Kid wasnt struggling. His goals per 60 mins is really good. Problem is he was only playing 11 minutes on a deep team.

He wasn't playing much. That's why he wants a trade.
- Stripes77

11 minutes on the 3/4th line, not good enough for his skills. It's like Grigorenko on 4th line, he needs decent players with him to make a bigger impact.

And then (with the exception of Zadorov) they weren't in that range anymore. Wouldn't you take Fasching every day of the week over Armia, Lemieux, Compher and Grigo?

And the other point that you consistently miss with this is that we actually had too many contracts. We couldn't keep all of these guys.
- Slump Buster

And we couldnt ice an entire team of prospects.

And then (with the exception of Zadorov) they weren't in that range anymore. Wouldn't you take Fasching every day of the week over Armia, Lemieux, Compher and Grigo?

And the other point that you consistently miss with this is that we actually had too many contracts. We couldn't keep all of these guys.
- Slump Buster

No, I would not. The upside on 3 of the 4 u just mentioned is significantly higher than fasching.

I'm staying away of Stamkos.

I'd like to keep McGinn and maybe Foligno.
- Stripes77

I don't blame you for that opinion. I would not mind McGinn, but Foligno would be a 4th line player here (maybe 3rd at times) and I dont want to spend too much, long term for him. The fun with those 2 players is that they may be traded this year anyway and signed back (a la Moulson) if Murray can pull it off. If we are in last place in a month, I would expect them to be traded if not signed by then. We also have too many draft picks, so expecting to get more for those two (and other FA to be players) we have to trade some of the draft picks for something (or move up in draft), otherwise they will be wasted.

I expect (1) more O'Reilly / Kane trade before the season is over and a few dump offs (last year on contract and don't plan on resigning) and another high draft pick. (hopefully luck of the home town draft team gets us 1st overall, cause you know we deserve it!)

Not to be picky, but Armia, Zadorov, and Grigorenko were all ranked as top 50 prospects as late as last season.

Lemieux was getting a lot of press for scoring as much as he did as well, and Compher was ranked closely to Fasching in the 50-75 range.

They were as close to high end as you could get without being high end.

I think at one point Zadorov was the 11th best prospect last year
- sbroads24

Is it fair to say the only one of the three in bold above that is fully trustworthy regarding their potential being realized is Zadorov?

I think Murray was hell bent on A. getting rid of Myers before that no trade clause kicked in and B. getting O'Reilly.

I know the name and his draft status, but nothing more. I understand Cooper is using the triplets over Drouin, and that this is controversial.

Posters in other threads who claim to have seen Drouin as a junior claim there are all kinds of red flags around his game and that they aren't surprised he is having trouble breaking through into the show. Lack of work ethic, no defense - Vanek type stuff.

If this is true, is the potential even worth Ennis and the first this year?
- Der Kaiser[/quote]


Ennis and our first, no way! If, we finish last, which is a strong possibility, we'll be picking 1-4. That pick will be Tkachuk, Puljujvarri, Laine, or Chychrun, I would not trade any one of these guys straight up of Druin let alone toss in Ennis.

I don't blame you for that opinion. I would not mind McGinn, but Foligno would be a 4th line player here (maybe 3rd at times) and I dont want to spend too much, long term for him. The fun with those 2 players is that they may be traded this year anyway and signed back (a la Moulson) if Murray can pull it off. If we are in last place in a month, I would expect them to be traded if not signed by then. We also have too many draft picks, so expecting to get more for those two (and other FA to be players) we have to trade some of the draft picks for something (or move up in draft), otherwise they will be wasted.

I expect (1) more O'Reilly / Kane trade before the season is over and a few dump offs (last year on contract and don't plan on resigning) and another high draft pick. (hopefully luck of the home town draft team gets us 1st overall, cause you know we deserve it!)
- Lilroot9

Sparked my interest.

From GeneralFanager, fwiw:

2016: a first, a second, three thirds, a fourth and two fifths
2017: a first, two seconds, one of everything else

No, I would not. The upside on 3 of the 4 u just mentioned is significantly higher than fasching.
- Sabresfan-365

Upside I agree with, but what about the reality?

I have little to no confidence in what the reality will be regarding Armia and Grigorenko at the NHL level long term, not that I am saying I do with Fasching either.

Per Paul Ham
Lines. 88 90 12.
9 15 23.
26 22 82.
28 59 17
- yen6d1

Kid wasnt struggling. His goals per 60 mins is really good. Problem is he was only playing 11 minutes on a deep team.

He wasn't playing much. That's why he wants a trade.
- Stripes77

yeah but he was getting pp time. no matter how u slice it 4 goals in 70 games is not super awesome. not saying dont consider trading for him but i wouldnt be offering anything close to what it would take to get him. Not trading reinhart, girgenson, risto, ror,eichel, kane or our 1st for him and everything that is left wouldnt be enough to get him.

No, I would not. The upside on 3 of the 4 u just mentioned is significantly higher than fasching.
- Sabresfan-365

Disagree. Also, neither Grigo nor Armia fit the profile of what we are trying to build. They are either too slow or too soft or both. I didn't want to part with Compher but his ceiling is 3rd line and those aren't hard to come by. We did well to not part with guys that have top 6 ceiling. You're not winning anything with Grigo or Armia in your top 6. At least with the other guys you have a chance of them being something special.

11 minutes on the 3/4th line, not good enough for his skills. It's like Grigorenko on 4th line, he needs decent players with him to make a bigger impact.
- Lilroot9

Grigorenko has been getting top line minutes and has 1 goal in 35 games

And then (with the exception of Zadorov) they weren't in that range anymore. Wouldn't you take Fasching every day of the week over Armia, Lemieux, Compher and Grigo?

And the other point that you consistently miss with this is that we actually had too many contracts. We couldn't keep all of these guys.
- Slump Buster

Yes because another draft occured.

It's a cycle with good prospects. They are highly touted in the year or two after they are drafted, then pretty much forgotten about until they make an impact at the NHL level

Sparked my interest.

From GeneralFanager, fwiw:

2016: a first, a second, three thirds, a fourth and two fifths
2017: a first, two seconds, one of everything else
- Der Kaiser

I am not sure which is correct, but what I see is

2016: a first, a second, (4) thirds, a fourth and (2) fifths, sixth, (2) sevenths
2017: (you were correct)

So I guess I just think we have another 3rd and a few sevenths and such. I guess the reason I am saying we have too many is the amount of players that should turn pro next year (already in system) and every pick in the 3rd round or later I would rather use as currency that draft someone, but that is just me.

Drouin 6 goals in 89 games, tons of secondary assists & demanding a trade already

Its not like he was struggling on a poopy sabres team. Kid was struggling to score on a high scoring team.
- joshs

cooper does not know how to handle kids

had drouin bounced around between the 3rd and 4th line for long stretches

it's real simple, when you have a kid with talent, play him with high end players instead of grinders


bolts did the same thing with brett connolly

Grigorenko has been getting top line minutes and has 1 goal in 35 games
- joshs

He averages like 11 minutes a game.

Upside I agree with, but what about the reality?

I have little to no confidence in what the reality will be regarding Armia and Grigorenko at the NHL level long term, not that I am saying I do with Fasching either.
- kingcong39

I agree with this, let's think about the long term of it, if all those players end up as 3/4 line players, which ones stay in the NHL longer? I go with Fasching, but Lemiuex is a close second.

Grigorenko has been getting top line minutes and has 1 goal in 35 games
- joshs

how is 8 minutes a night equate to top line minutes?

http://espn.go.com/nhl/pl...976841/mikhail-grigorenko

I am not sure which is correct, but what I see is

2016: a first, a second, (4) thirds, a fourth and (2) fifths, sixth, (2) sevenths
2017: (you were correct)

So I guess I just think we have another 3rd and a few sevenths and such. I guess the reason I am saying we have too many is the amount of players that should turn pro next year (already in system) and every pick in the 3rd round or later I would rather use as currency that draft someone, but that is just me.
- Lilroot9

We have 3 third round picks in 2016, we gave one to Pitt in the Bylsma deal for his rights.

cooper does not know how to handle kids

had drouin bounced around between the 3rd and 4th line for long stretches

it's real simple, when you have a kid with talent, play him with high end players instead of grinders


bolts did the same thing with brett connolly
- homiedclown

Sequin still scored when he was bounced around on bostons 3rd and 4th line. Also drouin gets pp time

He averages like 11 minutes a game.
- sbroads24

But he has had games where hes played on the top line. He doesnt deserve ice time so he doesnt get it. Hes been given chances. Ur really defending 1 goal in 35games?

Is that 1 player going to take us from 29th to top 5 over the next couple years? That's the question I have.

The fact that Eichel and Reinhart already playing at a high level leads me to believe that their improvements alone won't be enough
- sbroads24

Besides the hilarious comparisons to our team last year points wise or the emphasis on being "28th/29", you people have to realize that Sam and Jack are in their first NHL season. They will improve. A lot. It will happen.
(add Pysyk/McCabe here)

You know that player alone won't take us from 29th to top 5. Jack will. Sam will. Risto will. ROR, our 1st, Kane, Pysyk and McCabe will help.

Having a backup goalie for half of the season doesn't help in the standings (especially when teams are this close which you and others love to overlook). Whether Lehner is a stater or not can't be determined at this time and it's not impossible for him to be one despite what those of you who have written him off after half of a game seem to think. Even if he isn't, I believe one of your favorite sayings is "Top6 players are traded all the time, we didn't need to get Kane." Capable starters being traded isn't exactly rare.

Is Kerby Rychel a cheaper target to acquire then Drouin?

One of Rychel's weaknesses is his skating, reportedly.

Yes because another draft occured.

It's a cycle with good prospects. They are highly touted in the year or two after they are drafted, then pretty much forgotten about until they make an impact at the NHL level
- sbroads24

Right - all the more reason to lump a bunch of mid-level prospects and get good players like Kane and Bogo. Win-win.

I am not sure which is correct, but what I see is

2016: a first, a second, (4) thirds, a fourth and (2) fifths, sixth, (2) sevenths
2017: (you were correct)

So I guess I just think we have another 3rd and a few sevenths and such. I guess the reason I am saying we have too many is the amount of players that should turn pro next year (already in system) and every pick in the 3rd round or later I would rather use as currency that draft someone, but that is just me.
- Lilroot9

http://www.tsn.ca/statist...-nhl-draft-picks-1.317819

This claims second and third round picks give a team about a 33% chance at player that will become a NHLer.

By the 4th round, below 25%.