Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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suicide hotline must have been ringing off the hook last night, look at all this Debbie downer poop. You guys actually, honestly thought we would be improved out of the gate? Get real. if they're not showing improvement over the course of the year then maybe I'll freak out.
This is exactly what I expected, and what all of you should have expected. This poop takes time. Mclellan and Chirali aren't going to just change this (frank)ing time over the summer.
Relax - SpoiledByOil
the way theyre losing games and the direction we're headed again has me concerned that not only is that main core broken as a group, but another season of bottom feeding will definitely do so.
I think they need to make tangible steps forward NOW
even super human athletes with their mental fortitudes that are unlike the rest of us weak humans can understand, are gonna be affected after 6 years of losing
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SpoiledByOil
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Edmonton, AB Joined: 08.09.2012
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No he actually does it quite often simply by someone disagreeing with him. The clear alternative has been stated over, and over, even if you have been unable or unwilling to see it. Can't remember who said it, but it was very true when they said the same posters just like to stroke each other around here. Condescension, stubbornness and annoyance are great descriptions of him as well. Good on ya for seeing that. - leonkennedy
you know who said, this bumhole right here
*stroke stroke* |
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SpoiledByOil
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Edmonton, AB Joined: 08.09.2012
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the way theyre losing games and the direction we're headed again has me concerned that not only is that main core broken as a group, but another season of bottom feeding will definitely do so.
I think they need to make tangible steps forward NOW
even super human athletes with their mental fortitudes that are unlike the rest of us weak humans can understand, are gonna be affected after 6 years of losing - Ihateallofu
It's been 10 games and we've been in, and capable of winning all of them but 2. Mclellan has been the coach for 10 games, Chiarlli has been the GM for 10 games. If we expected anything more than moderate improvement this year, and a chance for the GM and Coach to assess the team and the players. Then i'm sorry, but you were expecting too much. IMO |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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It's been 10 games and we've been in, and capable of winning all of them but 2. Mclellan has been the coach for 10 games, Chiarlli has been the GM for 10 games. If we expected anything more than moderate improvement this year, and a chance for the GM and Coach to assess the team and the players. Then i'm sorry, but you were expecting too much. IMO - SpoiledByOil
if the bar is this low, that we're in assessment stages in year 6 of a rebuild- we should probably go in another direction through some of the core.
its not about the team winning just cause pc is the gm. how could it? he really didn't do anything different to improve us. (he hit the nail on the head with Talbot-but that was more of the same that coulda went the same way as scrivens and fasth-just got lucky) but I felt it was important that our main guys start pulling out wins and getting points in the standings regardless who was gm. we're seeing the same results as last year over and over. except we have connor and Talbot now. which is great and at least giving us a chance.
as I said-moral victories aren't enough-and I think if we had the bar so low that we were ok with bottom feeding for another year-id say theres a good chance that nuge-hall-Schultz, evens ebs are probably ruined as a group and we need to focus on connor/nurse/leon as the core and go in a different direction.
we've both seen those teams that just perpetually lose and its not until the group is completely changed that the culture of losing can be eradicated.
and I never even suggested blowing it completely up already-but id hope if we're once again nosediving to the bottom, fundamentally unable to win around game 20- I absolutely hope pc steps in and makes a foundation shifting move in attempts to get this group to experience some success.
while some of you think im over exaggerating the years and years of losses, I think youre underestimating them. |
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SpoiledByOil
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Edmonton, AB Joined: 08.09.2012
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if the bar is this low, that we're in assessment stages in year 6 of a rebuild- we should probably go in another direction through some of the core.
its not about the team winning just cause pc is the gm. how could it? he really didn't do anything different to improve us. (he hit the nail on the head with Talbot-but that was more of the same that coulda went the same way as scrivens and fasth-just got lucky) but I felt it was important that our main guys start pulling out wins and getting points in the standings regardless who was gm.
as I said-moral victories aren't enough-and I think if we had the bar so low that we were ok with bottom feeding for another year-id say theres a good chance that nuge-hall-Schultz, evens ebs are probably ruined as a group and we need to focus on connor/nurse/leon as the core and go in a different direction.
ve both seen those teams that just perpetually lose and its not until the group is completely changed that the culture of losing can be eradicated
and I never even suggested blowing it completely up already-but id hope if we're once again nosediving to the bottom, fundamentally unable to win around game 20- I absolutely hope pc steps in and makes a foundation shifting move in attempts to get this group to experience some success.
while some of you think im over exaggerating the losses, I think youre underestimating them - Ihateallofu
If these kids are going to be "ruined" by losing, then they would have a seriously weak mind and sense of self worth, and should probably seek out therapy. But I don't believe that, not even for a second, they want to win and will always want to win.
I'm confident that Chiralli will use this year to see what he has, see what's available and assess our players market value, then he will make a legitimately BOLD move that we have been promised for years. Will it be a good move? who knows, but i'm confident he will do it to shake things up.
But honestly, you're reading wayyyyy too much into it if you think this poop is going to ruin them and somehow turn them into bad hockey players. |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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If these kids are going to be "ruined" by losing, then they would a seriously weak mind and sense of self worth, and should probably seek out therapy. But I don't believe that, not even for a second, they want to win and will always want to win.
I'm confident that Chiralli will use this year to see what he has, see what's available and assess our players market value, then he will make a legitimately BOLD move that we have been promised for years. Will it be a good move? who knows, but i'm confident he will do it to shake things up.
But honestly, you're reading wayyyyy too much into it if you think this poop is going to ruin them and somehow turn them into bad hockey players. - SpoiledByOil
of course they WANT to win. who doesn't?
some players just cant get it done. and how could ones confidence NOT be shaken after 6 years of being on one of the worst squads in the nhl?
the oilers are the butt of the jokes of the nhl. we both know that.
do you think theyre completely immune to that? or unaware how bad they've been? hall made that twitter joke when we won the lottery something to the effect of "be sure not to ruin what weve been building here connor"
or do you think its just a coincidence that these experienced teams continue to score late and pull these games out against us?
confidence gets shaken. its natural. it has nothing to do with being weak minded. where did we get this idea that athletes are somehow on a different level than the rest of us mentally? theyre just people who are prone to the same emotional high and lows and we are. imo, in many cases theyre actually more fragile than us, cause their performance levels depend so much on their confidence levels. and theyre the ones actually going through it on a more visceral level.
youre not human if you can just shake off another dismal early season start after 6 years of bottom feeding like its nothing. we're not talkin just a few setbacks. we're talking all time levels of futility.
guys get on hot streaks and cold streaks. do you think that has nothing to do with confidence? its just all totally coincidence?
and I didn't mean its going to turn them into bad hockey players. theyre elite talents. I just meant as a group its possible that they cant get it done. and the further losses and disappointments after years of it isn't helping and only making it that much more diffucult to turn the corner.
in another situation, im sure they can achieve success.
put nuge on the preds and id bet hed be absolutely dominant.
as far as PC-im confident he will too.
all im saying is that I hope he attempts to do so before we're in a position where we're staring another lottery pick in the face
maybe I am reading too much into it. but ive been concerned about this for a long time now as ive seen it happen to other teams. how you have to learn to win in this league.
and all I keep seeing is these same setbacks, and predictable outcomes year after year against teams that have learned those skills. if this was year 1, 2, or 3 im not too worried and understand its a process. hell, even year 4 I put down to other issues. but as we pass game 10 in year 6 with no tangible changes....... |
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maybe I am reading too much into it. but ive been concerned about this for a long time now as ive seen it happen to other teams. how you have to learn to win in this league.
and all I keep seeing is these same setbacks, and predictable outcomes year after year against teams that have learned those skills. if this was year 1, 2, or 3 im not too worried and understand its a process. hell, even year 4 I put down to other issues. but as we pass game 10 in year 6 with no tangible changes....... - Ihateallofu
I can understand where you are coming from with this point of view but another way to look at it is this is really year 1 of the rebuild with a real Coach and GM. If you look at other pro sports, its all about the system. This is put in place by the coach and staff as the plan to win and either as a player you buy into it or you aren't part of it. For the past X amount of years we never had that. New coaches each year who seemed to never really have a plan\system in place or one that would not work at the NHL level. I honestly think some where mandated to just try to get something going that works for the young stars we have and not focus on a winning system for the team.
We now have a coach with proven NHL experience with a plan and ready to put that plan in place, no matter what players he currently has. This year is definitely an evaluation for Todd and PC. They will be seeing who fits in the system and who doesn't and the ones who don't more than likely will be gone next year.
As frustrating the last 2 games were in terms of we could have walked away with wins, their are signs of improvement that maybe our record doesn't show. I really think it took us until game 5 to really start playing as a team and with chemistry. I think Nerves, new players, new coach\system all had something to do with it and if I just look at the last 6 games we are 500.
Unfortunately injuries are taking a bit of a toll as well. And I know before you mentioned that shouldn't be an excuse because good teams overcome that. Unfortunately I must admit, looking at the last bunch of years, we aren't a good team. We don't have the quality depth and experience some other teams have to overcome multiple injuries. So yes it will affect us.
And as much as I think we have a better defense group than we have had in a couple of years, there are a lot of new faces. Out of the 9 Dmen listed on our active roster only 4 played regularly last year. As well out of those 9, 4 of them would have rookie or sophomore status. So almost half of our D core is still learning to play at the NHL level and pretty much everyone has to work on communication with a new D partner. Factor in new goalies and the communication our D need to develop with them, well it will be a process.
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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I can understand where you are coming from with this point of view but another way to look at it is this is really year 1 of the rebuild with a real Coach and GM. If you look at other pro sports, its all about the system. This is put in place by the coach and staff as the plan to win and either as a player you buy into it or you aren't part of it. For the past X amount of years we never had that. New coaches each year who seemed to never really have a plan\system in place or one that would not work at the NHL level. I honestly think some where mandated to just try to get something going that works for the young stars we have and not focus on a winning system for the team.
We now have a coach with proven NHL experience with a plan and ready to put that plan in place, no matter what players he currently has. This year is definitely an evaluation for Todd and PC. They will be seeing who fits in the system and who doesn't and the ones who don't more than likely will be gone next year.
As frustrating the last 2 games were in terms of we could have walked away with wins, their are signs of improvement that maybe our record doesn't show. I really think it took us until game 5 to really start playing as a team and with chemistry. I think Nerves, new players, new coach\system all had something to do with it and if I just look at the last 6 games we are 500.
Unfortunately injuries are taking a bit of a toll as well. And I know before you mentioned that shouldn't be an excuse because good teams overcome that. Unfortunately I must admit, looking at the last bunch of years, we aren't a good team. We don't have the quality depth and experience some other teams have to overcome multiple injuries. So yes it will affect us.
And as much as I think we have a better defense group than we have had in a couple of years, there are a lot of new faces. Out of the 9 Dmen listed on our active roster only 4 played regularly last year. As well out of those 9, 4 of them would have rookie or sophomore status. So almost half of our D core is still learning to play at the NHL level and pretty much everyone has to work on communication with a new D partner. Factor in new goalies and the communication our D need to develop with them, well it will be a process. - EastCoastOiler
good post
as ive said- im mostly just concerned its too late for that main group. and that they were set up to fail from the beginning and because of that might not be able to turn the corner together as a group.
but its easy to say we should be pulling those games out, when I actually knew full well how many holes we had. I suppose theres something to be said about it being real instead of just assuming in the summer that we're gonna struggle again. which I whole heartedly predicted.
but I did hope that we'd at least be able to play meaningful games into the new year. which is seemingly less likely. and I want to be clear that I feel expecting being tangibly competitive in year 6 of a rebuild shouldn't be asking too much
but honestly, I desperately want to be wrong about these contentions.
I think more can and should be done than to subject this group to another year of losing for evaluation purposes. but maybe it is year 1 and theres really no other alternative that can be taken, but wait.
I gotta say that im really surprised at how mellow everyone is over these results after the pitchforks sessions when Eakins and mact were at the helm...... |
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the way theyre losing games and the direction we're headed again has me concerned that not only is that main core broken as a group, but another season of bottom feeding will definitely do so.
I think they need to make tangible steps forward NOW
even super human athletes with their mental fortitudes that are unlike the rest of us weak humans can understand, are gonna be affected after 6 years of losing - Ihateallofu
Then we need to trade for a #1 dman now!!! |
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Then we need to trade for a #1 dman now!!! - Ihatebrianburke
We have the assets.... Just (frank)ing do it already. |
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nanook82
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: AB Joined: 03.25.2013
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Then we need to trade for a #1 dman now!!! - Ihatebrianburke
And who's available to make that trade? |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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Then we need to trade for a #1 dman now!!! - Ihatebrianburke
doubt theres any available yet. even quality top 4 guys.
I would say cbj might be interested in making a deal, but they want to upgrade their defence, (at least at the moment) so that doesn't help us much
Anaheim maybe as they struggle to score, are expected to win and have a few young guys considered top 4. lindholm and despres are interesting, but id be surprised if either of those guys are on the block
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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And who's available to make that trade? - nanook82
beat me to it |
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nanook82
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: AB Joined: 03.25.2013
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beat me to it - Ihateallofu
Hate to say it but, L. Schenn is probably the only dman that could be had right now…. like today |
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We have the assets.... Just (frank)ing do it already. - stiches187
No poop eh? We've needed one for so long it's pathetic really.
I'd try Fayne + 2016 1st + conditional pick for Dustin Byfuglien. The conditional pick can even be a 2017 1st if he resigns here. I don't give a (frank). We don't need a bunch more 1st rounders that might turn out in 3-5 years. We need guys who can play and win now! |
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We have the assets.... Just (frank)ing do it already. - stiches187
It seems PC is as bold as MacT... |
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nanook82
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: AB Joined: 03.25.2013
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No poop eh? We've needed one for so long it's pathetic really.
I'd try Fayne + 2016 1st + conditional pick for Dustin Byfuglien. The conditional pick can even be a 2017 1st if he resigns here. I don't give a (frank). We don't need a bunch more 1st rounders that might turn out in 3-5 years. We need guys who can play and win now! - Ihatebrianburke
NTC….. Edmonton would have to be on the list |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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And who's available to make that trade? - nanook82
I was pretty interested in the idea of chara for obvious pc connections when I assumed the bruins were gonna tank.
id pay that salary going forward regardless that hes on the back 9 of his career. vet that easily makes our top 4 still and could do a ton for us
problem is that hes got an ntc.
and boston isn't playing nearly as bad as many thought. which isn't all that surprising considering the quality vet experience they still have |
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And who's available to make that trade? - nanook82
There's always somebody if you're willing to pay up. We're gonna have to eventually anyway. We have nobody in our system that's considered a top 4 guy that has a right handed shot. So we're not gonna grow one internally. We're gonna have to go out and get somebody or we're just straight up gonna be stuck with a right side consisting of Jultz, Fayne, and Gryba. All of which are 3rd pairing defenders if you ask me. |
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NTC….. Edmonton would have to be on the list - nanook82
You can always try. He might be willing to come play with Connor. Who knows. Edmonton is at least a step up citywise from Winnipeg. |
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I was pretty interested in the idea of chara for obvious pc connections when I assumed the bruins were gonna tank.
id pay that salary going forward regardless that hes on the back 9 of his career. vet that easily makes our top 4 still and could do a ton for us
problem is that hes got an ntc.
and boston isn't playing nearly as bad as many thought. which isn't all that surprising considering the quality vet experience they still have - Ihateallofu
That's yet another left shot guy to add to the cluster(frank) we already have back there. |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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NTC….. Edmonton would have to be on the list - nanook82
is that right? even in the last year of a deal?
buff sure would be nice to have on the squad. every game I watch he absolutely wrecks shop. hes literally is too big and powerful to be fuked with. he just throws his body around at will with no retribution. that's what I really love about him. but hes also pretty much elite offensively. I happily take his defensive miscues in favour of all those qualities
either way, if I was Winnipeg id say fuk it and risk him walking for nothing instead of dealing him..
theyre a contender imo. and with a move for a goalie and maybe another center, theyre elite imo. |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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That's yet another left shot guy to add to the cluster(frank) we already have back there. - Ihatebrianburke
depending on the price, I don't worry about that.
he could do so much for us.
and u got him signed for a couple years.
face value, id certainly rather buff. but id be worried at the package theyd want and then him just walking on us |
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ystoil
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Edmonton Joined: 02.26.2011
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I think the reality of the situation is the blue line we have now is the one we will have for the year
I'm all for moving the 1st + 2nd this year to help and even moving Schultz or Fayne but it's unlikely to happen.
If we could orchestrate a big trade to replace Eberle and Fayne/Schultz + picks to get a big right winger and a mobile right dman, I'm all for it.
Also an upgrade on Lander would be ideal |
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Ihateallofu
Edmonton Oilers |
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Location: Meh Joined: 11.09.2014
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the bruins are gonna be like the canucks for the next couple years I bet.
every year their demise is predicted and every year theyre better than people think.
theyre nowhere near the squads they used to be, but they still have those vets up front and on the backend that just know how to fuking win in this league
the canucks are really frustrating cause I hate them, but theyre way better than people think. the sedins, edler, hamhuis (is sooo underrated), miller etc just flat out aint washed up. theyre still damn good |
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