Crazy isnt it but I'm not very narrow minded so I don't suffer the same level of disappointment in that reality. Examples people keep pointing at are not exactly on a level playing field.

Of Hammer's teams, it looks like JB had two teams that were interested but were more interested in other moves. They made late offers that were low ball. People can choose to believe or not believe the only people who were in the war room or they can believe speculators who were not there until more creditable people who were there speak up.

No one wanted the junk on "The List" or believe me, they would have been gone unless they were just similar depth... no point in any more moves like that.
- boonerbuck

I like the sanity, and it seems I've been trying to say the same for over 97 pages in two blogs by Carol.

Glad to see that you're back.

Crazy isnt it but I'm not very narrow minded so I don't suffer the same level of disappointment in that reality. Examples people keep pointing at are not exactly on a level playing field.

Of Hammer's teams, it looks like JB had two teams that were interested but were more interested in other moves. They made late offers that were low ball. People can choose to believe or not believe the only people who were in the war room or they can believe speculators who were not there until more creditable people who were there speak up.

No one wanted the junk on "The List" or believe me, they would have been gone unless they were just similar depth... no point in any more moves like that.
- boonerbuck

Meh, i think the organization has spun it like they decided to pursue other avenues. Some of the guys out there going against the Canucks on what the return was are pretty credible. In fact, they seemed quite shocked the Canucks didn't pounce on the deals.

They aren't going to put their credibility on the line to feed the vultures in Vancouver. Even if you split it right down the middle, the Canucks messed up today.

I like the sanity, and it seems I've been trying to say the same for over 97 pages in two blogs by Carol.

Glad to see that you're back.
- Makita

Thanks. Good to be back.

I hear ya, but unless the Canucks are planning on resigning Hamhuis, getting nothing is completely unacceptable, even if it was a 5th or something along those lines.

I understand that pride, ego and setting bad precedents sometimes hinder deals, but sometimes that stuff needs to be put aside to get the job done.

With 5 minutes to go in the TDL, Benning should have been greasing his own hoop and over a barrel if that's what it took to get Hamhuis, Vrbata, Higgins and Burrows done.
- As_I_See_It

I completely agree with both you and Golfing, the optics are terrible, and like Golfing surmises that if FA was involved this team is in for a very long and rocky road, regardless of the GM, President or even the coach.

I completely agree with both you and Golfing, the optics are terrible, and like Golfing surmises that if FA was involved this team is in for a very long and rocky road, regardless of the GM, President or even the coach.
- Makita

Whats the strategy for this team? Are they still trying to remain a playoff type team? rebuilding on the fly? Just rebuilding? Where is this team headed?

You're right, it doesn't mean it has to happen. Then again, not trading expiring contracts for futures because the return doesn't measure up to your expectations doesn't really seem all that bright.

Let's be realistic, there was a decent deal on the table for Hamhuis who is likely to re-sign with the team.
- golfingsince

I'm not so sure Hamhuis is going to come back, I know he wants to, but listening to his presser, it didn't sound encouraging to me that there has been any long term discussions. Of course if FA is calling the shots, well Hamhuis could very well be back with a great salary and a full NTC.

Meh, i think the organization has spun it like they decided to pursue other avenues. Some of the guys out there going against the Canucks on what the return was are pretty credible. In fact, they seemed quite shocked the Canucks didn't pounce on the deals.

They aren't going to put their credibility on the line to feed the vultures in Vancouver. Even if you split it right down the middle, the Canucks messed up today.
- golfingsince

I agree. I'm sure they thought things were going to work out differently with their approach. It was a set back... the first significant one in my opinion.

I'm just not joining the lynch mob mentality because there is always such a knee jerk, hyper embellished version of what happened floating around for the first while. People will hitch their wagon to the most baseless poop just to fuel the spite.

I'm not so sure Hamhuis is going to come back, I know he wants to, but listening to his presser, it didn't sound encouraging to me that there has been any long term discussions. Of course if FA is calling the shots, well Hamhuis could very well be back with a great salary and a full NTC.
- Makita

Honestly, if he doesn't come back isn't that an even worse proposition?

Whats the strategy for this team? Are they still trying to remain a playoff type team? rebuilding on the fly? Just rebuilding? Where is this team headed?
- RatedR80

Really good question, I've heard that they want to pursue the playoffs every year, that they are rebuilding (retooling) on the fly, Benning want the kids to play more, get more ice time. But WD seems loathe to do so, and personally I think this team is heading for mediocrity for a few years.

I agree. I'm sure they thought things were going to work out differently with their approach. It was a set back... the first significant one in my opinion.

I'm just not joining the lynch mob mentality because there is always such a knee jerk, hyper embellished version of what happened floating around for the first while. People will hitch their wagon to the most baseless poop just to fuel the spite.
- boonerbuck

If I seem lynch mob then I apologize. I come here for discussion and a laugh. When things get bad, I'd much rather laugh then freak out so I tend to try and have some fun with it.

In general, just a really bad week for the team IMO.

Honestly, if he doesn't come back isn't that an even worse proposition?
- golfingsince

I think so, yes indeed. It would be good to sign him without a NTC even if it costs more and trade him. I said all day I was disappointed today in lack of movement, JB needs to turn this around so he doesn't walk for nothing.

Really good question, I've heard that they want to pursue the playoffs every year, that they are rebuilding (retooling) on the fly, Benning want the kids to play more, get more ice time. But WD seems loathe to do so, and personally I think this team is heading for mediocrity for a few years.
- Makita

Gonna be tough for this team to go anywhere if it is indeed ownership meddling in hockey affairs....I didnt think the concept was that hard....you hire hockey guys to run your hockey operations and you stay out of their way unless you want to fire them which would be their right to do so

I think so, yes indeed. It would be good to sign him without a NTC even if it costs more and trade him. I said all day I was disappointed today in lack of movement, JB needs to turn this around so he doesn't walk for nothing.
- Makita

So essentially we're in agreement. I'd offer him a 3 year deal with an NTC first 2 years, expiring Jan 1 year 3. Too bad we couldn't give him this deal in the summer after he'd yielded us a 1st and a prospect.

Before I head off to bed I just wanted to know if the complaining about Benning and Co. had changed the results of the day?

If I seem lynch mob then I apologize. I come here for discussion and a laugh. When things get bad, I'd much rather laugh then freak out so I tend to try and have some fun with it.

In general, just a really bad week for the team IMO.
- golfingsince

No need for apologies, you are far more reasoned and level headed than most here today. And the discussion was good, especially when it goes back and forth without calling each other whiners, crybabies, hysterics, apologists, koolaid drinkers.

Before I head off to bed I just wanted to know if the complaining about Benning and Co. had changed the results of the day?
- A_SteamingLombardi

Nope JB (or should I say FA) poop the bed and now someone else has to sleep in it

Before I head off to bed I just wanted to know if the complaining about Benning and Co. had changed the results of the day?
- A_SteamingLombardi

Yes. The league awarded us an extra pick somewhere between 2nd and 3rd, I believe they are calling it 2A. Also, check the standings. We've gained 8 whiner points which puts us in the adjusted wildcard position.

Awesome (frank)ing day to be a Canuck fan and you missed it!!

Yes. The league awarded us an extra pick somewhere between 2nd and 3rd, I believe they are calling it 2A. Also, check the standings. We've gained 8 whiner points which puts us in the adjusted wildcard position.

Awesome (frank)ing day to be a Canuck fan and you missed it!!
- golfingsince

No need for apologies, you are far more reasoned and level headed than most here today. And the discussion was good, especially when it goes back and forth without calling each other whiners, crybabies, hysterics, apologists, koolaid drinkers.
- Makita

I like Booner, not going to get into 11 pages with him.

I try to be reasonable most of the time, despite emotion getting the better of us.

I'm far more concerned if it's FA. Much harder to replace an owner than a GM.
- golfingsince

wouldnt be the 1st time hes done so. I hope not.

But recall Lindens agreement was that they have full reign, the owner stays out of it.
It seems also FA realized he doesnt know his poop following the torteralla hiring

Crazy isnt it but I'm not very narrow minded so I don't suffer the same level of disappointment in that reality. Examples people keep pointing at are not exactly on a level playing field.

Of Hammer's teams, it looks like JB had two teams that were interested but were more interested in other moves. They made late offers that were low ball. People can choose to believe or not believe the only people who were in the war room or they can believe speculators who were not there until more creditable people who were there speak up.

No one wanted the junk on "The List" or believe me, they would have been gone unless they were just similar depth... no point in any more moves like that.
- boonerbuck

It didnt help either that he publicly stated he would resign with the canucks. Greatly decreases value for him. Then the uncertainty of whether he'd waive his NTC. Added up. GMs should tell guys to just shut up to the media when it comes to details like that.
For those who blame JB, Hammer made it as tough as possible to get something done, just short of saying NO.
-list of 2 teams only
-public knowledge hes going back to vancouver
-waited till last few days on waiving.

made it difficult

Really good question, I've heard that they want to pursue the playoffs every year, that they are rebuilding (retooling) on the fly, Benning want the kids to play more, get more ice time. But WD seems loathe to do so, and personally I think this team is heading for mediocrity for a few years.
- Makita

coach and management dont seem too in line then!
Remember how WD has pointed fingers at himself recently with statements like "if its an entire team its the coach".
Makes you wonder if he realizes hes over his head in NHL.

Gonna be tough for this team to go anywhere if it is indeed ownership meddling in hockey affairs....I didnt think the concept was that hard....you hire hockey guys to run your hockey operations and you stay out of their way unless you want to fire them which would be their right to do so
- RatedR80

The hold out to the last minute approach is not working in recent years. It's time to abandon that strategy.

The disclaimer is that Hamhuis wasn't ready to decide a week ago... JB didn't know who he had to lock up a trade with and we don't know if those teams were ready to commit to a decision on player choices yet...

This is the dilemma I keep running into that keeps me from screaming incompetence. I'm not ashamed of the way I rationalize.

Spring training game 1 tomorrow

The hold out to the last minute approach is not working in recent years. It's time to abandon that strategy.

The disclaimer is that Hamhuis wasn't ready to decide a week ago... JB didn't know who he had to lock up a trade with and we don't know if those teams were ready to commit to a decision on player choices yet...

This is the dilemma I keep running into that keeps me from screaming incompetence. I'm not ashamed of the way I rationalize.
- boonerbuck

you are correct there, I agree. These trades DO take weeks sometimes as well.

Another thing that hasnt been pointed out is that perhaps management feels after a couple of wins with better play than we've seen in a while that its worth taking a run at making playoffs still. Despite the odds perhaps they know something we dont.