Doesn't Moulson have a no-trade clause?
- Pierceme69

limited

http://www.thefourthperiod.com/no_trade_list.html

gorges can be traded

kings wanted him earlier this season
- homiedclown

Wanting him and actually trading for him are totally different.

I only say that due to the length of his contract.

Rantanen would have been nice, but Larkin would have been amazing.

If you can get a 1st for him, you definitely trade him, and then take your chances at signing him as a UFA.
- kingcong39

perhaps, but I don't think that will happen unless its like a >25 overall 1st and at that point I'm not sure it's worth it. Most 1st round picks don't even translate into 20 goal scorers.

But, I also don't think McGinn is going to demand $4.5M or more as some have said.....his agent is not a complete idiot, knows no one will pay that for a player who, while he may hit 20 goals this season, has not consistently produced at that level....yet.

Let's say a team in the top 5 says we will trade you our pick for your other 1st, both of your 2nds, Ennis, and one of Borgen, Martin, Florentino, or Guhle, would you do it?
- kingcong39

Where is this other 1st? If it's like 20 then yeah I do it. It'd hurt losing all of that from the prospect pool however.

perhaps, but I don't think that will happen unless its like a >25 overall 1st and at that point I'm not sure it's worth it. Most 1st round picks don't even translate into 20 goal scorers.

But, I also don't think McGinn is going to demand $4.5M or more as some have said.....his agent is not a complete idiot, knows no one will pay that for a player who, while he may hit 20 goals this season, has not consistently produced at that level....yet.
- nikel

While I understand your point of view, if someone like the Kings or Hawks offered their 1st for him, I would take it and run.

perhaps, but I don't think that will happen unless its like a >25 overall 1st and at that point I'm not sure it's worth it. Most 1st round picks don't even translate into 20 goal scorers.

But, I also don't think McGinn is going to demand $4.5M or more as some have said.....his agent is not a complete idiot, knows no one will pay that for a player who, while he may hit 20 goals this season, has not consistently produced at that level....yet.
- nikel

If he comes and says 3.5 for 3 years I'll be happy. I feel like he'll want more than that. I'm thinking 4+ and I think someone will pay it. Just don't know if I would. 4 would likely be my high

Where is this other 1st? If it's like 20 then yeah I do it. It'd hurt losing all of that from the prospect pool however.
- Zschalberg

It was only a possibility if they got a late 1st for McGinn.

Yes, it would hurt losing that late 1st, both 2nds, and someone like Guhle, Borgen, Florentino, or Martin from the prospect pool, but the player they would get would be too much to pass up.

That said, I don't believe any team drafting 3 through 5 would think that was enough coming back.

everyone wants to move Larsson

2 spots still need to be filled on top 6, if girgens is one of those spots, larsson anchors 3rd line

there are no center prospects in the pipeline
- homiedclown

Larsson got me Nichuskin in a video game the other night... one for one....

Not that it matters.... just saying. He was useful to me.

I'm not saying I don't want him. I'm saying I don't want him for the cost it is going to bring and the term along with it. McGinn is having a career year and is far surpassing my expectations for him. He's looked great offensively, has worked with O'Reilly, and has helped us win games.

That said, his career high in goals is 19 and points is 38. This year he has 20 points in 43 games, albeit, on a team that is very hard pressed to score. 40 points isn't a great 2nd line player on a good team but I'm not saying it's something to sneeze at either. If he wants a term of 3-5 years I don't know if I want to pay him for that long.

If Tim Murray comes out tomorrow and says that McGinn was re-signed for 4.5M for 4 years I'm not going to be up in arms about it. I just don't know if I would do it myself.
- Zschalberg

yeah, i agree.

I also think that people are over-exagerating what we think his contract demand will be. As others have said, his agent is not an idiot....knows he's not going to get the world after one good season.

It only looks that way because of how bad we are right now. On a good team he's a thrid liner who you wouldn't mind keeping around but wouldn't blink twice if you had to move on from him. He's already making close to three mil, if he's asking for any sort of raise I would move on from that.
- Sabresfan-365

The thing is thoug, 4MM is kind of the going rate for an average forward now.

I keep McGinn. He can play on any line the PK and PP and has shown that.

Larsson got me Nichuskin in a video game the other night... one for one....

Not that it matters.... just saying. He was useful to me.
- JVince11

Wait a minute - if this guy is nothing but an interchangeable 3d liner, isn't his agent going to recognize that a 150% increase in his current salary is unrealisitic?
- Der Kaiser

First off, the interchangeable 3rd liner was Larsson.

Second, someone will over pay for McGinn if he goes to FA, so his agent should be asking for the moon at this point.

the big question is

is girgens a second line player on a decent nhl team

if not, what is the return for girgens on the trade market
the return for larsson on the trade market

in the next 4 years, larsson will cost you a lot less on your payroll then girgens

If he comes and says 3.5 for 3 years I'll be happy. I feel like he'll want more than that. I'm thinking 4+ and I think someone will pay it. Just don't know if I would. 4 would likely be my high
- Zschalberg

2 years at $4 million per or 3 years at $3.75 million I'm good with. Anything more I would say goodbye at the trade deadline

Larsson got me Nichuskin in a video game the other night... one for one....

Not that it matters.... just saying. He was useful to me.
- JVince11

He got me a Wild 2016 1st straight up, which ended up being top 5 pick. Oh video games.

But seriously, the player values are fairly accurate, but just because you meet the "value" does not mean GM's would do it.

2 years at $4 million per or 3 years at $3.75 million I'm good with. Anything more I would say goodbye at the trade deadline
- Stripes77

I think he can be signed for a 3 year deal in the 10-10.5 mil range

of course the time is now to lock him up

DO SOMETHING TIM MURRAY

the big question is

is girgens a second line player on a decent nhl team

if not, what is the return for girgens on the trade market
the return for larsson on the trade market

in the next 4 years, larsson will cost you a lot less on your payroll then girgens
- homiedclown

Girgensons is 10x the player that Larsson is.... that is not even a contest.

Girgensons also has a 30 and a 22 pt season under his belt in the NHL. Larsson's best season was 16 pts. Sure different line up spots and all but still.

Girgensons is also much better defensively on the ice. Larsson is no slouch but Girgensons 3rd line goes against every team's top line this season.

W/O looking it up I'd assume Zemgus is better on the dot too.

Girgensons is 10x the player that Larsson is.... that is not even a contest.

Girgensons also has a 30 and a 22 pt season under his belt in the NHL. Larsson's best season was 16 pts. Sure different line up spots and all but still.

Girgensons is also much better defensively on the ice. Larsson is no slouch but Girgensons 3rd line goes against every team's top line this season.

W/O looking it up I'd assume Zemgus is better on the dot too.
- JVince11

Maybe his point was, trade Girgensons + to get a top 3 young player (that is better / project to be better then Girgensons) and keep Larsson. Not sure if that was the thought.

He got me a Wild 2016 1st straight up, which ended up being top 5 pick. Oh video games.

But seriously, the player values are fairly accurate, but just because you meet the "value" does not mean GM's would do it.
- Lilroot9

True statement.. I've been trying to get Nyquist or Ehlers for some time now and i'm not giving up that much. I even had more on my side for Nyquist and it said he "not even a thought needed to deny this trade".

I already traded and got Markstrom, Gipson, Boedker, Nichuskin, Hertl, and Dumba

Girgensons is 10x the player that Larsson is.... that is not even a contest.

Girgensons also has a 30 and a 22 pt season under his belt in the NHL. Larsson's best season was 16 pts. Sure different line up spots and all but still.

Girgensons is also much better defensively on the ice. Larsson is no slouch but Girgensons 3rd line goes against every team's top line this season.

W/O looking it up I'd assume Zemgus is better on the dot too.
- JVince11

yeah but what kind of return does girgens get you?

what kind of return does larsson get you?


if girgens is a fixture on the top 6, no reason to have this conversation but if he is not, does girgens in a package get you that top 6 winger, or #2 d man?

Larsson will be nothing more than a throw in for a trade where Gus is a centerpiece


plus Girgens will probably make 3 times more money in the coming years and it is a cap era

my 2 cents

sabres need to move any player they do not envision being on their roster next year (UFA's)

legwand
mcginn (if can't sign him)
weber
colaiacovo
johnson


try to move moulson/gionta

- homiedclown

No reason to move Johnson. He seems to be a good goaltender and you wouldn't get more than probably a 4th for him.

Maybe his point was, trade Girgensons + to get a top 3 young player (that is better / project to be better then Girgensons) and keep Larsson. Not sure if that was the thought.
- Lilroot9

I wouldn't do it... we have a PERFECT 1, 2, and 3 centers in our system right now. All at a young age too. Larsson can play wing as well. Larsson and Girgensons on the 3rd line together have been shut down line... why break it up??

Much rather trade guys like Baptiste, Bailey, Ennis, Moulson, Gionta, Foligno, McGinn (if not resigning), etc to try to get top 6 talent than to trade off a centerpiece of our young core.

yeah but what kind of return does girgens get you?

what kind of return does larsson get you?


if girgens is a fixture on the top 6, no reason to have this conversation but if he is not, does girgens in a package get you that top 6 winger, or #2 d man?

Larsson will be nothing more than a throw in for a trade where Gus is a centerpiece


plus Girgens will probably make 3 times more money in the coming years and it is a cap era
- homiedclown

I believe the term is cap management...

It all depends on where GMTM sees Girgensons fitting in on this team. Top 6 or 3rd line center.

yeah but what kind of return does girgens get you?

what kind of return does larsson get you?


if girgens is a fixture on the top 6, no reason to have this conversation but if he is not, does girgens in a package get you that top 6 winger, or #2 d man?

Larsson will be nothing more than a throw in for a trade where Gus is a centerpiece


plus Girgens will probably make 3 times more money in the coming years and it is a cap era
- homiedclown

The way this team is built we don't need to worry about cap casualties yet IMO.

Girgensons is a perfect 3C shut down... or can play in top 6 minutes as well as on your PK. Larsson can't fill those shoes. Larsson has similar defensive abilities. That's it.

That's regression to me. Every team needs a Girgensons type player.

this season on the dot

larsson won 140, lost 143 49.5%

girgens won 123 lost 148 45.4%