That's why I'm all for buyouts on Vinny and/or Umberger. For that $13.1mm you're getting a bottom six winger, a healthy scratch & an AHL defenseman.
- Jsaquella

The only thing that worries me about the buy out route is the duration of those lowered hits.
That might help now, but 3-5 years from now may be hindrance toward adding a piece for a cup push

Agreed. I kinda feel that way about Simmonds too
- PhillySportsGuy

Simmonds is a really good PP player but yeah he's really not that great at 5v5. It'll be interesting to see if the refs will continue to call more penalties like they seemingly have recently since the "scoring by is down" talk started gaining traction.

dp
- PhillySportsGuy

Hawt

There's options. If Vinny retires or terminates, it's a huge help. Then they can buy out Umberger and clear an immediate $7mm in space.

Things will be less dire when the albatrosses are gone
- Jsaquella

I would still rather sacrifice next season if it means clearing everything off the board for the 2017-18 (except Amac of course). I just don't think they can do anything with an extra $7M that makes the team a contender.

Hawt
- Nucker101

The only thing that worries me about the buy out route is the duration of those lowered hits.
That might help now, but 3-5 years from now may be hindrance toward adding a piece for a cup push
- nails

That's why it makes no sense. A buyout of Lecavalier guarantees the last year of his deal, and extends dead money on the cap for 4 years. 2 years for Umberger. Doesn't make sense! To do what? Don't buy them out, and demote Umberger if necessary. Play the game with Lecavalier, and let him know he won't be bought out.

I would still rather sacrifice next season if it means clearing everything off the board for the 2017-18 (except Amac of course). I just don't think they can do anything with an extra $7M that makes the team a contender.
- PhillySportsGuy

Exactly! It's a no brainer.

Hope everyone enjoyed the holiday. Just getting back into the swing of things, but at least this weekends results were enjoyable.

Pretty clear decision in the process vs. results debate as well. There is a good amount of people on here weren't that upset when they lost to LA and the couturiers line wasnt putting up points. The process is what needs to be focused on with a team like this at this point. Eventually we see the results whether its the past few games or next few seasons

Exactly! It's a no brainer.
- MJL

Do the people paying the money to go to the games feel the same way?

We already have like 7 of those
- Giroux_Is_God

Yep. Just paying one of them an insane cap hit.

Do the people paying the money to go to the games feel the same way?
- jmatchett383

nobody cares about them

I would still rather sacrifice next season if it means clearing everything off the board for the 2017-18 (except Amac of course). I just don't think they can do anything with an extra $7M that makes the team a contender.
- PhillySportsGuy

This

Do the people paying the money to go to the games feel the same way?
- jmatchett383

They can feel however they want to feel. How would those same people feel if given a choice of having the money to spend next season, to what end, or to have more money to spend beyond that, when the team will hopefully be in a better position to actually make some noise?

nobody cares about them
- nails

I care deeply

I would still rather sacrifice next season if it means clearing everything off the board for the 2017-18 (except Amac of course). I just don't think they can do anything with an extra $7M that makes the team a contender.
- PhillySportsGuy

They arent going to do anything with the extra 7 million so its not necessary to make all those moves. I think they make at least 1 move though. Remains to be seen what it will be though.

My preferred options:
#1 - trade streit at deadline for picks/prospect and a bad 1 yr contract (team may want him around until next deadline though)

#2 - retain salary on umberger trade

#3 - buyout vinny in offseason

#3 or 4 - retain salary on amac trade - #4 option unless they retain less than 1.5 mill

The only thing that worries me about the buy out route is the duration of those lowered hits.
That might help now, but 3-5 years from now may be hindrance toward adding a piece for a cup push
- nails

The buy out route isn't ideal. If Lecavalier is unwilling to retire or terminate, I'd buy him out and carry Unberger for the last year of his deal. A buy out of Lecavalier opens up a roster spot to give a young player a chance and $1.7mm in year one and $2.2mm in year two, with a minimal cap penalty for two years($833K)

It also eliminates a potential distraction by having a clearly unhappy guy hanging around another season-despite Lecavalier being a pro and not causing any waves. I'd only buy out one of the two. If Vinny retired, I'd consider an Umberger buyout.

They can feel however they want to feel. How would those same people feel if given a choice of having the money to spend next season, to what end, or to have more money to spend beyond that, when the team will hopefully be in a better position to actually make some noise?
- MJL

Nah, they'll love it when the team is back in the Finals armed w/ the best depth that limited cap-space can buy: Krajicek/Leighton/Parent/etc.

I would still rather sacrifice next season if it means clearing everything off the board for the 2017-18 (except Amac of course). I just don't think they can do anything with an extra $7M that makes the team a contender.
- PhillySportsGuy

That's fine, too.

I'm looking at creating a roster space and cap room to carry a youngster and get him playing time at the NHL level.

I'm not sold that Lecavalier will retire or agree to terminate. If he doesn't, I'd rather buy him out. If he does, that's when I'd consider a buyout of Umberger. I worded it poorly before, I'd buy out one or the other, not both, and Umberger only if Lecavalier decided to retire or agree to terminate his deal.

The buy out route isn't ideal. If Lecavalier is unwilling to retire or terminate, I'd buy him out and carry Unberger for the last year of his deal. A buy out of Lecavalier opens up a roster spot to give a young player a chance and $1.7mm in year one and $2.2mm in year two, with a minimal cap penalty for two years($833K)

It also eliminates a potential distraction by having a clearly unhappy guy hanging around another season-despite Lecavalier being a pro and not causing any waves. I'd only buy out one of the two. If Vinny retired, I'd consider an Umberger buyout.
- Jsaquella

its roughly 917k penalty for the last two years (buyout happens in june)

I agree, if cap space is needed this offseason and no one will take umberger or amac, a buyout of Vinny is very manageable (and deserved)

I think a buyout of umberger would be a calculated move by Hextall...it clears the most immediate cap space for next season (over Vinny buyout) and would lead to the shortest effect if AMac gets expansion drafted and Vinny plays (sits) out his contract

its roughly 917k penalty for the last two years (buyout happens in june)

I agree, if cap space is needed this offseason and no one will take umberger or amac, a buyout of Vinny is very manageable (and deserved)
- YuenglingJagr

To me it's not a matter of need with the cap space, it's more opening a roster spot and eliminating a potential distraction.

Obviously a retirement or agreement to mutually terminate would be far better for the Flyers than a buyout. There's no guarantee Lecavalier does that. There's no guarantee that Lecavalier stays the same, upset but professional guy, quietly accepting the situation. The extra immediate cap room via buyout is a minor bonus.

They can feel however they want to feel. How would those same people feel if given a choice of having the money to spend next season, to what end, or to have more money to spend beyond that, when the team will hopefully be in a better position to actually make some noise?
- MJL

Depends. Are the Flyers going to lie to them and tell their loyal customers that they intend to be a contender, or will they tell them they intend to miss the playoffs, but maybe be better than this season? If it's the latter, then I expect most STHs would not renew next season and then pick them back up the following year. What are the odds of that happening?

I wouldnt say overblown. The only two contracts of value to fall off this year are Luke Schenn and Sam Gagner and both of those are eaten up by Couturier's and Voracek's extension. Medvedev($3.0) is going to fall off but his replacement will be at least approx. $1 mil leaving $2.0 which most if not all would have to go to resign B. Schenn. So next year they are in cap hell again. The following year they have to resign Mason and entire 6 man defense corp(maybe 5 is they bring up MacDonald). They will need every penny to do that.
- psuhockey

If they buy out Vinny, and trade Raffl and Medvedev (or Streit) at the deadline they can get under the cap pretty easily.

Giroux ~ 8.275
Voracek ~ 8.25
MacDonald ~ 5
Streit ~ 5.25
Umberger ~ 4.6
Mason ~ 4.1
Couturier ~ 4.33
BSchenn ~ 4
Simmonds ~ 3.975
MDZ ~ 3.875
Read ~ 3.625
Lecavalier buyout ~ 2.916
Schultz ~ 2.25
Neuvirth ~ 1.625
Gudas ~ 2
Cousins ~ 0.95
Straka ~ 0.95
Konecny ~ 0.925
Provorov ~ 0.925
Gostisbehere ~ 0.863
Laughton ~ 0.863
VandeVelde ~ 0.7125
Bellemare ~ 0.7125
TOTAL - 70.972

To me it's not a matter of need with the cap space, it's more opening a roster spot and eliminating a potential distraction.

Obviously a retirement or agreement to mutually terminate would be far better for the Flyers than a buyout. There's no guarantee Lecavalier does that. There's no guarantee that Lecavalier stays the same, upset but professional guy, quietly accepting the situation. The extra immediate cap room via buyout is a minor bonus.
- Jsaquella

I dont think there will be a distraction but I agree on the roster spot. I dont think the buyout penalty is high enough to dissuade hextall from a buyout

guys i hate to embarrass you all like this...but there's a new blob

If they buy out Vinny, and trade Raffl and Medvedev (or Streit) at the deadline they can get under the cap pretty easily.

Giroux ~ 8.275
Voracek ~ 8.25
MacDonald ~ 5
Streit ~ 5.25
Umberger ~ 4.6
Mason ~ 4.1
Couturier ~ 4.33
BSchenn ~ 4
Simmonds ~ 3.975
MDZ ~ 3.875
Read ~ 3.625
Lecavalier buyout ~ 2.916
Schultz ~ 2.25
Neuvirth ~ 1.625
Gudas ~ 2
Cousins ~ 0.95
Straka ~ 0.95
Konecny ~ 0.925
Provorov ~ 0.925
Gostisbehere ~ 0.863
Laughton ~ 0.863
VandeVelde ~ 0.7125
Bellemare ~ 0.7125
TOTAL - 70.972
- Feanor

Medvedev and Rafll are both UFA at the end of the season