No his advocated the right path. You advocate the wrong path.
If Grenier is waiver eligible next season and doesn't play well enough to make the team then so be it
As was stated you drop a few vets each yr to create room for the young guys to compete for a spot.
- Bieksa#3

You keep the right vets, not the wrong ones. Sorry but Higgins is the wrong vet to keep. He is useless on the ice, and he doesn't offer anything off the ice that other vets can't offer. I am only suggesting 1 vet to be moves(higgins) for a specific reason. Hammer and Vrbata should be traded for assets. Anyone who doesnt agree is entitled to their opnion, but are still morons. We keep them for what? Vet presence until the end of the season(early april), miss the playoffs and then let them walk for nothing? Sorry but if your not going to extend those 2, trade them. There is no other correct option when it comes to Vrbata and Hammer and, to a similar extent, Higgins.

It did not. His advocated keeping Higgins. Mine advocated giving him the boot and why. His advocated keeping Gaunce and Grenier in Utica to help develop Shink, Cassels, Subban, etc. Mine advocates bringing those 2 up. Gaunce because he deserves it, and Grenier because he deserves it and needs a look before he becomes waiver eligible.
- Retinalz

I think he's saying having vets around is important, not specifically keeping Higgins is important. Higgins needs to go, so does Burrows though.

I think three kids who deserve a good look at the NHL level are Gaunce, Shinkaruk and Grenier. IMO they'll find a spot for them next year if they prove themselves.

Vrbata IMO won't be here next year and neither will Higgins and Prust, there's your spots right there.

You keep the right vets, not the wrong ones. Sorry but Higgins is the wrong vet to keep. He is useless on the ice, and he doesn't offer anything off the ice that other vets can't offer. I am only suggesting 1 vet to be moves(higgins) for a specific reason. Hammer and Vrbata should be traded for assets. Anyone who doesnt agree is entitled to their opnion, but are still morons. We keep them for what? Vet presence until the end of the season(early april), miss the playoffs and then let them walk for nothing? Sorry but if your not going to extend those 2, trade them. There is no other correct option when it comes to Vrbata and Hammer and, to a similar extent, Higgins.
- Retinalz

How many times have you been in an nhl lockerromm? I mean Higgins is lauded as a leader and role model everywhere in the league. Yet you say he isn't. How do you know?

31% chance

http://www.sportsclubstat...rn/Pacific/Vancouver.html

I'm not on board for a 100% tank, but I do have to say I enjoy being a canucks fan right now. If they win great... my team won and that's always a good thing. If they lose we're that much closer to a top pick. The only time I get upset with the team is when they put in zero effort (vs Minny, Boston to name a few)

I would love the Sedins to have another crack at the cup. I wouldn't mind if the Canucks got a top 5 pick this year and unloaded a ton of salary at the deadline so they can be super active at July 1.
- Mungo

I will admit I like it when they win too...but understand the need for a top pick. I am a supporter of #tanknation to an extent but also understand there are processes involved. Not everyone has the MNGT of a DET or CHI. Whether some on here want to acknowledge 'how' to lose is irrelevant...we need to pick top 10 for next three seasons. Whether that involves 'tanking' or manipulation of the lineup or however it needs to happen.

Someone mentioned the Oilers earlier and how all the top picks are working for them...their failure over the past while has been MNGT and coaching. That culture (is changing) has changed in EDM now and you can see a shift happening. When Mcjesus and Yak get back they will infuse that club with another 80 points at least between the two of them...Chiarelli and McClellan aren't tied to the past in EDM. They are close to turning the corner a few Dmen and maybe a goalie and they will be rolling. They still might miss the PO's this year but in this crap division who knows. I'm not an Oil fan but you can see a shift happening and the players are starting to buy in to what McClellan has to say.

Calgary has arguably a top 3 D core in the league but they are no better than a .500 team on any given night and still can't win on the road. But they get love and the Oil do not. What does that tell us?

Back to tanking if someone tried to tell me that ARZ-TOR and BUF weren't tanking for McDavid last year they have no business watching or understanding hockey. I haven't seen losing that obvious in a long time and it was all by lineup manipulation.

Is that what Benning is trying to do here by keeping Burrows Higgins Hamhuis Vrbata and a few others consistently in the lineup? Very debateable but it almost looks (to me) that Benning is eyeing a top pick for June and he knows how to get it.

How many times have you been in an nhl lockerromm? I mean Higgins is lauded as a leader and role model everywhere in the league. Yet you say he isn't. How do you know?
- Bieksa#3

There you go again, not readying my post. I said he doesn't offer anything other vets don't. You think the Sedins, Prust, Dorset, etc don't offer leadership? I always hear about how Dorsett and Cracknell are the best leaders for our youth. I never hear Higgins when it comes to this. The Sedins take time (after practice) to talk to McCann and Virtanen. I never hear of Higgins doing this. As much as leadership is needed, too much can hurt. Higgins locker room leadership is easily replaced, and we have better off ice leadership mentoring the kids.

I think he's saying having vets around is important, not specifically keeping Higgins is important. Higgins needs to go, so does Burrows though.

I think three kids who deserve a good look at the NHL level are Gaunce, Shinkaruk and Grenier. IMO they'll find a spot for them next year if they prove themselves.

Vrbata IMO won't be here next year and neither will Higgins and Prust, there's your spots right there.
- LeftCoaster

I don't particularly like Higgins. But his hockey sense and work ethic are both unquestionable. His talnet is another question. Burrows plays super hard as well. The kids who aren't top liners need to learn how to be role players as well. I assume Prust is gone, and I'd be alright with one of Higgins or burrows next season, but not both.
Hoping benning sells high on hanswn

There you go again, not readying my post. I said he doesn't offer anything other vets don't. You think the Sedins, Prust, Dorset, etc don't offer leadership? I always hear about how Dorsett and Cracknell are the best leaders for our youth. I never hear Higgins when it comes to this. The Sedins take time (after practice) to talk to McCann and Virtanen. I never hear of Higgins doing this. As much as leadership is needed, too much can hurt. Higgins locker room leadership is easily replaced, and we have better off ice leadership mentoring the kids.
- Retinalz

They might they might not. But you would have to be in the dressing room to comment on off ice behavior.

There you go again, not readying my post. I said he doesn't offer anything other vets don't. You think the Sedins, Prust, Dorset, etc don't offer leadership? I always hear about how Dorsett and Cracknell are the best leaders for our youth. I never hear Higgins when it comes to this. The Sedins take time (after practice) to talk to McCann and Virtanen. I never hear of Higgins doing this. As much as leadership is needed, too much can hurt. Higgins locker room leadership is easily replaced, and we have better off ice leadership mentoring the kids.
- Retinalz

I'm not disagreeing with you, because I think what Higgins brings can easily be replaced, but it has been reported that Chris has taken the time to speak with the kids, Virtanen specifically, about keeping a level head during his first year.

I don't particularly like Higgins. But his hockey sense and work ethic are both unquestionable. His talnet is another question. Burrows plays super hard as well. The kids who aren't top liners need to learn how to be role players as well. I assume Prust is gone, and I'd be alright with one of Higgins or burrows next season, but not both.
Hoping benning sells high on hanswn
- Bieksa#3

I think it's just time to move on from Higgins, Burrows contract would be much harder to move at 4.5 million, as mentioned, we have to move forward at some point with kids knocking at the door....it's just time.

It did not. His advocated keeping Higgins. Mine advocated giving him the boot and why. His advocated keeping Gaunce and Grenier in Utica to help develop Shink, Cassels, Subban, etc. Mine advocates bringing those 2 up. Gaunce because he deserves it, and Grenier because he deserves it and needs a look before he becomes waiver eligible.
- Retinalz

I was more so advocating the importance of maintaining a successful farm and development model.

We can all agree that this season is pretty much a write-off, be it making the playoffs or finishing bottom five.

If we know that the current Canucks are mediocre in nature, what do we have to gain by decimating Utica's competitive ability by poaching their best players? Gaunce, Shink and Grenier are quite literally carrying that team, and what more could we ask for?

Sure, they would gain NHL experience, but that "experience" would be on a .500 team... They are in a position to lead, dominate and play a top role as opposed to losing half the time while playing 8/9 minutes a night at the NHL level.

We are FINALLY developing impact players! Higgins has topped out, we know what to expect with him. These kids however, still have their entire careers ahead of them. No point risking their development for the sake of delivering a more "entertaining" NHL product for the next half of the season.

Utica and by association, Travis Green is doing a hell of a job down there. They are providing a great model for our parent team. Had a very veteran heavy team last year that incorporated a large wave of young prospects. Went to the finals, cut ties with the old bums this summer and allowed the prospects to transition into new roles on their own time and ability. They earned their new roles, it wasn't just given to them for the sake of change...


Leave them be.

They might they might not. But you would have to be in the dressing room to comment on off ice behavior.
- Bieksa#3

No, you hear it in the news and from reading articles. Cracknell is often found spending his off ice time with our Youth, Dorsett was huge for BO last year and is being the same way this year. The Sedins have been reported(pics etc) having talks with youth, taking them into closed door discussions and the like. I never hear in the news or anything of Higgins being that guy for our youth that makes him indispensable. Gaunce and Grenier may he rookies to the NHL, but not the Pro's. Grenier is in his 3rd Pro year and Gaunce his 2nd(?).

I think it's just time to move on from Higgins, Burrows contract would be much harder to move at 4.5 million, as mentioned, we have to move forward at some point with kids knocking at the door....it's just time.
- LeftCoaster

It is. We are well past the point of Higgins and Burrows mentoring the youth. Hamhuis maybe still might provide a little veteran leadership but he has to speak with his play on the ice as well and he is struggling out there when healthy. The Sedins work ethic and examples are all the kids need right now. Burrows and Higgins have become invisible not only as players but as examples as well.

I was more so advocating the importance of maintaining a successful farm and development model.

We can all agree that this season is pretty much a write-off, be it making the playoffs or finishing bottom five.

If we know that the current Canucks are mediocre in nature, what do we have to gain by decimating Utica's competitive ability by poaching their best players? Gaunce, Shink and Grenier are quite literally carrying that team, and what more could we ask for?

Sure, they would gain NHL experience, but that "experience" would be on a .500 team... They are in a position to lead, dominate and play a top role as opposed to losing half the time while playing 8/9 minutes a night at the NHL level.

We are FINALLY developing impact players! Higgins has topped out, we know what to expect with him. These kids however, still have their entire careers ahead of them. No point risking their development for the sake of delivering a more "entertaining" NHL product for the next half of the season.

Utica and by association, Travis Green is doing a hell of a job down there. They are providing a great model for our parent team. Had a very veteran heavy team last year that incorporated a large wave of young prospects. Went to the finals, cut ties with the old bums this summer and allowed the prospects to transition into new roles on their own time and ability. They earned their new roles, it wasn't just given to them for the sake of change...


Leave them be.
- Whiskey-Tango

Again I agree to a certain extent, but what else should we do? Keep Vrbata and Hammer and let them walk for nothing? or should we trade them and bring up replacements from Utica? or should we Trade then and take less to have a replacement piece come back?

Again I agree to a certain extent, but what else should we do? Keep Vrbata and Hammer and let them walk for nothing? or should we trade them and bring up replacements from Utica? or should we Trade then and take less to have a replacement piece come back?
- Retinalz

IMO you try to trade them at all costs, do not let them walk and receive nothing!

I think the Canucks should claim Gomez, please hear me out, to take some pressure off Horvat and especially McCann.

Try to trade Cracknell or waive him as Gomez is a big upgrade and can play top six, on the Canucks with Sutter out. Cracknell is not our future, Horvat and McCann are.

IMO you try to trade them at all costs, do not let them walk and receive nothing!
- LeftCoaster

Exactly. Why not get a 20 y/o prospect to replace Grenier for Vrbata? 2nd and B prospect. If Higgins doesn't clear waivers, get get a 1st + 2nd + B for Hammer to replace Gaunce in Utica. If Higgins clears, wouldn't he be better service in Utica for leadership development than Gaunce?(Unless he goes full emo down there for being demoted)

So changing subjects

Thoughts on the Nylander hit?

First off if that hit is 10 yrs ago it's not even 2 minutes. However, obviously they're trying to take that hit out of the game and rightfully so. Suspension was warranted. However I've said this over and over again. The pure arrogance of the puck carrier is becomnig the bigger problem. Whaever happened to keep your head up? A blind side hit is one thing. No way of seeing a guy going for your numbers. But you have to be aware of where u are on the ice. This is just as bad as guys turning to face the boards when they're going to get hit so the guy can't hit him. Far to much of the "you can't hit me now" attitude, and it has to change

Again I agree to a certain extent, but what else should we do? Keep Vrbata and Hammer and let them walk for nothing? or should we trade them and bring up replacements from Utica? or should we Trade then and take less to have a replacement piece come back?
- Retinalz

I think we already have the replacement pieces that could take their positions without hurting Utica's competitive/development process.

If we are in a position to ship off Vrbata and Hamhuis etc, then the Canucks would clearly be in a losing situation. Replace them with the likes of less important players that don't really impact Utica and our young top prospects , like Jensen, Vey, Kennins, Biega etc. Their bottom six roles could be replaced in Utica by whomever is best playing in the ECHL (Fox, Bloomstrand etc).

All in all, my argument is that if our NHL team is poop, the solution cannot be to weaken our successful and progressive AHL team. We cannot have success at one level without the other......if we wish to have long-term benefits.

So changing subjects

Thoughts on the Nylander hit?

First off if that hit is 10 yrs ago it's not even 2 minutes. However, obviously they're trying to take that hit out of the game and rightfully so. Suspension was warranted. However I've said this over and over again. The pure arrogance of the puck carrier is becomnig the bigger problem. Whaever happened to keep your head up? A blind side hit is one thing. No way of seeing a guy going for your numbers. But you have to be aware of where u are on the ice. This is just as bad as guys turning to face the boards when they're going to get hit so the guy can't hit him. Far to much of the "you can't hit me now" attitude, and it has to change
- Bieksa#3

Agreed these kidns of hits need to be stopped(when on purpose), but when it isn't the hitters fault(i saw it, he was skating by and i did not notice he change where he was going to run into him like that, unless I am thinking of a dif hit), but if the player doesnt have his head up and it happens, it is his fault. If a player turns last moment to try and draw a penalty, it should be no difference than a diving call.

I think we already have the replacement pieces that could take their positions without hurting Utica's competitive/development process.

If we are in a position to ship off Vrbata and Hamhuis etc, then the Canucks would clearly be in a losing situation. Replace them with the likes of less important players that don't really impact Utica and our young top prospects , like Jensen, Vey, Kennins, Biega etc. Their bottom six roles could be replaced in Utica by whomever is best playing in the ECHL (Fox, Bloomstrand etc).

All in all, my argument is that if our NHL team is poop, the solution cannot be to weaken our successful and progressive AHL team. We cannot have success at one level without the other......if we wish to have long-term benefits.
- Whiskey-Tango

But then we are clearly doing what you and some others have said we shouldn't do. Purposely tank. Trading assets at TDL when you are losing and likely missing playoffs isn't purposely tanking when you replace with our next best in the minors. It is having good asset management. This would be a different scenerio if Vrbata and Hammer still had term.

I think the Canucks should claim Gomez, please hear me out, to take some pressure off Horvat and especially McCann.

Try to trade Cracknell or waive him as Gomez is a big upgrade and can play top six, on the Canucks with Sutter out. Cracknell is not our future, Horvat and McCann are.
- LeftCoaster

A little off topic but once everyone is healthy, I wonder how McCann would look on the wing. There is going to be a log jam at center with Sedin, Horvat, Sutter and Cracknell. Moving McCann to the wing would make moving Vrbata, Higgins, Burrows easier as they could try moving McCann over instead of having to call up another rookie. If Wiilie and or Benning are Not sold on Gaunce and Greinier yet I think this could cushion the blow.

Top 5 or 6 pick would go along ways for the Canucks. Sounds like there are some really good options there.


http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...teresting-2016-nhl-draft/
http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...prospect-report-december/

Top 5 or 6 pick would go along ways for the Canucks. Sounds like there are some really good options there.


http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...teresting-2016-nhl-draft/
http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...prospect-report-december/
- Scooby_Doo

Be pretty sweet if Benning could get a second first round pick.

Top 5 or 6 pick would go along ways for the Canucks. Sounds like there are some really good options there.


http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...teresting-2016-nhl-draft/
http://www.sportsnet.ca/h...prospect-report-december/
- Scooby_Doo

"Tryamkin’s club advanced to the semifinal of the Spengler Cup tournament, and the big Russian blue-liner managed an assist in four games while playing an imposing physical game. In discussing the matter with Russian hockey journalists, the belief is that Tryamkin may be amenable to moving over to North American following the conclusion of Avtomobilist’s KHL season"

Right on!