I knew Crosby and Malkin bumped up production, but damn I didn't know it was that much. I figure Kessel will finish with 30-40 goals and 65-75 points. I think Kessel's center (87/71) will be the real beneficiary as teams won't be able to focus strictly on them like in year's past. I could see Crosby going for 90+ points this year with Kessel.
- jfkst1

If they both stay healthy, I see Sid breaking 100 pts with Phil not far behind.

My one fear is that with Kessel on Crosby's line, Crosby will defer too much and shoot even less than he has been lately.

Crosby needs to shoot more, to show that threat and to open things up. Especially on the power play.

My one fear is that with Kessel on Crosby's line, Crosby will defer too much and shoot even less than he has been lately.

Crosby needs to shoot more, to show that threat and to open things up. Especially on the power play.
- hardnosed

At least if he is going to defer, its going to be to one of the best shots on the planet.
I think Crosby benefits the most from the Kessel deal. The book on Crosby has been 2 guys to him, reduce his time and space and remove his shooting lanes, force him to give the puck up to a less dangerous player. Kessel may be the more dangerous player in the offensive zone, teams absolutely can not employ this strategy anymore. I really think the ice is going to open up for Sid and he is going to have more time and space than maybe any other time in his career.

Honestly, If you think about the pp and think about who is going to shoot you don't have a clue. I feel sorry for the goalies, sort of. Who will shoot?
Kessel? Sid? Geno? Who the f*ck knows?
So that is the biggest advantage on the pp.

Even strength is a lot more complicated but, Kessel has speed and a hard as sh*t shot so he has to be respected. He may pot a few more even strength but I think the magic trio and whomever else is on the pp will get more points on the season and put that in stone.

It's not like he will be out there taking every shot with his line even strength. To me the pp will get more goals, period. By whomever. I really don't care. I can see the defense scoring on the pp more as well. Everyone will focus on the magic trio. Then, The backdoor Whitney play. Boom.

One last thing, everyone seems to think he is perfect for Sid but to be honest when I look at it I see a better match with Malkin. Call it a hunch but I see their styles as more complementary.

Honestly, If you think about the pp and think about who is going to shoot you don't have a clue. I feel sorry for the goalies, sort of. Who will shoot? Kessel? Sid? Geno? Who the f*ck knows? So that is the biggest advantage on the pp.

Even strength is a lot more complicated but, Kessel has speed and a hard as sh*t shot so he has to be respected. He may pot a few more even strength but I think the magic trio and whomever else is on the pp will get more points on the season and put that in stone.

It's not like he will be out there taking every shot with his line even strength. To me the pp will get more goals, period. By whomever. I really don't care. I can see the defense scoring on the pp more as well. Everyone will focus on the magic trio. Then, The backdoor Whitney play. Boom.

One last thing, everyone seems to think he is perfect for Sid but to be honest when I look at it I see a better match with Malkin. Call it a hunch but I see their styles as more complementary.
- powerhouse

I think the concern comes from them refusing to shoot the puck on the PP the second half of the year. When it was really successful early on, they were throwing everything at the net, scoring some nice goals, but also getting a lot of garbage goals. In the 2nd half, it seemed like everyone on the ice had to touch the puck twice before they would even think about shooting. And in order for it to count, they had to make a perfect pass between at least two defenders before shooting. That's one of the things I'm most excited about with Kessel, he loves to throw tons of shots at the net.

I think the concern comes from them refusing to shoot the puck on the PP the second half of the year. When it was really successful early on, they were throwing everything at the net, scoring some nice goals, but also getting a lot of garbage goals. In the 2nd half, it seemed like everyone on the ice had to touch the puck twice before they would even think about shooting. And in order for it to count, they had to make a perfect pass between at least two defenders before shooting. That's one of the things I'm most excited about with Kessel, he loves to throw tons of shots at the net.
- mw630

And aligning with that refusal to shoot, teams started backing off of Crosby, flooding the passing lanes. So because of a reluctance to shoot, pulling off the picture perfect pass was made more difficult.

It's just like basketball. If you never take the jumper, the defender will back off to take away the drive. It's why even Jordan had to work to improve his outside shot.

Where does Malkin play on the PP? The point with Crosby and Kessel on opposite boards. Plot/Kunitz/Horn being net front presence?

I could make a case it makes sense to put Malkin on the second power play though I doubt that happens. I just feel like role wise there's enough shooters on the first PP.

Maybe you dump Letang to PP2 so you have a puck carrier on that line.

Kessel and Malkin should be around the 40 g range and should be able to beat that. 87 should be 30+ easy, PH flirting with 30. Thats 4 players that can break 30 and Perron and Kuni with 20+. Not many teams can do that. And if BB has a break out yr, he will hit 5.

Kessel and Malkin should be around the 40 g range and should be able to beat that. 87 should be 30+ easy, PH flirting with 30. Thats 4 players that can break 30 and Perron and Kuni with 20+. Not many teams can do that. And if BB has a break out yr, he will hit 5.
- sammy87

Very few teams can confidently say their roster should have four 25+ goal scorers (Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Hornqvist). And if Bennett can hit 5 goals and 15-20 points on the 4th line that means the Pens have a much deeper lineup than most teams.

45

numbers, numbers, numbers.


for fun someone should do the numbers of past great players before they layed with one another. like hull and oates, hull and zezel, hull and gretzky. that way we can judge more readily the potential truth of these projections.

Like a few Leafs fans said - Kessel is an elite playmaker with great vision.

Some of this number crunching makes no sense. Kessel is going to have more 5 on 5 ice time on the Penguins. NO WAY! For Pens fans I sure hope not. Offensive starts - when you need goals, you put Kessel on the ice. But he will NEVER backcheck or dig in the corners. EVER. Pittsburgh has way more quality up front than the Leafs - so Kessel should in fact get less ice.

30g, 55a, 85p. -20

Like a few Leafs fans said - Kessel is an elite playmaker with great vision.

Some of this number crunching makes no sense. Kessel is going to have more 5 on 5 ice time on the Penguins. NO WAY! For Pens fans I sure hope not. Offensive starts - when you need goals, you put Kessel on the ice. But he will NEVER backcheck or dig in the corners. EVER. Pittsburgh has way more quality up front than the Leafs - so Kessel should in fact get less ice.

30g, 55a, 85p. -20
- Allan Bester

There's no way he'll be a minus player playing with Crosby.

As a Leafs fan I've watched Phil Kessel play hundreds of games now, many live. As people have stated, and as I have witnessed, Kessel has become an amazing playmaker, and with Crosby's vision it should be a scary good year for both. If Crosby stays healthy I can see see both hitting 100 points. Kessel around 50 and 50, Crosby around 40 and 60 helpers

How do you quantify what effect quality of teammates or linesmates will have on any given player? Every player is effected differently by those factors, some players are more comfortable being the lead dog and playing with lesser complementary players as linemates, while others excel being that complementary player and feed off of playing with better players.

For all the talk about how great Sid & Kessel will be because they are both so skilled, very few people acknowledge the possibility that even though they are both extremely skilled there's the chance that they will be water & oil on the ice and playing together will actually hurt both players production. The same could be true from Kessel/Malkin. The fact of the matter is that people can use all the projectable data they want but until we actually see them together in live action none of us can possibly know if adding Kessel was a good or bad move.

That's exactly my point

I find these stats to not make any sense... predicting Kessel at .5 points a game is what I am reading... which is "an improvement"... but that would give him only 41 points.


Am i completely missing something, or were those statistics not presented properly?


Here is what I am going look at.. Crosby + 36.1% increase in points for a linemate on average. Malkin +25.5%.

If we go just off of last year, Kessel would get 83 points and 34 goals with Crosby based on that, his worst season since his first two years in the NHL.

If we go off of one of his three seasons at 35+ goals, (taking 35 instead of 36 or 37), we can assume 47.6 goals.

If we're generous and put his point mark at 80 (an 80 and 82 point season previously), we can assume 108.8 points with Crosby.


Lets face it, he has the potential to break 100 points and push for 50 goals with Crosby and this team. I don't need the level of breakdown in this article past what Crosby or Malkin do to their linemates. He is going to get more and better offensive zone starts, and with better Dmen and a better powerplay. If we are not betting on 40+ goals from him, we are scared.


And of course, cannot forget he is 1 point shy of being a point per game player in the post season, 21 points in 22 games.

Play Kessel with Bonino and roll 3 offensively terrifying lines.

Perron Crosby Hornquvist
Plotnikov Malkin Kunitz
Kessel Bonino Bennett
- belcherbd

Dupuis Bonino Kessel

I wonder how that line would look. I have a weird feeling that Dupuis and Kessel would work well together. From the little I know about Bonino it seems like he could do well centering that line, although maybe they'd be too weak defensively. Or,

Dupuis Crosby Kessel

If Crosby and Kessel develop good chemistry, Dupuis could be their ideal linemate. Get open, go the net, bury your chances--Dupuis is (er, was) good at that. He would probably find himself with a lot of open ice and lovely passes coming his way. I don't like Kunitz or Perron there as much because both seemed to have an excess of trouble burying their chances later on last year. But maybe Dupuis shouldn't be asked to play top line minutes. IDK. Really, it all comes down to where there's chemistry.

having seen kessel play his years in TO, i can guarantee, without no injury, he will break 40 goals with crosby.

In Toronto MOST of his goals were by him, alone. He'd drive the net, or receive a long pass, he'd gun it, and he'd snipe it. With a 3rd line quality center.

The better under-rated part of Kessel isnt scoring, shockingly. Because its sexy, everyone looks at his highlight goals.

Its his playmaking ability. He's one of the top player in the league when it comes to making plays out of nothing. He doesnt deke. Its 100% speed and 100% puck-on-tape passes.

Toronto had JVR to capitalize on that. You'll be seeing JVR's numbers drop this season considerably. Missing Kessel's passing, is going to be the main reason.

Unfortunately Bozak has stone hands and couldnt capitalize well on Kessel passing anything to him, so eventually he stopped passing it to C when they were in the offensive zone because Bozak's shooting is average on a good day. He'd always look for JVR.

With Crosby at C, he wont have to go across the ice for someone to finish a play properly.

One last thing is that his last year in Toronto was an aberration. More specifically, the last 40 games. Thats when 100% of the team stopped playing.

You wanna see him play at "ok" levels, count his previous years and disregard the poop-show that happened last year in Toronto with the coaching, management and so forth.

If he has a comeback year, and I'm willing to put money on it that he'll wanna prove himself, he'll pot 40 goals easy. One thing no one will expect is having his assists go up tremendously with Crosby being the beneficiary.

His good years in Toronto, he was around 37 goals and 43 assists, playing with a 3rd line center.

He'd have to break a leg at training camp for him not to break 40 goals and 50 assists with Crosby at center, if they're both healthy (Kessel will be, its Crosby im not sure of).

I find these stats to not make any sense... predicting Kessel at .5 points a game is what I am reading... which is "an improvement"... but that would give him only 41 points.


Am i completely missing something, or were those statistics not presented properly?


Here is what I am going look at.. Crosby + 36.1% increase in points for a linemate on average. Malkin +25.5%.

If we go just off of last year, Kessel would get 83 points and 34 goals with Crosby based on that, his worst season since his first two years in the NHL.

If we go off of one of his three seasons at 35+ goals, (taking 35 instead of 36 or 37), we can assume 47.6 goals.

If we're generous and put his point mark at 80 (an 80 and 82 point season previously), we can assume 108.8 points with Crosby.


Lets face it, he has the potential to break 100 points and push for 50 goals with Crosby and this team. I don't need the level of breakdown in this article past what Crosby or Malkin do to their linemates. He is going to get more and better offensive zone starts, and with better Dmen and a better powerplay. If we are not betting on 40+ goals from him, we are scared.


And of course, cannot forget he is 1 point shy of being a point per game player in the post season, 21 points in 22 games.
- Guile

They're just using ES scoring. So 40-45 ES points and then probably 20+ PP points.

They're just using ES scoring. So 40-45 ES points and then probably 20+ PP points.
- jfkst1

Ummm... that would give him 60-65 points total? That's a really low expectation, isn't it?

If they both stay healthy, I see Sid breaking 100 pts with Phil not far behind.
- haymac

I'm going to say 40-45 goals 90 pts. Kessel is a very underrated playmaker. One of his biggest issues (offensively) in Toronto was people not burying chances he gave them. He passes almost as hard as he shoots and they're accurate but the only problem is not many people even in the NHL can handle them. Crosby is the perfect fit and will benefit from a lot of rocket cross crease passes for tap ins.

Also that powerplay is going to be scary good. Crosby likes to set up in the corner and Kessel likes to set up on the half boards on the opposite side. Players will have to stay tight on Kessel or he'll just walk off the boards and snipe one, which will open up either Crosby back door or one of the big shots from the point. They just need to throw someone in front of the net with decent hands to rack up the garbage goals.

I'm going to say 40-45 goals 90 pts. Kessel is a very underrated playmaker. One of his biggest issues (offensively) in Toronto was people not burying chances he gave them. He passes almost as hard as he shoots and they're accurate but the only problem is not many people even in the NHL can handle them. Crosby is the perfect fit and will benefit from a lot of rocket cross crease passes for tap ins.

Also that powerplay is going to be scary good. Crosby likes to set up in the corner and Kessel likes to set up on the half boards on the opposite side. Players will have to stay tight on Kessel or he'll just walk off the boards and snipe one, which will open up either Crosby back door or one of the big shots from the point. They just need to throw someone in front of the net with decent hands to rack up the garbage goals.
- HealthyScratch6

We got a handful of people who like to dry hump the net! Horny, Perron, Kunitz, Dupes, possibly Plot since hes being labelled as a Russian Hornqvuist.

And aligning with that refusal to shoot, teams started backing off of Crosby, flooding the passing lanes. So because of a reluctance to shoot, pulling off the picture perfect pass was made more difficult.

It's just like basketball. If you never take the jumper, the defender will back off to take away the drive. It's why even Jordan had to work to improve his outside shot.
- hardnosed

I think it was after the first Jets game when the PP starting heading south. The Jets played a rushing pressure D against our PP & we basically poop the bed. After that point other teams followed suit by pressuring the player & hence the new 'passing PP' was born. I think it will take a month or 2 before teams work our PP out again but hopefully this season we have a plan B & plan C!

I'm going to say 40-45 goals 90 pts. Kessel is a very underrated playmaker. One of his biggest issues (offensively) in Toronto was people not burying chances he gave them. He passes almost as hard as he shoots and they're accurate but the only problem is not many people even in the NHL can handle them. Crosby is the perfect fit and will benefit from a lot of rocket cross crease passes for tap ins.

Also that powerplay is going to be scary good. Crosby likes to set up in the corner and Kessel likes to set up on the half boards on the opposite side. Players will have to stay tight on Kessel or he'll just walk off the boards and snipe one, which will open up either Crosby back door or one of the big shots from the point. They just need to throw someone in front of the net with decent hands to rack up the garbage goals.
- HealthyScratch6

I agree the PP will be the biggest improvement with the magic trio and anyone of them able to get it on net with accuracy. The defense too will be challenged to keep up with their passing. I see crisp passing and a lethal PP.

Im gunna say 50 goals and a +/- of -40