If you have to qualify the statement with "other than player x" then the example is not very good.
- neem55

Well most teams aren't blessed with a generational dman like him no are they? If we draft one then fine I'm ok with him getting 25-30 mins a night. But I've waited 40 years for one and he hasn't come along yet. So until he does...I think balance is the better course of action.

Ok, well there are around 7-8 teams that have won the cup in the past 10 years. Surely one of them have won using this type of defence?

Forget about dmen for awhile reported that Tampa has only offered Stamkos $8.5 million a year. Does that make anyone say hmm?
- allsports

It's fair....he's no towes or kopitar. And his numbers are declining already.

Ok, well there are around 7-8 teams that have won the cup in the past 10 years. Surely one of them have won using this type of defence?
- neem55

No...they all had a true number 1 though didn't they?

We'll I thank you for that. My point was never about replacing him for similar value or cap hit. It's about flexibility and improving this team going forward. This team will not compete for a cup again while the twins and old core are still here. So why hold on to an asset like Edler ? (Can't believe I used the word asset and Edler in the same sentence). He has value no doubt, I believe he is far more valuable right now as a trade chip then a player. If you could turn him into Shea Theodore and a first round pick+ 4 mil in cap space can you not see the value in such a move considering the state the franchise is in right now? I don't see him as a good mentor...quite frankly he's always on the wrong side of the puck and positionaly he's a moron. I want a defensive warrior like willie Mitchell or hammer to mentor my young dmen. They may be slow but atleast they stay on the right side of the puck. Not sure if this is coming across right. But it's what I think is best for the team moving forward.
- Bullfrog77

While Edler is not "elite" to move a sbisa or hutton into the top pairing with Tanev would expose them to a degree that they are not ready for. We would still need to get 5 more players that could play for 20 min. per. None of the existing(excluding Hammer) Defencemen are capable of playing much more then 17 minutes a night over the coarse of an 82 game season.

We would still need to sign or trade for another defencemen to help shelter the theoretical Theadores of the team.

You did say that "Edler was replaceable for half his salary(sic)" or maybe it was getting "two better defencemen for his salary(sic)" but whichever it was it still begs the question of what players are out there that we could pick up.

In the current UFA and trade market we still need Edler as there is no replacement for him for the value that he brings. I would also think that if he was a #2 or a #3 and played slightly less minutes then even you would begrudgingly see that he is making less mistakes( this is in direct correlation to the number of minutes played).

A team full of Tanevs, mitchells, hamhuis would be solid but not very effective, a blend of these types of defensive stalwarts mixed with players like Edler, Hutton, the bieksas of old, is the best mix you can have, In my opinion. It doesn't hurt if one of those players is a chara or a doughty either.

Fixed: Tanev can play 20 minutes as well as Hammer, Four more if we resign Hammer

Yzerman trying to Fleece Benning by Asking for Horvat straight up in a trade with Vancouver for Drouin.

Yzerman would have to add at this point in time.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/w...th-trade-request-1.427299

A redraft of 2013 would have Drouin being drafted after Horvat.

No...they all had a true number 1 though didn't they?
- Bullfrog77

They all played 4 guys 24-to 30 minutes, none of them 6 players 20-22 minutes is actually a more accurate description.

It's fair....he's no towes or kopitar. And his numbers are declining already.
- Bullfrog77

I don't know why but I still think that Cooper is under utilizing him so his numbers may be down so you'd think that some team will offer him the max anyways

While Edler is not "elite" to move a sbisa or hutton into the top pairing with Tanev would expose them to a degree that they are not ready for. We would still need to get 5 more players that could play for 20 min. per. None of the existing(excluding Hammer) Defencemen are capable of playing much more then 17 minutes a night over the coarse of an 82 game season.

We would still need to sign or trade for another defencemen to help shelter the theoretical Theadores of the team.

You did say that "Edler was replaceable for half his salary(sic)" or maybe it was getting "two better defencemen for his salary(sic)" but whichever it was it still begs the question of what players are out there that we could pick up.

In the current UFA and trade market we still need Edler as there is no replacement for him for the value that he brings. I would also think that if he was a #2 or a #3 and played slightly less minutes then even you would begrudgingly see that he is making less mistakes( this is in direct correlation to the number of minutes played).

A team full of Tanevs, mitchells, hamhuis would be solid but not very effective, a blend of these types of defensive stalwarts mixed with players like Edler, Hutton, the bieksas of old, is the best mix you can have, In my opinion. It doesn't hurt if one of those players is a chara or a doughty either.
- Pres.cup

why do we "have to do any of those things"? We've replaced almost two thirds of our forward group with rookies and ahl players and we are more then half way through the season , still in a playoff spot. Why can't the defence be rebuilt the same way? Just because willie chooses to play Edler as much as he does , that does not mean someone else can't do it. Considering he ends up -3 most nights i think it speaks for itself that you need to make changes. I've watched Edler since jr. Was a rockets season ticket holder he has never been a good defenceman. He used to score...and he used to play the body. That made up for his poor decisions and positional play somewhat. But the scoring and physicality have been gone for a long time. All we have left is a poor decision making positionaly unsound defenceman. We can do so much better by moving him.

Yzerman trying to Fleece Benning by Asking for Horvat straight up in a trade with Vancouver for Drouin.

Yzerman would have to add at this point in time.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/w...th-trade-request-1.427299

A redraft of 2013 would have Drouin being drafted after Horvat.
- classic321

It's fine that Yzerman can ask but the selling price is obviously coming down for some teams based on what Drouin has done. Someone will probably go for it though unless it goes into the off-season.

Yzerman trying to Fleece Benning by Asking for Horvat straight up in a trade with Vancouver for Drouin.

Yzerman would have to add at this point in time.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/w...th-trade-request-1.427299

A redraft of 2013 would have Drouin being drafted after Horvat.
- classic321

If JB makes that deal he best get one of those bullet proof pope mobiles cause the rioters in van city gonna turn into snipers if Bo gets moved.

It's fine that Yzerman can ask but the selling price is obviously coming down for some teams based on what Drouin has done. Someone will probably go for it though unless it goes into the off-season.
- allsports

Everyday his value is dropping

Guy thinks he pull a Lindros.

why do we "have to do any of those things"? We've replaced almost two thirds of our forward group with rookies and ahl players and we are more then half way through the season , still in a playoff spot. Why can't the defence be rebuilt the same way? Just because willie chooses to play Edler as much as he does , that does not mean someone else can't do it. Considering he ends up -3 most nights i think it speaks for itself that you need to make changes. I've watched Edler since jr. Was a rockets season ticket holder he has never been a good defenceman. He used to score...and he used to play the body. That made up for his poor decisions and positional play somewhat. But the scoring and physicality have been gone for a long time. All we have left is a poor decision making positionaly unsound defenceman. We can do so much better by moving him.
- Bullfrog77

the defence currently has 2/6 rookies, the forwards 2/12. bart is young, Sbisa is young. I'm not a math-magician but I'm pretty sure that is what were doing on the backend. Much like with the forwards, we have a couple pf vets to buffer the young guys, cause it is not too smart to put kids in top 4 roles too early.

why do we "have to do any of those things"? We've replaced almost two thirds of our forward group with rookies and ahl players and we are more then half way through the season , still in a playoff spot. Why can't the defence be rebuilt the same way? Just because willie chooses to play Edler as much as he does , that does not mean someone else can't do it. Considering he ends up -3 most nights i think it speaks for itself that you need to make changes. I've watched Edler since jr. Was a rockets season ticket holder he has never been a good defenceman. He used to score...and he used to play the body. That made up for his poor decisions and positional play somewhat. But the scoring and physicality have been gone for a long time. All we have left is a poor decision making positionaly unsound defenceman. We can do so much better by moving him.
- Bullfrog77

Because on forward we have 2 Elite players, futer HOFers, who can help shelter the kids. Edler is as close to that(and he's not close) as we have on the back end.

Because on forward we have 2 Elite players, futer HOFers, who can help shelter the kids. Edler is as close to that(and he's not close) as we have on the back end.
- Pres.cup

Really doesn't matter...we have atleast 3 years before this team is ready to seriously push for playoffs and have a chance at atleast winning a round. If we keep holding on to our number one guy then you can push that number to five years. When JB is finally willing to move him he won't get us poop. Be another Higgins / Burrows type scenario. Time to maximize and shorten our rebuild is this season and next. If we haven't transitioned to a new core...we will be (frank)ed.

Because on forward we have 2 Elite players, futer HOFers, who can help shelter the kids. Edler is as close to that(and he's not close) as we have on the back end.
- Pres.cup

Not to mention, to upgrade would cost us more than we could afford and end up depleting the little bit of depth we have at forward and we'd end up going backwards instead of forwards. Edler is fine for now, we have no one better and we aren't in a position to trade the type of assets that would be needed to upgrade.

Yzerman trying to Fleece Benning by Asking for Horvat straight up in a trade with Vancouver for Drouin.

Yzerman would have to add at this point in time.

http://www.tsn.ca/radio/w...th-trade-request-1.427299

A redraft of 2013 would have Drouin being drafted after Horvat.
- classic321

The way Horvat is playing, he will be the best player from that draft class.

*goes and checks who else was drafted that year

lol...I hear that.

Well I'm in Red Deer Alberta so it's a bit of a commute but I'm sure we could make it work...lol...
- LordHumungous

Oh yes....I hadnt looked at your location in awhile.
Was a thought anyways. Not many people out there who own quality instruments.

btw I should share that I really like using cobalt strings with my american standard stratocaster. Also replaced the bridge on that, which has an excellent stainless steel tone block on it. The bridge, cobalt strings on that have made it an absolute beast!

Really doesn't matter...we have atleast 3 years before this team is ready to seriously push for playoffs and have a chance at atleast winning a round. If we keep holding on to our number one guy then you can push that number to five years. When JB is finally willing to move him he won't get us poop. Be another Higgins / Burrows type scenario. Time to maximize and shorten our rebuild is this season and next. If we haven't transitioned to a new core...we will be (frank)ed.
- Bullfrog77

What you are looking for isn't available, Trouba, Reilly, Nurse, Dumba and Josi are all untouchable. Harmonic is available, but NYI wants minimum Tanev+ (either one of BH, JV, JM or our 1st rounder which is a non-starter).

The way Horvat is playing, he will be the best player from that draft class.

*goes and checks who else was drafted that year
- Scooby_Doo

My Redraft
1) Mackinnon
2) Barkov
3) Risto
4) Jones
5) Monahan
6) Domi
7) Lindholm
8) Horvat
9) Nurse
10 Drouin or Theodore

What you are looking for isn't available, Trouba, Reilly, Nurse, Dumba and Josi are all untouchable. Harmonic is available, but NYI wants minimum Tanev+ (either one of BH, JV, JM or our 1st rounder which is a non-starter).
- DariusKnight

The price for Hamonic will go down if it drags out to the offseason. I admit I like Hamonic, and as much as I like Tanev, if the right deal showed up for Benning why wouldn't you pull the trigger as Hamonic is close to being an all star right now.

What you are looking for isn't available, Trouba, Reilly, Nurse, Dumba and Josi are all untouchable. Harmonic is available, but NYI wants minimum Tanev+ (either one of BH, JV, JM or our 1st rounder which is a non-starter).
- DariusKnight

No it's not....but my plan gives us a couple years to draft a couple

My Redraft
1) Mackinnon
2) Barkov
3) Risto
4) Jones
5) Monahan
6) Domi
7) Lindholm
8) Horvat
9) Nurse
10 Drouin or Theodore
- classic321

This is pretty fair for the next few years

The price for Hamonic will go down if it drags out to the offseason. I admit I like Hamonic, and as much as I like Tanev, if the right deal showed up for Benning why wouldn't you pull the trigger as Hamonic is close to being an all star right now.
- allsports

Sign Stamkos and the trade McCann for Hamonic.

Disclaimer: I have drank a lot tonight.

My Redraft
1) Mackinnon
2) Barkov
3) Risto
4) Jones
5) Monahan
6) Domi
7) Lindholm
8) Horvat
9) Nurse
10 Drouin or Theodore
- classic321

Wow, way off. Mine looks like this.

Horvat
Barkov
Ristolainen
Monahan
Jones
Mackinnon
Domi
Drouin
Nurse
Lindholm