I love O'Reilly, and right now he nailed that trade. However, calling it a win is so shortsighted based on where we are in the standings.

O'Reilly has been great and we are in 29th. Zadorov is in the AHL, Compher in college and Grigorenko playing 3rd line minutes, and Colorado is better.
- sbroads24

Colorado was better than buffalo last season too.

For some reason people actually believe it is unacceptable for a young team to struggle to win games because murray made a few trades to help turn the corner on a total blow up tear down tank rebuild in year 3 instead of year 5, 6, or 7.

Maybe i didnt expect them to be at the very bottom of the standings. I also dont fail to see that based on their level of play, a 4 game winning streak isnt something farfectched and would potentially put us up by 20th overall. Something most here seem to agree is where they should be.

I'm going to take the pieces one by one, and see if I can't understand this fully. Murray made four major trades I see as the subject of the hate posts in these threads.

1. ROR/McGinn for Grigo/Zads/Compher/2016#31 (Jeremy Roy)
I think the consensus on this trade is Buffalo win. If there's a question, I haven't heard much about it.

2. Kane/Bogo/Kasdorf for Myers/Stafford/Armia/Lemieux/2015#25 (Jack Roslovic)
I think in most people's minds, this trade is close to a draw. Bogo and Kane are both under contract. Stafford was UFA, and the "potential" aspect of the deal is yet to be realized by either team. Hard to call a winner or a loser.

3. Lehner/Legwand for 2015#21 (Colin White)
This is the one everybody blows up, but I really don't get it. I think the frequent complaint is that Lehner hasn't finished a single game in the NHL since the trade, but Colin White hasn't either. He may be great, but today Jonathan Drouin, a #3 overall, is still playing in the NHL, and Broads tells us all the time and Kane and Bogo are both busts, so why is the uncertainty over Lehner any more unsettling than the uncertainty around a #21? And Legwand is giving us games in the NHL, if nothing else.

4. DLo/Fasching for McNabb, Parker and 2 seconds.
McNabb probably has an edge of DLo as an NHLer, but Parker is a 24yrold in the ECHL, and I don't know about the two seconds. Fasching is a PPG guy at UMinnesota and a regular on the USA Jrs.

A win, two draws, and perhaps a slight loss. But everyone of them gave us NHL talent now. Overall, I hear the "we have no prospects" complaint as saying "Murray doesn't have the ammunition to pull of a FIFTH blockbuster for in 24 months for even more NHL talent." First, none of us knows whether that's true; and second, even if it is, do we care?
- Der Kaiser

All of this makes too much sense for hockeybuzz.

All of this makes too much sense for hockeybuzz.
- seedy

Colorado is 1 point better than they were at this point last season with 1 more game played this year. They're no better than they were last year. Right now isn't the best time to compare the 2 teams, since Buffalo had the 0 win January 2015, but it's got to turn out that Buffalo will be at least 10 points better than last season by time this month is over. Will Colorado be?
- stashu

Come on guys, that trade was never a win now trade for the Avs. This whole who won the trade pandering is really meaningless. It was all about building for a season or 2 down the line. Maybe they havent improved that much points wise compared to last year, however none of the assets they got from that trade are being used. They got cap space to help their depth picking up Soderberg and Comeau this year and have the cap space going into next year to get MacKinnon and Barrie under contract.

They are not a worse team since getting rid of ROR, but they can be a better team once they are ready to call up Zads (who is playing like a number 1 in the AHL).

Sabres got the best player in the deal now, but Avs could be a much better team in a season or 2 even though they moved on from ROR

Come on guys, that trade was never a win now trade for the Avs. This whole who won the trade pandering is really meaningless. It was all about building for a season or 2 down the line. Maybe they havent improved that much points wise compared to last year, however none of the assets they got from that trade are being used. They got cap space to help their depth picking up Soderberg and Comeau this year and have the cap space going into next year to get MacKinnon and Barrie under contract.

They are not a worse team since getting rid of ROR, but they can be a better team once they are ready to call up Zads (who is playing like a number 1 in the AHL).

Sabres got the best player in the deal now, but Avs could be a much better team in a season or 2 even though they moved on from ROR
- DDM-Coga

The deal MAY make you better in 2 years. It makes us better now, and it makes us better in 2 years.

Come on guys, that trade was never a win now trade for the Avs. This whole who won the trade pandering is really meaningless. It was all about building for a season or 2 down the line. Maybe they havent improved that much points wise compared to last year, however none of the assets they got from that trade are being used. They got cap space to help their depth picking up Soderberg and Comeau this year and have the cap space going into next year to get MacKinnon and Barrie under contract.

They are not a worse team since getting rid of ROR, but they can be a better team once they are ready to call up Zads (who is playing like a number 1 in the AHL).

Sabres got the best player in the deal now, but Avs could be a much better team in a season or 2 even though they moved on from ROR
- DDM-Coga

The Sabres needed him as a foundation to build on too.
Its unfortunate for your team that you were in a position where you had to just pull the trigger on him, but he is exactly what this team hasnt had since Chris Drury.
As a Sabres fan, I make that trade every day and twice on Sunday.

- Der Kaiser

I know, Ringo had more #1 hit singles as an artist than all the rest of the former Beatles. Staggering.

To say we now have no trade ammunition free to try to get Drouin is not even a starter...the kid has not "earned" anything yet. Pun intended, but really, the kid has set nothing on fire and we are wishing we had more first-round picks to deal for him, based on his former draft status and potential?

Fasching may turn out to be the next Cam Neely, and Justin Bailey the next Brett Hull (...) for all we know. Eich, Rhino and whomever is playing center in 2 years may have tons of new toys.

The deal MAY make you better in 2 years. It makes us better now, and it makes us better in 2 years.
- Der Kaiser

Thats why there is no clear cut "winner" of this trade. Avs are will still fight being a bubble team all year and miss the playoffs. But next year they will bring Zads, Compher into the fold. Grigo will have his spot on the 3rd line secured with Tangs and Iggy moving on. Plus Rantanen will be on the roster (who is a beast right now in the AHL so hes close to ready)

Plus AJ Greer and the 2016 2nd round pick (31st pick return) will all come into play. They have more depth in the pipeline and on the current roster.

You got what you needed and Avs got what they needed

Well despite the outcome nephews first game was a big success. Kid was enraptured.

The deal MAY make you better in 2 years. It makes us better now, and it makes us better in 2 years.
- Der Kaiser

We are 29th. How much better NOW are we?

The Sabres needed him as a foundation to build on too.
Its unfortunate for your team that you were in a position where you had to just pull the trigger on him, but he is exactly what this team hasnt had since Chris Drury.
As a Sabres fan, I make that trade every day and twice on Sunday.
- seedy

Avs had to make 1 painful trade eventually and since its almost next to impossible to get a true established top 4 dman via trade, you have to develop them yourself, so picking up Zads, being patient to develop into his potential, thats the only way they would get close to full return on ROR.

We are 29th. How much better NOW are we?
- sbroads24

One. One better.

We are 29th. How much better NOW are we?
- sbroads24

It almost as though you have decided to be unreasonable.

It's easier to be negative than positive given our position in the standings.

It's easier to be negative than positive given our position in the standings.
- RhinoFan

Easy is not the path...you have to "earn" your happiness.

It's easier to be negative than positive given our position in the standings.
- RhinoFan

I feel like watching the games this year is way easier than last year,despite the losses.
They still have a lot to work on, but the occasional 3rd period comeback or 5 unanswered goal wins makes me positive about them.

I feel like watching the games this year is way easier than last year,despite the losses.
They still have a lot to work on, but the occasional 3rd period comeback or 5 unanswered goal wins makes me positive about them.
- seedy

Word, young man. word.

The deal MAY make you better in 2 years. It makes us better now, and it makes us better in 2 years.
- Der Kaiser

I like McGinn. Lots.

Easy is not the path...you have to "earn" your happiness.
- LandlordTom

I'm overjoyed with the direction. I'm pleased with the prospects that have turned pros for us. I guess it's how hard you make yourself 'earn' happiness.

Lehner is a bust without playing a game
Eichel is lazy
Larsson is a bust

I disagree strongly with these three statements. I think they are gravitated to because of our lack of rise in the standings is all.

Eichel is fantastic
Lehner hasnt played a game so who knows
Larsson was (I think) our best forward last year and is still young

Glass half full vs Glass half empty

Word, young man. word.
- LandlordTom

But we're 29th?

But we're 29th?
- Der Kaiser

And Ringo was the drummer whom nobody respected, but he had the most #1 hits after the band broke up. Stats have no place here.

Some observations:

-Currently, Buffalo has a 48.2% Corsi for. Last year we had a 37.5%. In a statistic where even 1% is huge, we are more than 10% improved. We are MUCH better.

-Jack Eichel leads the team in 5v5 points with 15 (Risto is second with 14)

-Risto and Georges have CF% of 45.7 and 47.8 respectively, but have played the toughest competition with defensive zone starts.

-Eichel has very poor possession numbers (-4.0 Corsi for relative to teammates). He is not a complete player yet.

-Pysyk, Moulson, Reinhart, and Zemgus are the only positive corsi players on the team (Pysyk is first)

-Nic Deslauries is our worst possession player with 39.5%. I nominate him for worst player on the team

And Ringo was the drummer whom nobody respected, but he had the most #1 hits after the band broke up. Stats have no place here.
- LandlordTom

Also, Barbara Bacman v Yoko Ono v Linda McCarney v lose to Eric Clapton.

So who was the greatest Beatle?

Colorado was better than buffalo last season too.

For some reason people actually believe it is unacceptable for a young team to struggle to win games because murray made a few trades to help turn the corner on a total blow up tear down tank rebuild in year 3 instead of year 5, 6, or 7.

Maybe i didnt expect them to be at the very bottom of the standings. I also dont fail to see that based on their level of play, a 4 game winning streak isnt something farfectched and would potentially put us up by 20th overall. Something most here seem to agree is where they should be.
- ieetbred

Sounds about right.

Also, Barbara Bacman v Yoko Ono v Linda McCarney v lose to Eric Clapton.

So who was the greatest Beatle?
- Der Kaiser

Barbara Bach... nobody does it better! Ringo wins by a landslide simply cuz of her.