I'm an Ehlers fanboy as well but it has been fun watching Virtanen light guys up. Jake was the safe pick though and while I would preferred him taking a risk on a higher upside it is hard to fault Benning for playing it safe with his first draft.

If we end up with another top 10 pick I will be a lot more upset if he doesn't go after elite talent.
- belcherbd

Fair statement

A forth line of Dorsett/Vey/JV could provide a good forecheck with some skill. You could rely on the 3rd line for defensive responsibilities.
I guess it depends on what you expect from the 4th.
- dbot

Oh I agree, its all what we think they are looking for.

Fair statement
- VANTEL

With the exception of the hawks. The best playoff team over the past decade are built around Virtanens style. Not ehlers.

Yet every study done shows that drafting higher point producers leads to better drafting rather than trying to find these "late bloomers". Going against the odds isn't smart. Especially for forwards.
- Nucker101

Here's where I disagree, points are deceptive, because players (like a Dane Fox) can produce on stacked teams and some leagues/teams are worse than others. Also players who are 'scorers' in junior can have a much harder time adjusting to the speed and physicality of the NHL than players who aren't.

That said, I agree that the odds are BETTER when you draft high point producing forwards, but it's not exact and when you're dealing with 17-18 year olds who aren't finished growing physically and maturing mentally you're hoping they pan out.

I've said this before, I really believe the draft age should be raised 19 or 20 and players who are drafted at that age should be allowed to go to the AHL instead either having to stick with the NHL club or go back to Junior for the year. You'd find that you'd get a lot more NHL-ready players and get them developed faster that way.

Higgins and Hansen will fight and hit more then Prust or dorsett as well I bet. And are much younger then Vey. Vet is older then Higgins because benning made the trade for him I guess
- Bieksa#3

If the goal is to win then on a team without 2 legit scoring lines, you can't afford to bench better players for grit. Vey is young but got worse as he year went on last year, it's not like he progressed like Horvat. He's struggling without his boy Toffoli.

Yet he was way more impressive in junior than JV was last year. I'll take that sample size over pond hockey anyday.

Both are fine prospects but Ehlers has more upside.
- Nucker101

Ask McDavid if he thought JVs hit was pond hockey

With the exception of the hawks. The best playoff team over the past decade are built around Virtanens style. Not ehlers.
- Bieksa#3

Every cup winner has elite offensive talent. Look at Chris Kreider on NY, they'd be in trouble if he was a go-to guy but he's just a secondary scorer and thrives in that role.

If the goal is to win then on a team without 2 legit scoring lines, you can't afford to bench better players for grit. Vey is young but got worse as he year went on last year, it's not like he progressed like Horvat. He's struggling without his boy Toffoli.
- Nucker101

So he burned out.... You know Virtanen got cold at the end of the yr. Better give up on him too. If only benning could see things your way, eh?

Every cup winner has elite offensive talent. Look at Chris Kreider on NY, they'd be in trouble if he was a go-to guy but he's just a secondary scorer and thrives in that role.
- Nucker101

He's a bell of a lot more physical the Ehlers

Ask McDavid if he thought JVs hit was pond hockey
- VANTEL

The defense, structure and lack of chemistry was. You can take 3 exhibition games as your sample size, I'll take full season of junior.

I've said this before, I really believe the draft age should be raised 19 or 20 and players who are drafted at that age should be allowed to go to the AHL instead either having to stick with the NHL club or go back to Junior for the year. You'd find that you'd get a lot more NHL-ready players and get them developed faster that way.
- DariusKnight

Cue the birth of the NBA-style one-and-done NCAA hockey programs!!

Of course, it's a much different scenario compared to NBA...drafting 18 yo players had always been rare in the NBA...the league put in the age limit because they wanted to curb the increasing trend of drafting highschool players who then flame out quickly from the physicality of the NBA due to the lack of a minors or "major junior" system in place.

So he burned out.... You know Virtanen got cold at the end of the yr. Better give up on him too. If only benning could see things your way, eh?
- Bieksa#3

What in Vey's game makes you think he'll be a good NHL player? It's funny that people want a grittier bottom 6 yet defend him. He has tweener written all over him. He'll be lucky to have a Mason Raymond career.

Man, what's this place gonna look like once the season starts?!

Never mind that...once the pre-season starts?!?!

He's a bell of a lot more physical the Ehlers
- Bieksa#3

Of course. But if Ehlers turn out to be flat out better then it doesn't matter. He out produced JV badly last year even if you factor in the leagues they played in.

I think it's realistic to project Virtanen to end up like Chris Kreider.

The defense, structure and lack of chemistry was. You can take 3 exhibition games as your sample size, I'll take full season of junior.
- Nucker101

You watched how many of Ehlers Q games last yr? I'm not asking what stats did you read.
Perhaps you did watch a lot of games. Just don't tell me how good a guy is from highlights and voxscores

Of course. But if Ehlers turn out to be flat out better then it doesn't matter. He out produced JV badly last year even if you factor in the leagues they played in.

I think it's realistic to project Virtanen to end up like Chris Kreider.
- Nucker101

"if"

Now you're getting g it.

You watched how many of Ehlers Q games last yr? I'm not asking what stats did you read.
Perhaps you did watch a lot of games. Just don't tell me how good a guy is from highlights and voxscores
- Bieksa#3

I read plenty from people who've watched both play many games.


It's clear that anything anti-Canuck I'll say here is going to be written off so why continue this conversation? If someone made a good argument that made me really re-think my position besides using buzzwords I'd definitely be open to it.

Over at HF there was a poster who showed that JV's even strength production per 60 mins played was pretty strong but his PP production was lacking.

I read plenty from people who've watched both play many games.
- Nucker101

So you have no opinion? You're just passing off somebody else's?

So you have no opinion? You're just passing off somebody else's?
- Bieksa#3

Not a single person. And not from fanboys or haters, just he unbiased people who watch junior hockey.


Okay, since I don't watch the CHL I'll never comment on a junior player again.

The defense, structure and lack of chemistry was. You can take 3 exhibition games as your sample size, I'll take full season of junior.
- Nucker101

I never once said I like Vey. I said he will be on the team over Hansen or higgins

I never once said I like Vey. I said he will be on the team over Hansen or higgins
- Bieksa#3

WD like all coaches likes two-way veteran players. Benning would have to force him to bench those 2. And I gotta think that sooner or later WD is going to want to coach his own team so it can only be done if you trade both.

Unless WD really wants to tank, he won't sit them in favour of Vey or some rookie.

With the exception of the hawks. The best playoff team over the past decade are built around Virtanens style. Not ehlers.
- Bieksa#3

Yup. I think Ehlers is a hell of a player. Canucks needed Grit.

They had two top 10 players last year but didn't have an answer to hitting and toughness. A third highly skilled player would not change the fact that we were manhandled. We needed grit first and foremost. Now we go after skill

Not a single person. And not from fanboys or haters, just he unbiased people who watch junior hockey.


Okay, since I don't watch the CHL I'll never comment on a junior player again.
- Nucker101

Don't pout. Your passing your comments off as the end all of be all. Im not expecting you to watch half of his games but don't tell me how much better your gut is then somebody else's guy just because you read the boxscore. Christ this isnt the edm thread

Of course their not perfect but the bugger problem has always been EDM's horrible depth. So many of the players that were once regulars in their lineup over the last 5 years aren't even in the league anymore.
- Nucker101

Flagged.

The defense, structure and lack of chemistry was. You can take 3 exhibition games as your sample size, I'll take full season of junior.
- Nucker101

You mean playing against kids? Didn't Hodgson have a great Jr. career. NHL is a mans game