We know the oilers won another after the trade.....the question was how many did the oilers win after the trade and how many did Gretzky win on any team after that. Neem doesn't want to answer it because it shows my exact point. Everyone is replaceable.
- Bullfrog77

You rather conveniently forget to point out that the Oilers won 4 with Gretzky, and that Gretzky eliminated them while with LA one year and also went to the finals another year and were an illegal stick call away from holding a 2-0 lead on the road.

I'll try this from a different angle. Do any of you see Edler as a player that will get us to a cup final ? You all say he's good. Fine...by the time this team is even close to being playoff calibre again Edler will be old busted worthless junk. We've rebuilt the bulk of the forwards why not maximize our assets and cap space and do the same with the defence ? You all complain on here about holding on to players too long and getting a garbage return. That's exactly what you are campaigning for in keeping Edler. He's never reached potential and has already regressed in play. Move him now before he brings nothing back. Build the new core !!!

We know the oilers won another after the trade.....the question was how many did the oilers win after the trade and how many did Gretzky win on any team after that. Neem doesn't want to answer it because it shows my exact point. Everyone is replaceable.
- Bullfrog77

i don't want to answer because it doesn't actually prove your point, despite the fact that in your simple-jack world it does. When players go to the SCF and lose they are still successful. When they are the best player, they are still the best player. The definition of best implies that they cannot be replaced one for one. It's a logical flaw known as inconsistent comparison. The LA kings were a terrible team before Gretzky, he made them a playoff contender. Edmonton was far and away the best team in hockey, after they traded him they were still great. He beat that great team the next year playing in LA the next year, which I've mentioned.

You rather conveniently forget to point out that the Oilers won 4 with Gretzky, and that Gretzky eliminated them while with LA one year and also went to the finals another year and were an illegal stick call away from holding a 2-0 lead on the road.
- golfingsince

So you're saying the trade is only relevant for the year immediatly after the trade? I don't think so.

I'll try this from a different angle. Do any of you see Edler as a player that will get us to a cup final ? You all say he's good. Fine...by the time this team is even close to being playoff calibre again Edler will be old busted worthless junk. We've rebuilt the bulk of the forwards why not maximize our assets and cap space and do the same with the defence ? You all complain on here about holding on to players too long and getting a garbage return. That's exactly what you are campaigning for in keeping Edler. He's never reached potential and has already regressed in play. Move him now before he brings nothing back. Build the new core !!!

- Bullfrog77

So, completely tank.

i don't want to answer because it doesn't actually prove your point, despite the fact that in your simple-jack world it does. When players go to the SCF and lose they are still successful. When they are the best player, they are still the best player. The definition of best implies that they cannot be replaced one for one. It's a logical flaw known as inconsistent comparison. The LA kings were a terrible team before Gretzky, he made them a playoff contender. Edmonton was far and away the best team in hockey, after they traded him they were still great. He beat that great team the next year playing in LA the next year, which I've mentioned.
- neem55

Keep banging that drum. No ones buyin it. Oilers 1 Gretzky 0. That's the facts of the matter . Oilers retooled with the assets they got and won. Gretzky never did again. Completely proves the point any player can be replaced and still be successful

So you're saying the trade is only relevant for the year immediatly after the trade? I don't think so.
- Bullfrog77

So, completely tank.
- neem55

Are we tanking? No they are trying their best. But they suck. No denying we will be bottom 5 -7 in the league. How long do you wanna stay there? Move the dead weight and bloated salary and move forward. This team won't win with him....so why not be proactive and start building the team that will win without him. So narrow minded .

Ok that's what she was trying to express.


I was looking at this conversation here and thought hell no, I will see what the wife is talking about she said pigary. I asked her 15 times to repeat it , because of her accent. I asked her to spell it.

I asked what it was she said raising pigs on a farm .

So here I am back here, how bout that Gretzky guy
- VANTEL

It's kind of sad that you have to come to HB to figure out what your wife is talking about. It's a little crazy in here today, I'm expecting it to be quiet in here tonight.

Only trade Elder if it's a smart hockey trade. No sense dumping him just because you don't think he is a #1. Strong,big D with experience are hard to come by and they are the core of your team. A solid D core makes everyone better on the team

Keep banging that drum. No ones buyin it. Oilers 1 Gretzky 0. That's the facts of the matter . Oilers retooled with the assets they got and won. Gretzky never did again. Completely proves the point any player can be replaced and still be successful
- Bullfrog77

Pretty sure yours is the only opinion no-one is buying. You've done nothing to support the logic of your argument, or any of your arguments.

For example, you claim Edler has regressed but have no relevant statistics to support your claim. Rather you appeal to claims such as "he sucks" and "he's on the wrong side of the puck" which are literally meaningless statements.

Several people on here have clarified that nobody think he's the number 1 guy, but he is the best we've got. This is a claim that can be supported by relevant statistics. Such as possession number, corsi, Ice-time relative to elite competition ect.

Now I'm not saying there is nothing to the eye test, Edler is far from the guy who puts fear into opponents for example. I have listened to your arguments, they are not well constructed.

The best thing I think you could say is that we would be a much worse team w/o Edler, which means we get a better draft picks for 2 or 3 year in which hopefully we snag his replacement. ie trade Edler=good for pumpkin

I thought Cap Space was gonna suit up for Edler.
- golfingsince

Suspended.
PED's.

Only trade Elder if it's a smart hockey trade. No sense dumping him just because you don't think he is a #1. Strong,big D with experience are hard to come by and they are the core of your team. A solid D core makes everyone better on the team
- 69Mach1

This team has all but sunk to the bottom already. What does that say about the strong solid D core of the team?

It's kind of sad that you have to come to HB to figure out what your wife is talking about. It's a little crazy in here today, I'm expecting it to be quiet in here tonight.
- A_SteamingLombardi

True

Pretty sure yours is the only opinion no-one is buying. You've done nothing to support the logic of your argument, or any of your arguments.

For example, you claim Edler has regressed but have no relevant statistics to support your claim. Rather you appeal to claims such as "he sucks" and "he's on the wrong side of the puck" which are literally meaningless statements.

Several people on here have clarified that nobody think he's the number 1 guy, but he is the best we've got. This is a claim that can be supported by relevant statistics. Such as possession number, corsi, Ice-time relative to elite competition ect.

Now I'm not saying there is nothing to the eye test, Edler is far from the guy who puts fear into opponents for example. I have listened to your arguments, they are not well constructed.

The best thing I think you could say is that we would be a much worse team w/o Edler, which means we get a better draft picks for 2 or 3 year in which hopefully we snag his replacement. ie trade Edler=good for pumpkin
- neem55

there is no pumpkin....just a bad team. Bad teams need to be changed. The best way to change this team is to dump the dead weight and start fresh. JB has reworked the forwards the best he can with what he has to work with. But we will still be bad. The defence needs to go through the same. There's limitless options in which to do this. But you want to just sit there and say We can't replace Edler. My point is you can replace anyone, you just have to step out on the limb and do it. How much worse can we fall? From 5th from the bottom to dead last? That's where we will be with him or without. Take the younger assets and move forward and maybe we can do this a few years quicker. Or we can go back to rental hell cause were so close to being a playoff team! Last 30 games of the season....bet this team doesn't win 12 of em. Quit dreaming and start rebuilding.

I still enjoy watching them play and am impressed with Tan man, Hutton, Bulldog.
Elder has his moments and needs coaching to be as good as he can be. Unless it's blow out.... a good Canucks game and a beer in the winter is almost as good as having a beer after mens rec league game

This team has all but sunk to the bottom already. What does that say about the strong solid D core of the team?
- Bullfrog77

You keep saying trade Edler for draft picks and restock with cap space. That sounds great in theory but it is much more difficult then just doing it. Even you want to "sign 2 Biega's" with Edlers money, who exactly to want Benning to target? I don't recall you actually naming available players. Even if you have named a couple of those players, Benning actually has to get pen to paper while competing with other GMs which usually leads to overpayment.

Now let's go to the draft picks. Let's say we trade Edler for a late 1st. So we use our 1st (which should be top 10) and then the later pick and draft 2 D men. There isn't one d man in this draft that will be NHL ready next year. So let's be generous and give them 3 years of development. There is still no guarantee that either guy will be a top 4 (which Edler is no matter how much you hate him) or even good enough to play in the NHL altogether.

While Edler has his flaws, the idea of trading him will jumpstart the rebuild on the backend is also flawed and presents numerous challenges.

there is no pumpkin....just a bad team. Bad teams need to be changed. The best way to change this team is to dump the dead weight and start fresh. JB has reworked the forwards the best he can with what he has to work with. But we will still be bad. The defence needs to go through the same. There's limitless options in which to do this. But you want to just sit there and say We can't replace Edler. My point is you can replace anyone, you just have to step out on the limb and do it. How much worse can we fall? From 5th from the bottom to dead last? That's where we will be with him or without. Take the younger assets and move forward and maybe we can do this a few years quicker. Or we can go back to rental hell cause were so close to being a playoff team! Last 30 games of the season....bet this team doesn't win 12 of em. Quit dreaming and start rebuilding.
- Bullfrog77

I'm all for the rebuild but it has to be done smartly. If you just cut all the vets and bring in youth and potential you get the Oilers. The reason they have been able to bring in the young forwards is because of the twins, Hanson, Sutter ect. Now if strip down the back end and throw I a bunch of young guys they will get destroyed. (Even more so then now)

I still enjoy watching them play and am impressed with Tan man, Hutton, Bulldog.
Elder has his moments and needs coaching to be as good as he can be. Unless it's blow out.... a good Canucks game and a beer in the winter is almost as good as having a beer after mens rec league game
- 69Mach1

That's a seperate issue. I really enjoy watching the new blood play. Does my heart good. But we are only half way there. Our defence is worst in the league. I'd take the crap bag that is the oilers over ours Rather have a Darnell nurse coming up then an Alex Edler dragging us down.

You keep saying trade Edler for draft picks and restock with cap space. That sounds great in theory but it is much more difficult then just doing it. Even you want to "sign 2 Biega's" with Edlers money, who exactly to want Benning to target? I don't recall you actually naming available players. Even if you have named a couple of those players, Benning actually has to get pen to paper while competing with other GMs which usually leads to overpayment.

Now let's go to the draft picks. Let's say we trade Edler for a late 1st. So we use our 1st (which should be top 10) and then the later pick and draft 2 D men. There isn't one d man in this draft that will be NHL ready next year. So let's be generous and give them 3 years of development. There is still no guarantee that either guy will be a top 4 (which Edler is no matter how much you hate him) or even good enough to play in the NHL altogether.

While Edler has his flaws, the idea of trading him will jumpstart the rebuild on the backend is also flawed and presents numerous challenges.
- fiveandagame

Yes it has it's flaws. But where do you want to be in three years? Still holding on to Edler or with some youngsters coming? All teams will be squeezed by the cap shrinking. We will beable to eat contracts from teams having to dump. Take a pick and say a Matt Carle type move. STIll have a vet but you've added to the asset pool. Rinse and repeat. Wait for that guy you really want to have and Pay him ! It won't change where this team is in the standings atm. But it will speed up our process

People are actually saying Edler is useful?

He is worthless and does nothing to help this team win. He sucks defensively, can't shoot the puck through traffic and turns the puck over non stop. He plays a lot of minutes, that doesn't mean he eats minutes. He pukes them up all over the ice and let's other teams have the puck.

He has regressed constantly the past 3 years, he isn't and never will be the player everyone said he would be. Trade him while he still has value.

I thought Cap Space was gonna suit up for Edler.
- golfingsince

Haha nice. Cap space and John Scott! Cup is ours in 2017

Demko nominated for Hobbie Baker. 8 th shut out of the year

Oh christ, here we go with the verbal diarrhea about Edler again.
- Marwood

There needs to be a way to block view certain posters.