With the way teams check nowadays it's difficult to generate off of the rush. You want to manage the puck, and avoid turnovers in the neutral zone of high in the offensive zone. When a carry in is not available, ratherthan make a low percentage play best thing to do is chip it and get it behind the defense and pursue. That's what makes retrieval and defensive quickness so important. If we look at Hakstol system and his neural zone scheme it's all about turning pucks over to try and generate oddan and rush chances. I don't think any team prefers a dump in over a carry in but you also have to manage the puck when a carry in is not available. Flyers don't have a ton of team speed that can beat defenseman wide.
- MJL

What I am referring to is the times where guys are generally in open space and elect to dump it to the corner instead of making an easy carry in. I agree that there are teams with more speed that succeed with the dump and chase (MTL) and don't have a problem with resorting to the method. I am just specifically talking about how it looks at times as though it is the preferred method. I have seen less of it recently, but I noticed flyers defensemen generating turnovers in the neutral zone, or the opposing team clears the zone and the flyers defensemen just throw it right back down the ice. Neutral zone/blue line turnover is obviously the worst case scenario, so it is safer in a way

I am just happy that it sounds as though Hakstol recognizes that there are more opportunities to carry in, when in my eyes it looked like the Flyers were being coached to dump it. Could just been the sharp contrast between this year and last

Sanheim and Konecny named to Canada's World Junior selection camp, and are locks to make the team outside of injury. Aube-Kubel missed out.

http://www.tsn.ca/canada-...tion-camp-roster-1.402465

What I am referring to is the times where guys are generally in open space and elect to dump it to the corner instead of making an easy carry in. I agree that there are teams with more speed that succeed with the dump and chase (MTL) and don't have a problem with resorting to the method. I am just specifically talking about how it looks at times as though it is the preferred method. I have seen less of it recently, but I noticed flyers defensemen generating turnovers in the neutral zone, or the opposing team clears the zone and the flyers defensemen just throw it right back down the ice. Neutral zone/blue line turnover is obviously the worst case scenario, so it is safer in a way

I am just happy that it sounds as though Hakstol recognizes that there are more opportunities to carry in, when in my eyes it looked like the Flyers were being coached to dump it. Could just been the sharp contrast between this year and last
- YuenglingJagr

Our D could always use the Nick Schultz method when any sign of a forecheck is coming: turn your back to the wall and play it hard up the wall without looking at possible open passes and hope it clears without causing an icing.

But he plays the hard minutes or something, so that makes him good despite the fact that he handles the puck like a hand grenade.

Oh, hey, our old friend OKT apparently almost killed a guy in Sweden:

http://sports.yahoo.com/b...erfeed&utm_medium=twitter
- johndewar

I was literally thinking the story was going to be about an attempted murder charge and not a hockey play

Luke Schenn also had a good season next to Kimmo Timonen on the top pair his first season as a Flyer.

I'm not trying to throw your beliefs in your face. I had faith in Vinny and believed he deserved redemption but Vinny has had his shot and I believe his time is up now. I was wrong.
- SuperSchennBros

I like luke though so tired of hearing how well he played 4 years ago.

i hope hakstol is not thinking about outting manning back in there, especially over ghost... geezu

i hope hakstol is not thinking about outting manning back in there, especially over ghost... geezu
- JoeRussomanno

Manning would be in for Schultz, not Ghost, barring an injury to Ghost.

Sanheim and Konecny named to Canada's World Junior selection camp, and are locks to make the team outside of injury. Aube-Kubel missed out.

http://www.tsn.ca/canada-...tion-camp-roster-1.402465
- Feanor

NAK was a long shot. He's not enough of a "name" for Hockey Canada, whose team selection is 80% a popularity contest...couple in his injury and the fact that the QMJHL seems to be going back to the no defense league and he gets left off.

Beautifully worded. You said everything I was thinking but could not so artfully express as you have done. You have a gift.
- Mononoke

Apart from Voracek, their bottom six are AHL lines. Neat.
- Streit2ThePoint

Voracek must be pumped. I'm guessing this will definitely help him get going.

Here's what I think.

I think Hakstol is a really good coach.

Please hold your JAKE IS ON THE FOURTH LINE THOUGH's until the end. I'm not blindly defending like some people (person) do here. He's had is weird decisions, but we'll talk about that later.

Hak really knows what it takes to win. His system is really great for the NHL. Puck possession. Carrying the puck out of the defensive zone with speed. Preaching puck support and good board work. It's all obvious poop but, as we saw with that article posted earlier, he's actually imposed it on the team. That's the kind of game you need to play to win, guys. The problem is the players. They just don't have skill or speed. We know this. If that changes, and Hak's system is still implemented...watch out. I really think that.

The whole Jake being a "4th liner"...that's not right. I agree. The scratching of Medvedev...that's a pretty meh decision too.

But remember- the coach is green and might be a little bit reactionary at this point. Just like rookie players, rookie coaches might have growing pains too.

Keep him around. He's promising. Right now with Jake and Medvedev, I think he's just trying to find something that clicks Jake into shape and improves the D. The team is desperate and the coach might be a little bit too.

I like the idea of Jake and Laughton. I hope we see that soon and I trust we will if Jake doesn't get going.

But anyway, those are my rambling thoughts on Hakstol. I love how he's changed this team. Unfortunately, the players just aren't quite good enough. Hopefully that'll change with an influx of guys up front like Leier, Aube-Kubel, and Konecny and guys on the back end like Provorov and Sanheim.

What I am referring to is the times where guys are generally in open space and elect to dump it to the corner instead of making an easy carry in. I agree that there are teams with more speed that succeed with the dump and chase (MTL) and don't have a problem with resorting to the method. I am just specifically talking about how it looks at times as though it is the preferred method. I have seen less of it recently, but I noticed flyers defensemen generating turnovers in the neutral zone, or the opposing team clears the zone and the flyers defensemen just throw it right back down the ice. Neutral zone/blue line turnover is obviously the worst case scenario, so it is safer in a way

I am just happy that it sounds as though Hakstol recognizes that there are more opportunities to carry in, when in my eyes it looked like the Flyers were being coached to dump it. Could just been the sharp contrast between this year and last
- YuenglingJagr

I personally don't think the Flyers are passing up easy carry ins, and electing to dump the puck in. I think it's two fold, you have to create more carry in opportunities, and you have to effectively play that chip and chase game, and get the puck to the net with traffic in this league. It's the only way to score consistently in the league now.

Here's what I think.

I think Hakstol is a really good coach.

Please hold your JAKE IS ON THE FOURTH LINE THOUGH's until the end. I'm not blindly defending like some people (person) do here. He's had is weird decisions, but we'll talk about that later.

Hak really knows what it takes to win. His system is really great for the NHL. Puck possession. Carrying the puck out of the defensive zone with speed. Preaching puck support and good board work. It's all obvious poop but, as we saw with that article posted earlier, he's actually imposed it on the team. That's the kind of game you need to play to win, guys. The problem is the players. They just don't have skill or speed. We know this. If that changes, and Hak's system is still implemented...watch out. I really think that.

The whole Jake being a "4th liner"...that's not right. I agree. The scratching of Medvedev...that's a pretty meh decision too.

But remember- the coach is green and might be a little bit reactionary at this point. Just like rookie players, rookie coaches might have growing pains too.

Keep him around. He's promising. Right now with Jake and Medvedev, I think he's just trying to find something that clicks Jake into shape and improves the D. The team is desperate and the coach might be a little bit too.

I like the idea of Jake and Laughton. I hope we see that soon and I trust we will if Jake doesn't get going.

But anyway, those are my rambling thoughts on Hakstol. I love how he's changed this team. Unfortunately, the players just aren't quite good enough. Hopefully that'll change with an influx of guys up front like Leier, Aube-Kubel, and Konecny and guys on the back end like Provorov and Sanheim.
- Giroux_Is_God

It's a bit weird that his system seemingly promotes puck possession on zone exits, but when gaining entry into the zone, it's all about dump-and-chase. I'm not sure if that style suits this team, especially the big guns.

That, and the Voracek/Medvedev treatment are my two biggest beefs with him. I don't think he's a horrible coach, but I'm a bit sceptical about him due to some of the stuff I've seen.

Here's what I think.

I think Hakstol is a really good coach.

Please hold your JAKE IS ON THE FOURTH LINE THOUGH's until the end. I'm not blindly defending like some people (person) do here. He's had is weird decisions, but we'll talk about that later.

Hak really knows what it takes to win. His system is really great for the NHL. Puck possession. Carrying the puck out of the defensive zone with speed. Preaching puck support and good board work. It's all obvious poop but, as we saw with that article posted earlier, he's actually imposed it on the team. That's the kind of game you need to play to win, guys. The problem is the players. They just don't have skill or speed. We know this. If that changes, and Hak's system is still implemented...watch out. I really think that.

The whole Jake being a "4th liner"...that's not right. I agree. The scratching of Medvedev...that's a pretty meh decision too.

But remember- the coach is green and might be a little bit reactionary at this point. Just like rookie players, rookie coaches might have growing pains too.

Keep him around. He's promising. Right now with Jake and Medvedev, I think he's just trying to find something that clicks Jake into shape and improves the D. The team is desperate and the coach might be a little bit too.

I like the idea of Jake and Laughton. I hope we see that soon and I trust we will if Jake doesn't get going.

But anyway, those are my rambling thoughts on Hakstol. I love how he's changed this team. Unfortunately, the players just aren't quite good enough. Hopefully that'll change with an influx of guys up front like Leier, Aube-Kubel, and Konecny and guys on the back end like Provorov and Sanheim.
- Giroux_Is_God

Two things, who is the person you're referring to, who blindly defends Hakstol?

Secondly, I don't think ultimately, Hakstol is preaching anything different than Berube did. The same issue existed there, players to execute it.

It's a bit weird that his system seemingly promotes puck possession on zone exits, but when gaining entry into the zone, it's all about dump-and-chase. I'm not sure if that style suits this team, especially the big guns.

That, and the Voracek/Medvedev treatment are my two biggest beefs with him. I don't think he's a horrible coach, but I'm a bit sceptical about him due to some of the stuff I've seen.
- Nucker101

Well, he did say he wants more carry ins.

I guess my main point that my ramblings didn't articulate well is we should quell the skepticism for now. This guy has been coaching and NHL team for a month.

We give players a year or two of adapting time. Let's give the coach who has only coached at a college level some time to adjust and get comfortable too.

I think a vet coach doesn't send Jake to play with studs like Bellemare and VdV. I think he'd move him around, sure, but not like that. Again, that ordeal with Jake might be reactionary because of a green coach.

It's a bit weird that his system seemingly promotes puck possession on zone exits, but when gaining entry into the zone, it's all about dump-and-chase. I'm not sure if that style suits this team, especially the big guns.

That, and the Voracek/Medvedev treatment are my two biggest beefs with him. I don't think he's a horrible coach, but I'm a bit sceptical about him due to some of the stuff I've seen.
- Nucker101

The dump and chase is used to varying degrees depending on who is on the ice. G and Jake still carry it in most often

Two things, who is the person you're referring to, who blindly defends Hakstol?

Secondly, I don't think ultimately, Hakstol is preaching anything different than Berube did. The same issue existed there, players to execute it.
- MJL

Here's what I think.

I think Hakstol is a really good coach.

Please hold your JAKE IS ON THE FOURTH LINE THOUGH's until the end. I'm not blindly defending like some people (person) do here. He's had is weird decisions, but we'll talk about that later.

Hak really knows what it takes to win. His system is really great for the NHL. Puck possession. Carrying the puck out of the defensive zone with speed. Preaching puck support and good board work. It's all obvious poop but, as we saw with that article posted earlier, he's actually imposed it on the team. That's the kind of game you need to play to win, guys. The problem is the players. They just don't have skill or speed. We know this. If that changes, and Hak's system is still implemented...watch out. I really think that.

The whole Jake being a "4th liner"...that's not right. I agree. The scratching of Medvedev...that's a pretty meh decision too.

But remember- the coach is green and might be a little bit reactionary at this point. Just like rookie players, rookie coaches might have growing pains too.

Keep him around. He's promising. Right now with Jake and Medvedev, I think he's just trying to find something that clicks Jake into shape and improves the D. The team is desperate and the coach might be a little bit too.

I like the idea of Jake and Laughton. I hope we see that soon and I trust we will if Jake doesn't get going.

But anyway, those are my rambling thoughts on Hakstol. I love how he's changed this team. Unfortunately, the players just aren't quite good enough. Hopefully that'll change with an influx of guys up front like Leier, Aube-Kubel, and Konecny and guys on the back end like Provorov and Sanheim.
- Giroux_Is_God

And in other breaking news, water is wet.

The dump and chase is used to varying degrees depending on who is on the ice. G and Jake still carry it in most often
- YuenglingJagr

According to Freidman's numbers, that's no true. They've been carrying the puck in less this year and as a result, have been taking lower quality shots.

- Nucker101

I was going more for ANYTHING this organization does, not just Hakstol.

I personally don't think the Flyers are passing up easy carry ins, and electing to dump the puck in. I think it's two fold, you have to create more carry in opportunities, and you have to effectively play that chip and chase game, and get the puck to the net with traffic in this league. It's the only way to score consistently in the league now.
- MJL

I don't think I am the only one who notices the quick dump ins. Would love to know if I am though

It's a bit weird that his system seemingly promotes puck possession on zone exits, but when gaining entry into the zone, it's all about dump-and-chase. I'm not sure if that style suits this team, especially the big guns.

That, and the Voracek/Medvedev treatment are my two biggest beefs with him. I don't think he's a horrible coach, but I'm a bit sceptical about him due to some of the stuff I've seen.
- Nucker101

I think lack of execution, and managing the puck are being confused with the philosophy of how they want to play.

Well, he did say he wants more carry ins.

I guess my main point that my ramblings didn't articulate well is we should quell the skepticism for now. This guy has been coaching and NHL team for a month.

We give players a year or two of adapting time. Let's give the coach who has only coached at a college level some time to adjust and get comfortable too.

I think a vet coach doesn't send Jake to play with studs like Bellemare and VdV. I think he'd move him around, sure, but not like that. Again, that ordeal with Jake might be reactionary because of a green coach.
- Giroux_Is_God

I agree with most of what you say here, we definitely need to give him more time, to come to a conclusion either way, good or bad.

As far as what a veteran coach would do, as a fan, why do you think that a veteran coach wouldn't put Voracek there? What's the thinking behind that?

I think lack of execution, and managing the puck are being confused with the philosophy of how they want to play.
- MJL

But according the numbers and what we're seeing, it's the same players from last year that are now dumping the puck in more instead of trying to gain zone entry with possession. It's not like these guys are suddenly declining or the team's talent/skill level has dropped off compared to last year.

According to Freidman's numbers, that's no true. They've been carrying the puck in less this year and as a result, have been taking lower quality shots.
- Nucker101

I was referring to that line, but Freidman's numbers said nothing about which forwards do it most often. Voracek led the team in controlled entries through the first 1/4 of the season, which is the most important