he has absolutely earned that contract. going from what 1.8mm per to 4.2 is a steal. I am actually shocked he didn't triple his salary. I mean he does have the hardest starts in all of hockey, plays with lousy wingers, and even shut down malkin 4 years ago.
- rinaldo

Your username is rinaldo.

i remember handzus being stronger on the puck than couturier. Also he wreaked more havoc in the crease if memory serves me well.

Do you mean me?

I have no problem with his contract. At worst, he's a shutdown center. And yes, I do think he has room to grow and will provide more offense than he has to date, albeit less production than some of you are projecting. Time will tell.

I think in general his problems are confidence and mind-set related so if things fall the right way he could blossom a bit. I think there is a also a chance he struggles offensively, puts more pressure on himself to focus on his strength, the defensive side of the ice, and gets pigeonholed into a role. Remember Ian Laperriere put up even more points in the Q and ended up as a 3rd shutdown kind of guy.

Either way, as long as his defensive game doesn't fall off the map, which is extremely unlikely, then it's a fair contract for both the player and the team.

My concern is more around roster construction, whether there would be enough offense with G-Couts-Laughton down the middle, and whether the lack of secondary scoring puts more pressure on G. You could even argue that with a more bonafide 3rd option at Center that would help Couturier on the offensive side because he would not feel as much pressure to score and could relax and the let his game develop a bit.

I think that's a pretty fair perspective.
- TheGreat28

No, you're far too intelligent and understand hockey too well to have a problem with his contract.

Your username is rinaldo.
- jmatchett383

your user name is jmatchett383

i remember handzus being stronger on the puck than couturier. Also he wreaked more havoc in the crease if memory serves me well.
- JoeRussomanno

Couturier does have to learn to use his size better. Much like JvR, if he tries to be a perimeter player and try to finesse everything, he won't have much success. Driving the net, working the corners, and playing a much power-oriented game will be to his benefit.

your user name is jmatchett383
- rinaldo

Yes...Was jmatchett383 one of the most horrible hockey players in recent memory?

I LIKE WHEN TEH FLYERZ DO TEH FITZE!

Yes...Was jmatchett383 one of the most horrible hockey players in recent memory?

I LIKE WHEN TEH FLYERZ DO TEH FITZE!
- jmatchett383

if I had to guess I would bet he wasn't any good at hockey. ice, roller, or ball hockey. probably didn't play baseball and was average at soccer.

Do you mean me?

I have no problem with his contract. At worst, he's a shutdown center. And yes, I do think he has room to grow and will provide more offense than he has to date, albeit less production than some of you are projecting. Time will tell.

I think in general his problems are confidence and mind-set related so if things fall the right way he could blossom a bit. I think there is a also a chance he struggles offensively, puts more pressure on himself to focus on his strength, the defensive side of the ice, and gets pigeonholed into a role. Remember Ian Laperriere put up even more points in the Q and ended up as a 3rd shutdown kind of guy.

Either way, as long as his defensive game doesn't fall off the map, which is extremely unlikely, then it's a fair contract for both the player and the team.

My concern is more around roster construction, whether there would be enough offense with G-Couts-Laughton down the middle, and whether the lack of secondary scoring puts more pressure on G. You could even argue that with a more bonafide 3rd option at Center that would help Couturier on the offensive side because he would not feel as much pressure to score and could relax and the let his game develop a bit.

I think that's a pretty fair perspective.
- TheGreat28

Looking at the top 6 forwards, what kind of offensive production do you think is needed out of each of the 6 forwards to be a good team?

I realize this may be hard to believe. luke schenn is a legit nhl dman. manning is not.
- rinaldo

Bryce Salvador is a legit NHL dman ... maybe we should sign him too so Manning can be an AHL all-star again. Same with Hagg ... he isn't a "legit NHL damn." Why even waste the time and effort developing him, right?

Agreed. I'd really like to see him back on the right side. Him, Simmonds, and Voracek are ideally who I have on the right side in the top 9. However, where does that put Gagner? Do we have him play center? Do we try him at LW?
- mochoson

Imo if Gagner is going to want to stay a flyer after this year he is going to have play lw. C and RW is full up and lw is a huge hole in the lineup and in the farm. I really hope he can make the change and thrive because he could really help this team. He's talented and young and even if he has an awesome season I can't see him getting more than 4 million contract renewal.

Bryce Salvador is a legit NHL dman ... maybe we should sign him too so Manning can be an AHL all-star again. Same with Hagg ... he isn't a "legit NHL damn." Why even waste the time and effort developing him, right?
- SeaIslelandLush

no they don't needBryce.

Hagg is a prospect. manning is not. do you not know the difference between the 2 in that aspect? who said it is wasting time and effort. manning wont pan out as an nhl everyday dman. it wasn't a waste of time or effort.

I realize this may be hard to believe. luke schenn is a legit nhl dman. manning is not.
- rinaldo

Agree.

As much as it is frustrating you would want to see Schenn get time and hopefully get consistent.

Manning is nothing more then a 6-7 type dman i feel.

[quote=J35Bacher]Agree.

As much as it is frustrating you would want to see Schenn get time and hopefully get consistent.

Manning is nothing more then a 6-7 type dman
Manning hasn't really ever been given a legit shot. But I don't see him as a top 4 either.

no they don't needBryce.

Hagg is a prospect. manning is not. do you not know the difference between the 2 in that aspect? who said it is wasting time and effort. manning wont pan out as an nhl everyday dman. it wasn't a waste of time or effort.
- rinaldo

Also Salvadore is what, mid 30's?

Luke is still relatively young and if manning had such great attributes he would have been making more of a case for an NHL roster spot.

[quote=J35Bacher]Agree.

As much as it is frustrating you would want to see Schenn get time and hopefully get consistent.

Manning is nothing more then a 6-7 type dman
Manning hasn't really ever been given a legit shot. But I don't see him as a top 4 either.
- 28Girouxsalem28

maybe he hasn't been given a shot (which is funny anyway as it is a crock) is because the powers that be don't think he can is that good. they don't see him as a top 6 guy. if they did they wouldn't have signed carlo last year imo.

Bryce Salvador is a legit NHL dman ... maybe we should sign him too so Manning can be an AHL all-star again. Same with Hagg ... he isn't a "legit NHL damn." Why even waste the time and effort developing him, right?
- SeaIslelandLush

If Manning develops enough as a defenseman, he will get his shot. This is the same argument that has been used over and over for players such as Gustaffsson, Lauridsen, etc.

[quote=J35Bacher]Agree.

As much as it is frustrating you would want to see Schenn get time and hopefully get consistent.

Manning is nothing more then a 6-7 type dman
Manning hasn't really ever been given a legit shot. But I don't see him as a top 4 either.
- 28Girouxsalem28

What's "given a shot" mean.

I hear it all the time. If a player has NHL attributes he will get an NHL job. Guys like Manning usually end up career AHL defensman who get some spot duty in the NHL.

I feel Manning is more a danny syvret, john slaney. Good to all-star AHL defenseman, but just a spot player in the NHL.

If Manning develops enough as a defenseman, he will get his shot. This is the same argument that has been used over and over for players such as Gustaffsson, Lauridsen, etc.
- MJL

but they were not given a chance.

yes you are correct by the way.

if I had to guess I would bet he wasn't any good at hockey. ice, roller, or ball hockey. probably didn't play baseball and was average at soccer.
- rinaldo

your username is rinaldo...how can I take anything you say seriously?

Looking at the top 6 forwards, what kind of offensive production do you think is needed out of each of the 6 forwards to be a good team?
- MJL

Giroux and Jake: Combine for 55-60 goals, 90-100 assists
Raffl: 25 goals, 20 assists
Couturier: 20 goals, 35 assists
Read: 25 gaols, 20 assists
Simmonds: 30 goals, 20 assists

your username is rinaldo...how can I take anything you say seriously?
- jmatchett383

your user name is jmatchett383 how can I take anything you say serious? plus your from or reside in mantua nj for Gods sake.

If Manning develops enough as a defenseman, he will get his shot. This is the same argument that has been used over and over for players such as Gustaffsson, Lauridsen, etc.
- MJL

Just thinking of something, but aren't Manning and Schenn both 25? So if people think Manning can keep developing how comes Schenn can't?

What's "given a shot" mean.

I hear it all the time. If a player has NHL attributes he will get an NHL job. Guys like Manning usually end up career AHL defensman who get some spot duty in the NHL.

I feel Manning is more a danny syvret, john slaney. Good to all-star AHL defenseman, but just a spot player in the NHL.
- J35Bacher

He's played a grand total of 21 games over 3 years, which some people think is enough to determine that he's an everyday NHL defenseman. To me, he hasn't done enough or played enough to warrant that. He hasn't exactly played badly, but he hasn't done anything to show me that he brings something to the NHL more than other 7/8 defenders like the guys you've mentioned.

Part of the issue is that the Flyers have had a full lineup of "veterans" in front of him during his tenure here. And now with guys like Ghost/Hagg/Morin and even Alt in the picture, those prospects may be ahead of him. To me, he has to stake a claim to a job during this training camp and make it impossible for them to send him down if he wants a full-time job. Otherwise, he'll likely be a very good AHL defenseman for the bulk of his career.

your user name is jmatchett383 how can I take anything you say serious? plus your from or reside in mantua nj for Gods sake.
- rinaldo

Who cares what you say?

Just thinking of something, but aren't Manning and Schenn both 25? So if people think Manning can keep developing how comes Schenn can't?
- J35Bacher

Because hate and expectations.

But really, it's unlikely that either suddenly undergo some transformation and become exceptionally better than what they are right now. If Luke Schenn was making Manning's money, people wouldn't have as much of an issue with him.