Why not? The 2nd is more likely than not to be a bust anyway...seems worth the risk...
- mventres

They're a rebuilding team, trading away Semin with 50% and their 2nd rounder, which is basically a late first in this deep draft (35th), for Sutter doesn't do really anything for them unless they feel like Sutter would be a long term fix. Still don't see them doing this. Maybe a third rounder but who knows

Is this Ray Shero? Is this the justification that went through your head when making deadline deals?
- jfkst1

Well, I'm not saying a team should trade all the picks away either. More picks=higher chance to find a good player...it's not a guarantee, by any means.

Is this Ray Shero? Is this the justification that went through your head when making deadline deals?
- jfkst1

How was the Borts/Cole trade a bad one for the Blues?

There are a couple others that could also be discussed because of the scenarios at the time, but oh well. Let's just look at the Borts/Cole trade.

I am very happy so far with it on the Blues side, so explain how it was a bad deal for us.
- carcus

Bortuzzo is nothing more than a bottom pairing defeseman. Nothing against that, but that's what he is. Cole has shown signs of being a top 4 guy, and played well in the role at the end of last season when the Pens were crushed with injuries on the blue line. Not saying he is going to be a 1st pairing guy, but he could well become a solid 2nd pairing guy as soon as this year. His ceiling is higher than Bortuzzo.

No, but the 42 in 65 then the 19 in 57 is a big decline in the last 2 years. He has been trending downwards, and as he is getting older, the chances he trends back upwards are slim.
- cap1681

42 in 65 is 53 over a full season, which is basically where he was when he left the Capitals. Last season was ugly, but it looks a lot more like an anomaly than it does an indicator of decline.

They're a rebuilding team, trading away Semin with 50% and their 2nd rounder, which is basically a late first in this deep draft (35th), for Sutter doesn't do really anything for them unless they feel like Sutter would be a long term fix. Still don't see them doing this. Maybe a third rounder but who knows
- BourbonCounty

Thing is, Semin's *contract* is so extremely toxic that this is really the only type of deal any team will make with CAR.

This is why I think trading Sutter for Semin (@3.5/yr and getting a 2nd round pick back as well) is worth it.
- mventres

Canes wouldn't do it.

How was the Borts/Cole trade a bad one for the Blues?

There are a couple others that could also be discussed because of the scenarios at the time, but oh well. Let's just look at the Borts/Cole trade.

I am very happy so far with it on the Blues side, so explain how it was a bad deal for us.
- carcus

Just because you misused Cole and prevented him from reaching his first round worthy ceiling while on the other hand Borruzzo is doing his job in an appropriate roll as a 7th d with grit doesn't mean it was a fair trade. I can understand wanting to move on with Cole due to your blue line make up but trading him for Bortuzzo was asinine. You could have gotten a lot more, so thank you.

Thing is, Semin's *contract* is so extremely toxic that this is really the only type of deal any team will make with CAR.
- mventres

Then they'll keep him, because it would be stupid to trade away the player AND retain salary AND trade away a pick for a mediocre at best 3rd liner.

Canes wouldn't do it.
- BINGO!

Why not? The alternative is to keep paying Semin $7mil/year and hope you hit on a prospect that turns out to be more productive than Sutter...which is VERY doubtful.

42 in 65 is 53 over a full season, which is basically where he was when he left the Capitals. Last season was ugly, but it looks a lot more like an anomaly than it does an indicator of decline.
- BINGO!

Yeah, but 44 in 44 is 82 over a full season. To go from 82 to 53 to 27 (last year adjusted for full season) is a big decline over a 2 year period.

Just because you misused Despres and prevented him from reaching his first round worthy ceiling while on the other hand Lovejoy is doing his job in an appropriate roll as a 5th d with experience doesn't mean it was a fair trade. I can understand wanting to move on with Despres due to your blue line make up but trading him for Lovejoy was asinine. You could have gotten a lot more, so thank you.
- Victoro311

Fixed it for you so it can be forwarded to Rutherford from ANA.

The dude has issues all over the place and you continue to make excuses. The fact people remain interested in getting this bum is mind boggling. Its foolish.

Again, for you ... why did Washington go year to year with him and not extend him to a long term contract? I will wait for your answer.
- Oneonta Penguin

Has issues all over the place?

There have been no criticisms of his work ethic coming out of Carolina. By all accounts his teammates like him a lot. This is absurd, unverifiable drivel.

Why not? The alternative is to keep paying Semin $7mil/year and hope you hit on a prospect that turns out to be more productive than Sutter...which is VERY doubtful.
- mventres

Because it is a stupid trade for Carolina and everyone knows it. You're an embarrassment to your country.

Fixed it for you so it can be forwarded to Rutherford.
- jfkst1

I was thinking that while I was typing it...

Has issues all over the place?

There have been no criticisms of his work ethic coming out of Carolina. By all accounts his teammates like him a lot. This is absurd, unverifiable drivel.
- BINGO!

I'm sure he'll provide evidence of these work ethic issues right after he posts his general fanager roster.

Yeah, but 44 in 44 is 82 over a full season. To go from 82 to 53 to 27 (last year adjusted for full season) is a big decline over a 2 year period.
- cap1681

Sure, but he also had a significant wrist injury in that time that required surgery.

Thing is, Semin's *contract* is so extremely toxic that this is really the only type of deal any team will make with CAR.
- mventres

They can find a better deal where they don't have to give up a pick. I mean, they'd be getting Sutter... Easily can find a better deal with just retaining salary. If I were them I'd move him for a pick or hold onto him for another year (or at least until the deadline) and hope he improves his value. They aren't competing for a few years, so why give up a pick that could help by the time Semin's deal is up?

Sure, but he also had a significant wrist injury in that time that required surgery.
- BINGO!

A significant wrist injury is scary for a guy who makes his living as a sniper. His wrist could never be what it was before that.

Because it is a stupid trade for Carolina and everyone knows it. You're an embarrassment to your country.
- jfkst1

How is it stupid?

If you could flip sutter for Ellis you do it. Opens up a lot of scenarios including trading Ellis.
- dbell646

Ellis would be a great pickup, I think I mentioned Sutter for Ellis a few weeks ago. Ellis is very talented and would probably be their best option as a PP quarterback. Perfect fit for that second pairing right side role.

A lot would need to happen but if they got Ellis and resigned Martin, they could trade away Pouliot for an elite winger and still have a fantastic D core. Not saying they should do it, because I really like Pouliot but it is an option.

Martin-Letang
Maata-Ellis
Cole-Lovejoy/Dumolin

Why not? The alternative is to keep paying Semin $7mil/year and hope you hit on a prospect that turns out to be more productive than Sutter...which is VERY doubtful.
- mventres

I'd rather pay Semin his money and have him be a 30 point guy the rest of his career than trade away a 2nd rounder AND retain salary just to add a 30 point per year player in Sutter.

A significant wrist injury is scary for a guy who makes his living as a sniper. His wrist could never be what it was before that.
- cap1681

And that's the risk, right?

That's essentially what changed everything. Can he shoot the puck like he did before? He's supposed to be staying and training with the Staal's this year instead of going home to Russia. Can he rehab enough to get back to a respectable level or is he damaged goods?

Nobody within the organization has questioned his character, as far as we know, so it all seems to come down to his health.

And that's the risk, right?

That's essentially what changed everything. Can he shoot the puck like he did before? He's supposed to be staying and training with the Staal's this year instead of going home to Russia. Can he rehab enough to get back to a respectable level or is he damaged goods?

Nobody within the organization has questioned his character, as far as we know, so it all seems to come down to his health.
- BINGO!

Honest question, what would the Canes be looking for to move him. Obviously, they would need to retain some salary. Just want to gauge.

I'd rather pay Semin his money and have him be a 30 point guy the rest of his career than trade away a 2nd rounder AND retain salary just to add a 30 point per year player in Sutter.
- BINGO!

Ding ding ding. BINGO! We have a winner