I know these charts are frowned upon here but notice 4 atlantic div teams in the "bad/lucky" section. We may have a real shot here

I know these charts are frowned upon here but notice 4 atlantic div teams in the "bad/lucky" section. We may have a real shot here


- Sabresfan-365

****frowns****

I know these charts are frowned upon here but notice 4 atlantic div teams in the "bad/lucky" section. We may have a real shot here


- Sabresfan-365

thats what I don't get about some of this analytics stuff, end of the day you can craft it to be very subjective to the authors own agenda.

The same metrics that label the Avs Bad and Lucky, you could argue that they are actually very unlucky with the fact that when matt duchene is on the ice, the team was shooting 1.5 shooting percentage. Is that bad or unlucky. those numbers are now starting to correct themselves and the team is shooting much better with him on the ice.

I can never take it as gospel, but its always interesting to see the data presented

****frowns****
- Der Kaiser

Yea but it's good

I'd move reinhart, only if we are getting a top lone winger though.

thats what I don't get about some of this analytics stuff, end of the day you can craft it to be very subjective to the authors own agenda.

The same metrics that label the Avs Bad and Lucky, you could argue that they are actually very unlucky with the fact that when matt duchene is on the ice, the team was shooting 1.5 shooting percentage. Is that bad or unlucky. those numbers are now starting to correct themselves and the team is shooting much better with him on the ice.

I can never take it as gospel, but its always interesting to see the data presented
- DDM-Coga

I'm guessing they'd view Duchene as unlucky, but team as whole maybe not so much.

I use this particular chart to basically understand our chances. With so many teams in our division in the wrong square here, it gives us a better shot than i originally thought.

Edit: Assuming it corrects itself, there will be a few teams that keep this up

thats what I don't get about some of this analytics stuff, end of the day you can craft it to be very subjective to the authors own agenda.

The same metrics that label the Avs Bad and Lucky, you could argue that they are actually very unlucky with the fact that when matt duchene is on the ice, the team was shooting 1.5 shooting percentage. Is that bad or unlucky. those numbers are now starting to correct themselves and the team is shooting much better with him on the ice.

I can never take it as gospel, but its always interesting to see the data presented
- DDM-Coga

The thing I hate about "advance stats" it's basically different versions of plus/minus, which most think is a useless stat.

I'm fine with advance stats to measure team performance, but I wouldn't look too much into it for individual player performance.

Yea but it's good
- Sabresfan-365

Why is the score adjusted by Stanley Cup Finals percentage?

It was does a "public display of offection" have to do with it.

I'm guessing they'd view Duchene as unlucky, but team as whole maybe not so much.

I use this particular chart to basically understand our chances. With so many teams in our division in the wrong square here, it gives us a better shot than i originally thought.

Edit: Assuming it corrects itself, there will be a few teams that keep this up
- Sabresfan-365

with his possession numbers, you could consider him mediocre. I like seeing the data, but sometimes I just can't buy into it all.

It was the Flames game that the Avs won 6-2 and had 40 some shots on net. They lost the possession battle even though the limited the flames to 20 some shots. So on paper and the fancy win probability chart,the Flames dictated the game even though the let up 6goals and 40 shots against. At no point would I would have said they were being dominated or were being lucky.

Its games like those that the die hard circle jerk number guys ignore when crafting their arguments

I'd move reinhart, only if we are getting a top lone winger though.
- Mentalorgasm5

With our center depth, Reinhart may already be that top line winger you want. Everyone just needs to give this kid some time, he's only 25 games into his career.

The thing I hate about "advance stats" it's basically different versions of plus/minus, which most think is a useless stat.

I'm fine with advance stats to measure team performance, but I wouldn't look too much into it for individual player performance.
- Mentalorgasm5

also face-off wins now, apparently to some it doesn't matter as much as we originally thought, since I saw some guys write articles about how face-off wins doesn't correlate directly to strong possession.

I don't care what anyone says, I want a lights out face-off guy, i don't want to post rationalize that a team not strong at the dot isn't that big of a deal

Why is the score adjusted by Stanley Cup Finals percentage?

It was does a "public display of offection" have to do with it.
- Der Kaiser

SCF%= scoring for percentage


PDO isn't actually an acronym it= sum of teams 5v5 sh% and Sv%

trade reinhart????
already?????
sweet jesus
i think i hate everyone

The thing I hate about "advance stats" it's basically different versions of plus/minus, which most think is a useless stat.

I'm fine with advance stats to measure team performance, but I wouldn't look too much into it for individual player performance.
- Mentalorgasm5

Depends on how you use them and what for. I only brought this chart up because we're 3 points out of a playoff spot. Basically just sizing up our competition and what our chances are this year.

thats what I don't get about some of this analytics stuff, end of the day you can craft it to be very subjective to the authors own agenda.

The same metrics that label the Avs Bad and Lucky, you could argue that they are actually very unlucky with the fact that when matt duchene is on the ice, the team was shooting 1.5 shooting percentage. Is that bad or unlucky. those numbers are now starting to correct themselves and the team is shooting much better with him on the ice.

I can never take it as gospel, but its always interesting to see the data presented
- DDM-Coga

The "Bad" would correlate to the team not generating scoring chances. The "unlucky" would correlate to Duchene just not having his shots hit the back of the net (low shooting percentage)

with his possession numbers, you could consider him mediocre. I like seeing the data, but sometimes I just can't buy into it all.

It was the Flames game that the Avs won 6-2 and had 40 some shots on net. They lost the possession battle even though the limited the flames to 20 some shots. So on paper and the fancy win probability chart,the Flames dictated the game even though the let up 6goals and 40 shots against. At no point would I would have said they were being dominated or were being lucky.

Its games like those that the die hard circle jerk number guys ignore when crafting their arguments
- DDM-Coga

How is he in his own end? The thing about those shot charts to is a lot of them include unblocked attempts to the net. Can be a bit misleading.

With our center depth, Reinhart may already be that top line winger you want. Everyone just needs to give this kid some time, he's only 25 games into his career.
- sskkoo1

The 25 games to me doesn't mean much. I am bias, as I was never a fan of reinhart, however, if you could use him to land a true top line winger, I do it. Just for the simple fact he "might" develop into that, whereas you are getting a know commodity.

And we look much better than I anticipated.

The thing I hate about "advance stats" it's basically different versions of plus/minus, which most think is a useless stat.

I'm fine with advance stats to measure team performance, but I wouldn't look too much into it for individual player performance.
- Mentalorgasm5

The whole point in using "shots on goal" or "total shots taken" is that is a MUCH larger sample size, which *usually* is a better indication of how a team is doing. For example, last night Tampa controlled much of the play, out shot us, and out attempted us. Except we won. Basically Foligno had a goal that shouldn't have gone in, we had an empty net, and CJ had an incredible save (normally a goal). You could easily look at this and say the game could have gone the other way and the stats would justify that

How is he in his own end? The thing about those shot charts to is a lot of them include unblocked attempts to the net. Can be a bit misleading.
- Sabresfan-365

positionally solid but with Roys new fetish of blocking shots by his Dmen, man does it create for some gross looking numbers for the team as a whole.

Im more inclined to ignore stat bashing against the Avs bc of Yost. I used to like him on this site, now that hes on TSN he just comes off as a pompous ass in his blogs

also face-off wins now, apparently to some it doesn't matter as much as we originally thought, since I saw some guys write articles about how face-off wins doesn't correlate directly to strong possession.

I don't care what anyone says, I want a lights out face-off guy, i don't want to post rationalize that a team not strong at the dot isn't that big of a deal
- DDM-Coga

Agreed. Winning a face off cleanly gains you direct control of possession. It's much easier to maintain possession, once you have it.

OReilly has been a monster, his power-play play has impressed for beyond anticipation.

SCF%= scoring for percentage


PDO isn't actually an acronym it= sum of teams 5v5 sh% and Sv%
- Sabresfan-365

And we're back to The Iliad.

positionally solid but with Roys new fetish of blocking shots by his Dmen, man does it create for some gross looking numbers for the team as a whole.

Im more inclined to ignore stat bashing against the Avs bc of Yost. I used to like him on this site, now that hes on TSN he just comes off as a pompous ass in his blogs
- DDM-Coga

Yea he was all over them post O'Reilly trade. There's no single stat that's all telling though. I think that's where the hate for it really comes from. That because player x is bad at this he is a bad player or vice versa. Can't really say that based on one metric

(see Doughty/Muzzin debate)

And we're back to The Iliad.
- Der Kaiser

*scoring chance for percentage, my bad. But im guessing that's not going to help

also face-off wins now, apparently to some it doesn't matter as much as we originally thought, since I saw some guys write articles about how face-off wins doesn't correlate directly to strong possession.

I don't care what anyone says, I want a lights out face-off guy, i don't want to post rationalize that a team not strong at the dot isn't that big of a deal
- DDM-Coga

Faceoffs are situational.

In the Vancouver game, I think the Sabres at one point were 75% on the dot, but getting out shot by 15.

Faceoffs are situational.

In the Vancouver game, I think the Sabres at one point were 75% on the dot, but getting out shot by 15.
- sbroads24

I get the logic behind but sometimes I want my dumb hockey back where you get excited about winning in face-offs and hits in a period and were more worried about getting back the momentum of the game