LOL. Am I being too mean? I asked if you watched other hockey games besides the Flyers dude...

Can Jake score 30 goals? I dont know, he hasn't yet and may never. But if he is scoring 70-80 points then should I really care if he scores 30? nope, not at all.

elite player and elite goal scorer are not the same thing
- YuenglingJagr

So if I say Voracek is an elite passer/playmaker but not an elite player, I'm getting the feeling you'll disagree, right?

And like I've said from the start, Jake being elite is debatable. I don't believe him to be elite but that's me. Being 11th isn't top 10, now is it? Is hea future fall of famer? Is he on top of the leader boards every year in points? Can he score 30 or more yearly? I mean, you googled and collected what he's done for the past 4 seasons and piled it together to make your point. What about yearly? What about right now?
- SuperSchennBros

Why do you think a player has to score 30 goals every year to be elite? Joe Thornton led the league in scoring in the 2000's, and has 1300 points, and only hit 30 goals twice in 18 NHL seasons. Henrik Sedin has never cracked 30 goals, but he was elite for a good long stretch.

Voracek has been elite for the past four years. To make the HoF he'll have to keep that up for many more years to come.

Jake Voracek hasn't cracked 30...at all! Are we comparing Voracek to Oates now because Adam Oates is a hall of famer. Peter Forsberg was also not a healthy player.
- SuperSchennBros

My whole point is that it doesnt matter if he has scored 30 goals or not.

No I am not comparing Oates and Voracek. Im simply stating that you dont need to score 30 goals to be an elite player.

So if I say Voracek is an elite passer/playmaker but not an elite player, I'm getting the feeling you'll disagree, right?
- SuperSchennBros

I disagree

Streit is uber elite
- Streit2ThePoint

So he's a great driver?

Giroux leads the league in scoring this decade without ever having hit 30 goals.

http://www.quanthockey.co...0s-nhl-players-stats.html



Now you're struggling with the concept that some players don't hit their peak till their early 20's or later? Ever heard of the Sedins?
- Feanor

Yeah, except the Sedins don't struggle part from what I've seen. If one gets hurt, they still stay pretty good solo.

That paragraph would get a red mark in a middle school English class. It makes no sense whatsoever.

My whole point is that it doesnt matter if he has scored 30 goals or not.

No I am not comparing Oates and Voracek. Im simply stating that you dont need to score 30 goals to be an elite player.
- jak521

You also don't need to make the HoF to have been an elite player over an extended period of time. See Lindros, Eric.

You also don't need to make the HoF to have been an elite player over an extended period of time. See Lindros, Eric.
- Feanor

Im seriously perplexed.

I disagree
- YuenglingJagr

What do you mean? If elite scorer and elite player are different, isn't elite playmaker different too??

That paragraph would get a red mark in a middle school English class. It makes no sense whatsoever.



You also don't need to make the HoF to have been an elite player over an extended period of time. See Lindros, Eric.
- Feanor

Eric Lindros should be in the hall of fame!!

My whole point is that it doesnt matter if he has scored 30 goals or not.

No I am not comparing Oates and Voracek. Im simply stating that you dont need to score 30 goals to be an elite player.
- jak521

Yeah, except Oates and Forsberg did score goals, even threw long term injury.

Eric Lindros should be in the hall of fame!!
- SuperSchennBros

Meh, injuries.

Over/under on how many pages of this thread are wasted discussing Jake Voracek's possibly being elite?

WHO GIVES A (frank)!!!

All I know is that he is an excellent player and we should be happy to have him on the roster.

Im seriously perplexed.
- jak521

When Voracek put on a puck possession/goal scoring clinic to win the game in OT I didn't expect the main topic of conversation the next day would be how he's supposedly not elite.

I guess I need to lower my expectations.

Yeah, except Oates and Forsberg did score goals, even threw long term injury.
- SuperSchennBros

how far?

Yeah, except Oates and Forsberg did score goals, even threw long term injury.
- SuperSchennBros

Jake has scored over 20 goals his last three seasons. Thats exactly what Oates and Forsberg did for nearly their entire careers.

I'm more excited that Crosby is still not an All-Star.

Over/under on how many pages of this thread are wasted discussing Jake Voracek's possibly being elite?

WHO GIVES A (frank)!!!

All I know is that he is an excellent player and we should be happy to have him on the roster.
- BiggE

Dude's a (frank)in animal when he gets going.

When Voracek put on a puck possession/goal scoring clinic to win the game in OT I didn't expect the main topic of conversation the next day would be how he's supposedly not elite.

I guess I need to lower my expectations.
- Feanor

Well it was his fault that they sucked before that.

Meh, injuries.
- jak521

You are so on your own with this one.

Yeah, except Oates and Forsberg did score goals, even threw long term injury.
- SuperSchennBros

Forsberg scored 0.35 goals per game for his career. He was an elite player, not an elite goal scorer.

You are so on your own with this one.
- SuperSchennBros

Sarcasm.. forget it.

Holy cannoli.

What do you mean? If elite scorer and elite player are different, isn't elite playmaker different too??
- SuperSchennBros

I was just being a Richard there...yes they are all different things, but you are saying Voracek is not an elite player even though by most measurable statistics, he clearly is. You even brought up the questions in one of your posts, but if you actually took the time to answer them you would see he is.

There is no question Jake is an elite playmaker, but he is also an elite player. He would be the best player in the league if he became an elite goal scorer as well...what you have conjured up in your head is unattainable.

From your posts it seems like in order to be an elite player you have to:
score 30 goals per season multiple times
have a high amount of career points and goals
be in the hall of fame
be lite out
score on a nightly basis and in shootouts

Jake has scored over 20 goals his last three seasons. Thats exactly what Oates and Forsberg did for nearly their entire careers.
- jak521

So what exactly? We are comparing Voracek's last 4 seasons to Oates and Forsberg's entire career. Am I following?

In other news. How about Ghost last night.. Kids a stud.