If Colorado is looking for grit and work ethic we don't make a good trade partner. Hornqvist has looked like a little baby out there. I hate when guys hack and wack and shove then do nothing either skate away or drop the gloves.

I took a break from this board for awhile because the doom and gloom dummies get on my nerves and I can't tell all of them off its just tedious. But here's an idea, WBS was down 5-1 in the first period and came back and won their 11th game in a row. How hard is it to study the tapes and find out why they are 11-1 this season and then reward them with big club time. If it's Sullivan, which I think it is, move him up to the big club because they are doing something right in WBS. It's not like that team is loaded with future NHL stars aside from Pouliot and Murray. Wilson is playing incredible hockey right now, get him up and send Plotnikov down. Pouliot is playing outstanding hockey get him up here and waive Scudz. The in house solutions first before you go trading Pouliot and Sprong(which is way too much btw, whoever said that is a terrible GM). Or just continue the flow of menstration that you always do in the same order. Repeat repeat b!tch b!tch
- dcoms77

I'm in for all of that!

Wilkes Barre Pens came back from a four goal deficit last night and are 12-1. Thinking about it the situation is eerily similar to when Therrien left and Bylsma moved up.

I took a break from this board for awhile because the doom and gloom dummies get on my nerves and I can't tell all of them off its just tedious. But here's an idea, WBS was down 5-1 in the first period and came back and won their 11th game in a row. How hard is it to study the tapes and find out why they are 11-1 this season and then reward them with big club time. If it's Sullivan, which I think it is, move him up to the big club because they are doing something right in WBS. It's not like that team is loaded with future NHL stars aside from Pouliot and Murray. Wilson is playing incredible hockey right now, get him up and send Plotnikov down. Pouliot is playing outstanding hockey get him up here and waive Scudz. The in house solutions first before you go trading Pouliot and Sprong(which is way too much btw, whoever said that is a terrible GM). Or just continue the flow of menstration that you always do in the same order. Repeat repeat b!tch b!tch
- dcoms77

I asked this the last time you mentioned Pouliot playing outstanding hockey and don't recall you ever answering so I'll ask again, how many WBS games have you actually watched? I ask because my guess is that you haven't seen any and are basing your opinion off of the scoresheet and bias. By all accounts from those that watch them on a nightly basis. even though Pouliot is racking up the points he is playing average hockey at best and isn't dominating as he should be at that level. Using that same rational there should be no way they bench Scuderi because with 4pts and +8 he's arguably the 2nd best defenseman on the Pens roster.

Also there is a HUGE difference between the AHL and the NHL, saying that an NHL team should be studying what an AHL team is doing is just plan lunacy. Hell The Mid State Mustangs have won back to back National Championships at the 18u Tier 2 level, maybe Pens management should take the trip to Altoona and study what they are doing. Or even better, Quaker Valley is right here in Pittsburgh and has been to 4-5 straight State Championships, they would even have to travel far to study what they are doing and I'm sure Kevin Quinn(who also coaches for their amateur program) would gladly except a spot on the staff to help out.

I took a break from this board for awhile because the doom and gloom dummies get on my nerves and I can't tell all of them off its just tedious. But here's an idea, WBS was down 5-1 in the first period and came back and won their 11th game in a row. How hard is it to study the tapes and find out why they are 11-1 this season and then reward them with big club time. If it's Sullivan, which I think it is, move him up to the big club because they are doing something right in WBS. It's not like that team is loaded with future NHL stars aside from Pouliot and Murray. Wilson is playing incredible hockey right now, get him up and send Plotnikov down. Pouliot is playing outstanding hockey get him up here and waive Scudz. The in house solutions first before you go trading Pouliot and Sprong(which is way too much btw, whoever said that is a terrible GM). Or just continue the flow of menstration that you always do in the same order. Repeat repeat b!tch b!tch
- dcoms77

Not to mention this weekend was a back to back to back Fri, Sat, and Sun. Home, Home, Away. No excuses like oh it was the second of a back to back like Pitt used a few games ago. AHL teams are a friggin bus league and WBS has I believe 6 or 7 back to back to backs all season and who knows how many back to back games. Sure it may not be NHL talent however it is still relative to talent and energy spent.

Not to mention this weekend was a back to back to back Fri, Sat, and Sun. Home, Home, Away. No excuses like oh it was the second of a back to back like Pitt used a few games ago. AHL teams are a friggin bus league and WBS has I believe 6 or 7 back to back to backs all season and who knows how many back to back games. Sure it may not be NHL talent however it is still relative to talent and energy spent.
- Reverend Killtaker

You watch a lot of their games. What style does the team play?

Not to mention this weekend was a back to back to back Fri, Sat, and Sun. Home, Home, Away. No excuses like oh it was the second of a back to back like Pitt used a few games ago. AHL teams are a friggin bus league and WBS has I believe 6 or 7 back to back to backs all season and who knows how many back to back games. Sure it may not be NHL talent however it is still relative to talent and energy spent.
- Reverend Killtaker

There is actually very little that is relevant between the AHL and the NHL, if they were that similar we would see an easier transition from guys that dominate at that level into the NHL as opposed to the opposite where many players that play well in the AHL never translate to the NHL.

There is actually very little that is relevant between the AHL and the NHL, if they were that similar we would see an easier transition from guys that dominate at that level into the NHL as opposed to the opposite where many players that play well in the AHL never translate to the NHL.
- jaydogg1974

Yeah thats not even what I said.

You watch a lot of their games. What style does the team play?
- jfkst1

They're supposed to play the exact same system as the big club. It was instituted years ago so the "call-ups" have a smooth transition. I don't think that's changed. Maybe it has.

Here's a thought... Maybe this system is a better fit for a lesser level of player. I mean, it's hard to argue that there's a ton of future stars down there.

You watch a lot of their games. What style does the team play?
- jfkst1

They replicate the same system as Pitt. Always have. With that said though however, and its hard having only seen the new coaching staff for their home games this season, the team plays very consistent never eratic. Their passing has vastly improved over the last couple of seasons which is amazing with the coaching staff change. Sullivan seems to have stepped in and hasn't changed much from Hynes's approach being that it was working to begin with. The team plays with a lot more confidence now and all have obviously bought into Sullivan as a coach. He seems to be very level headed unlike his buddy Torts, not afraid to speak up to the refs without blowing a gasket. He does well to make adjustments when needed and not in a panic, but most importantly he has seemed to create and atmosphere of if the chances arent there don't panic, they will come but be ready to seize the opportunity and don't force anything which has worked numerous times. They got rid of the extra unneeded passing which was prevalent under Hynes, but that was probably due to confidence issues which isn't the case anymore.

WBS isn't the most talented team in the AHL as far as raw talent goes, but there is a lot of experience, knowledge, work ethic, coachability, and developed skill that will bring success. Its really a coaches dream. Having key prospects in Murray, Jarry, Sundvquist, and Simon really helps as well along with veteran leadership in Kostopoulus.

With all that being said, my criticism is that the team hasn't struggled or lost much or have entered a down streak with injuries. There is no way to gauge their perseverance or the new staffs coaching ability in that regard, but the team is vastly superior to recent years which has seen them over perform and make long playoff runs with underwhelming talent.

They're supposed to play the exact same system as the big club. It was instituted years ago so the "call-ups" have a smooth transition. I don't think that's changed. Maybe it has.

Here's a thought... Maybe this system is a better fit for a lesser level of player. I mean, it's hard to argue that there's a ton of future stars down there.
- madmike71

I don't even know what system the Pens are supposed to be playing.

They're supposed to play the exact same system as the big club. It was instituted years ago so the "call-ups" have a smooth transition. I don't think that's changed. Maybe it has.

Here's a thought... Maybe this system is a better fit for a lesser level of player. I mean, it's hard to argue that there's a ton of future stars down there.
- madmike71

I won't argue if you are right or wrong, but I will say that the huge difference, and its probably because WBS is much more coachable than Pitt and I attribute that to how great of an AHL/Dev. coach that John Hynes was/is, is that the system works in WBS because the team has bought into the coaching staff seamlessly, they support him and he returns the favor. That eliminates a lot of the obstacles that HCMJ is experiencing in Pitt.

I don't even know what system the Pens are supposed to be playing.
- jfkst1

Me neither. I'm not a big x's and o's guy anyway. I will say what they're doing looks very uncomfortable. I don't believe so many of these talented players have fallen off the cliff in the middle of their primes.

It seems to me they're dumbing down the talent to play like a lot of other teams in the NHL and the players don't know how to do it. What I don't understand is they weren't nearly this "ugly" last year.

Me neither. I'm not a big x's and o's guy anyway. I will say what they're doing looks very uncomfortable. I don't believe so many of these talented players have fallen off the cliff in the middle of their primes.

It seems to me they're dumbing down the talent to play like a lot of other teams in the NHL and the players don't know how to do it. What I don't understand is they weren't nearly this "ugly" last year.
- madmike71

I find it hard to believe other teams know what the Pens are doing. The Pens themselves don't appear to know what they are doing. Team puck movement is nonexistent right now. They can't string together 4 consecutive passes to save their lives. Maybe they need Bylsma's system of stretch passing.

Very odd hearing that Colorado would be looking to move Duschene and/or Barrie. I wonder if something like Malkin & Scuderi for Duschene & Barrie would work? Would be hard to move Malkin but in a way I think the Pens need to get younger and cheaper.

I find it hard to believe other teams know what the Pens are doing. The Pens themselves don't appear to know what they are doing. Team puck movement is nonexistent right now. They can't string together 4 consecutive passes to save their lives. Maybe they need Bylsma's system of stretch passing.
- jfkst1

Ive been wondering if they became to accustomed to Byslma's system and the emphasis on the stretch passing which opened up the ice more and gave their elite ability the opportunity to shine. Now that it has been over simplified to a more defensive approach they feel stifled and claustrophobic. They seem to always make some ridiculous passes connect on the fly but when the game is slowed down and dependent on the transition, they don't seem comfortable making the moves needed.

The ability to adapt to me has always been their achilles heal. When we played the flyers in the playoffs, we couldn't adapt to what they threw at us. When injuries occurred they had a hard time adapting at times. When center ice is clogged, they don't adapt to that well. When the goalie is playing out of his mind and stopping all parameter shots, they don't adapt and charge the net instead. Thats a coaching issue as well as a player issue.

I find it hard to believe other teams know what the Pens are doing. The Pens themselves don't appear to know what they are doing. Team puck movement is nonexistent right now. They can't string together 4 consecutive passes to save their lives. Maybe they need Bylsma's system of stretch passing.
- jfkst1

They know what they should be doing, but they are so weak and afraid to get hit, not a single puck battle can be won. During the games against more physical teams like CBJ, just look how much time the Pens spend in the offensive zone? It's usually one chance and out. And then look at the other end. The opps teams spend easily 20-30 seconds of every shift in our zone. Our D can't move anyone in front of the crease - it's a miracle (or pure luck) that Flower and Zatkoff have been seeing the puck so well.

What Pens need is a hitting session. Their hits don't separate anyone from the puck.

Can't wait until they trade for Hainsey

Ive been wondering if they became to accustomed to Byslma's system and the emphasis on the stretch passing which opened up the ice more and gave their elite ability the opportunity to shine. Now that it has been over simplified to a more defensive approach they feel stifled and claustrophobic. They seem to always make some ridiculous passes connect on the fly but when the game is slowed down and dependent on the transition, they don't seem comfortable making the moves needed.

The ability to adapt to me has always been their achilles heal. When we played the flyers in the playoffs, we couldn't adapt to what they threw at us. When injuries occurred they had a hard time adapting at times. When center ice is clogged, they don't adapt to that well. When the goalie is playing out of his mind and stopping all parameter shots, they don't adapt and charge the net instead. Thats a coaching issue as well as a player issue.
- Reverend Killtaker

I agree with this entirely. Nobody ever had a problem with Bylsma's system in the regular season. But when the playoffs rolled around, he would be consistently out-coached. Zero ability or desire to adjust. DK has reported this extensively... The owners were really frustrated that Bylsma would not or could not change his playoff strategy when needed. That's why they brought in JM......and Bylsma completely ignored him.

They know what they should be doing, but they are so weak and afraid to get hit, not a single puck battle can be won. During the games against more physical teams like CBJ, just look how much time the Pens spend in the offensive zone? It's usually one chance and out. And then look at the other end. The opps teams spend easily 20-30 seconds of every shift in our zone. Our D can't move anyone in front of the crease - it's a miracle (or pure luck) that Flower and Zatkoff have been seeing the puck so well.

What Pens need is a hitting session. Their hits don't separate anyone from the puck.
- chimpira

Pens have spent most of the season in the defensive zone which is what I was saying even during their winning streak. Everyone said I was being a pessimist.
God help this team if they don't improve and Fleury doesn't keep playing at a high level.

I agree with this entirely. Nobody ever had a problem with Bylsma's system in the regular season. But when the playoffs rolled around, he would be consistently out-coached. Zero ability or desire to adjust. DK has reported this extensively... The owners were really frustrated that Bylsma would not or could not change his playoff strategy when needed. That's why they brought in JM......and Bylsma completely ignored him.
- madmike71

I always look at the NHL coaches more as motivators. This is not a game like football where you call individual plays. Like in the NBA, there aren't that many changes to make during an NHL game - double-team a guy, utilize the trap, play zone vs man-to-man type things. The execution has to be on the players, after all. Who is to say that this team has not been run by the Golden Boy all these years? Isn't it the case that no one wants to coach in Pitt?

Can't wait until they trade for Hainsey
- BINGO!

I don't mind Hainsey, but he isn't fixing this team. I don't think an elite dman like Shattenkirk could fix this team right now. Too many problems related to the forwards for me to believe bringing in one top 4 dman is a panacea.

Pens have spent most of the season in the defensive zone which is what I was saying even during their winning streak. Everyone said I was being a pessimist. God help this team if they don't improve and Fleury doesn't keep playing at a high level.
- jfkst1

I have no hopes that things will change with the current roster, size, speed, mentality. So we have improved the FWD depth and talent - mostly with guys like Fehr and Cullen, but the D corps are so awful. I mean, Dumo-Nickerson has been the most stable pairing - that says a lot.

The Pens might get lucky here and there and put one in on a rush - I mean most of the goals for have been deflections. People were calling Kessel a sniper but I am yet to see a snipe type goal - most of the time it's deflected in off a D-man. They have not dominated a team this season yet and I don't think that will change.

I don't mind Hainsey, but he isn't fixing this team. I don't think an elite dman like Shattenkirk could fix this team right now. Too many problems related to the forwards for me to believe bringing in one top 4 dman is a panacea.
- jfkst1

There is no fixing this team without breaking up the "core". At this point I would be happy to part with Crosby and Letang and get a bunch of young, big, hungry guys that are not afraid to bang their bodies and can take a game over. It sucks to say/write it, but I am pretty convinced that the team won't go anywhere with Sid/Tanger on the roster ... no matter how many Corsi graphs you show me.

There is no fixing this team without breaking up the "core". At this point I would be happy to part with Crosby and Letang and get a bunch of young, big, hungry guys that are not afraid to bang their bodies and can take a game over. It sucks to say/write it, but I am pretty convinced that the team won't go anywhere with Sid/Tanger on the roster ... no matter how many Corsi graphs you show me.
- chimpira

But why is there no fixing it without moving a core member? It's always easier to make good players play well again than it is to get good players on the team. Why not at least try to fix what there is now before doing something drastic like sending away a good player? A new coach woukd be the first thing to do to try to fix the team. Also Crosby isn't go anywhere unless he wants to so its not really worth talking about.