answer at 2C, but we would have a more complete, more balanced roster of talent if that had happened.

Tanger needed to be sent packing two years ago. His trade value has plummeted.
- Oneonta Penguin

By far the biggest problem this team has had is injuries and Staal is every bit as injury prone as Letang and Malkin. Trading him was a good decision, and I even think Sutter sucks and I'm still glad they made that trade.

Carolina retaining just 2.5-2 million is good enough as long as the assett being moved is minimal. If they simply would trade him and eat 2.5 mill for just a 5th or a pair of 5th rounders, I make that move.

Semin is a great talent who I would love to see here, just nowhere near the 7 mill current tag.

Sharp... We would have to take on full salary so no thanks.

He is a UFA after this year. Trading the assets it would take isn't worth it. He is a one year rental. We don't have the assets it would take. He is a very good player. I know full well what you get out of him. Plays a solid two-way game. Make a deal for him, you set our franchise back a decade once he walks.
- Oneonta Penguin

I'm all for going after him in free agency next year. Truth is we don't have the assets to obtain him unless it's a kapanen and pouliot deal. And I'd say eff that.

And back to not agreeing!! All is right in the world again.
- usethe1-2-2

There is nothing I typed that is wrong. It's fact. The fact you disagree means you are deluded.

I graduated from the University of Denver. Yep, I don't know anything about the Avs. I know all I need to know about ROR.

And, you bring up us ponying up major assets for a guy that is due to make 6 million and bolt after one year? Yep, you don't know me as a poster at all. That doesn't fly with me. Then again, you are talking about an organization willing to give up prime assets for a one year rental, which ROR is.

Again, I pass. Not worth it. People who think its worth it, I question.
- Oneonta Penguin

and look at what teams gave up for older 1 year rentals for Top 6 Cs in Spezza and Kesler.

1st rounder, Young Top 9 forward, and a good prospect. Thats the going rate. So yes you would have to pony up to get him, thats the price of doing business for Top 6 Cs. You will probably arguee that Spezz and Kesler are better, sure offensively but ROR is always near the top in selke consideration, has a respectable offensive game to him as well, 4-5 years young than those guys when they were traded, and hasnt even enter those prime years for a forward being 23. You could sign him to a 7 year contract and he comes out of it at 31.

As for blog...

Id take semin for geno at 3mil..ish

Id never take sharpe for anything...too much about locker room cancer worries me. Last thing this teams needs is more of that crap.
- taleisyreXIII

Lowest AAV for Semin would be 3.5

[quote=mventres]Semin at 3.5 can't be that much worse than Sutter at 3.3...he may find that playing with Malkin ignites his motivation, which could make him extremely dangerous. Even better would be if CAR bought him out and PIT was able to get him at 2.5 or so...but I wouldn't complain at 3.5. It sounds as he could be had for next to nothing anyway, so why not try Sutter+low/mid-level prospect for Semin (@3.5)+2nd rnd pick (#35) or even a 3rd (#66)+4th(#93)? I think that's a low-risk, high reward scenario. I'm not crazy about Sharp - cap hit sucks and he's a bit injury prone.

Semin can still play but he needs a severe attitude adjustment. He quickly got in Peters doghouse when he came into camp extremely out of shape and never really gained the coaches trust back. He had his best success in Carolina playing on a line with E. Staal and Tlusty. That one year of performance on that line got him the contract he has. He has been seemingly disinterested since. Most in Carolina would welcome his departure.