who is your team?
- hillbillydeluxe

I think he's all about the OIL.

You havent been around here much in the last two years. Literally every trade, no matter how small, has been seen as unfavorable by the majority. Even today, the best deal anyone can think of is Sven for a 2nd rounder and some still dont like it. The majority of the defense given is that the trades arent as bad as these Chicken Little's are claiming it to be
- WhiteLie

True, I do think after a couple of Benning's moves that were unpopular by main-stream notions there has been an unfair preconception people have of the moves he makes.

In the end it's the team's long term success that matters, not the individual pieces in trades (but conventionally those things are highly correlated). Seems like Benning isn't such a conventional GM tho and that's fine.

The only problems I have is Nucks fans trying to spit on Bonino's success looks like they are just sour grapes and grasping at straws to justify the trade as a win.

And I don't necessarily like how many picks JB has given up considering the stage the Nucks are currently in.

I think he's all about the OIL.
- Pres.cup

I think he's Nocups.

Why so you can ignore the argument at hand and focus on irrelevant bullpoop about an irrelevant franchise?

In that case the Nucks are my team... do your worst.
- RonPielep

wow, defensive...

I just laugh at the posters that are scared to show a team affiliation and all of a sudden are in a Canucks thread to let us know we should not be happy with the direction of the franchise. the mistakes made by the franchise, and we are really in a bad way. as if they really cared.

in regards to Bonino, and people peeing on him in this thread, I think it is the counter to the media, local and the big networks, fawning all over him and the thought that Bonino was a better option for the Canucks than Sutter.

Bonino disappeared for much of the season he was here. From what I saw with Sutter, he is a better fit. Good for Bonino though, nothing against him, for the most part folks on here want to see former Canucks do well on their new teams.

Columbus is in the Eastern Conf. so it's even worst.
- A_SteamingLombardi

Of course....I forgot.

wow, defensive...

I just laugh at the posters that are scared to show a team affiliation and all of a sudden are in a Canucks thread to let us know we should not be happy with the direction of the franchise. the mistakes made by the franchise, and we are really in a bad way. as if they really cared.

in regards to Bonino, and people peeing on him in this thread, I think it is the counter to the media, local and the big networks, fawning all over him and the thought that Bonino was a better option for the Canucks than Sutter.

Bonino disappeared for much of the season he was here. From what I saw with Sutter, he is a better fit. Good for Bonino though, nothing against him, for the most part folks on here want to see former Canucks do well on their new teams.
- hillbillydeluxe

I explained in an earlier comment. But yes, to sum it up for you I'm basically just shaking in my boots at the thought of all you internet tough guys chirping me about my favorite team...

I think he's Nocups.
- A_SteamingLombardi

Nah, I don't think I've ever seen that guy post a comment larger than this one.

True, I do think after a couple of Benning's moves that were unpopular by main-stream notions there has been an unfair preconception people have of the moves he makes.

In the end it's the team's long term success that matters, not the individual pieces in trades (but conventionally those things are highly correlated). Seems like Benning isn't such a conventional GM tho and that's fine.

The only problems I have is Nucks fans trying to spit on Bonino's success looks like they are just sour grapes and grasping at straws to justify the trade as a win.

And I don't necessarily like how many picks JB has given up considering the stage the Nucks are currently in.
- RonPielep

I dont really think its sour grapes, hes just getting a lot of attention these days which is bringing a lot of attention here from some people looking to kick sand in our faces. Most are happy with Sutter and know Bonino wasnt quite as effective here (which takes some explaining that might sound like sour grapes), his HBK line would be easily 2nd and pushing for 1st line minutes in Van, but on a good team they are 3rd.. Just shows where the organizations are at

The draft picks situation/unconvential thing I see as if you were playing Blackjack. Sitting with 17 and you had the choice of taking a guaranteed 2 or a random hit from the deck, which way do you go? Take your chances against the house with a solid 19, or go for 21 while potentially/likely busting? I see JB as playing it safe with some mid round picks in order to get young NHL bodies, rather than using those picks on bodies that he might not even be around to see if they make it in the NHL

wow, defensive...

I just laugh at the posters that are scared to show a team affiliation and all of a sudden are in a Canucks thread to let us know we should not be happy with the direction of the franchise. the mistakes made by the franchise, and we are really in a bad way. as if they really cared.

in regards to Bonino, and people peeing on him in this thread, I think it is the counter to the media, local and the big networks, fawning all over him and the thought that Bonino was a better option for the Canucks than Sutter.

Bonino disappeared for much of the season he was here. From what I saw with Sutter, he is a better fit. Good for Bonino though, nothing against him, for the most part folks on here want to see former Canucks do well on their new teams.
- hillbillydeluxe

He wasnt very visible for Pitt most of the year either (granted his new linemates really explain that). Bonino had an amazing stretch in Vancouver too, scoring a bunch in a hot streak, consistency is tough in the NHL though

I dont really think its sour grapes, hes just getting a lot of attention these days which is bringing a lot of attention here from some people looking to kick sand in our faces. Most are happy with Sutter and know Bonino wasnt quite as effective here (which takes some explaining that might sound like sour grapes), his HBK line would be easily 2nd and pushing for 1st line minutes in Van, but on a good team they are 3rd.. Just shows where the organizations are at

The draft picks situation/unconvential thing I see as if you were playing Blackjack. Sitting with 17 and you had the choice of taking a guaranteed 2 or a random hit from the deck, which way do you go? Take your chances against the house with a solid 19, or go for 21 while potentially/likely busting? I see JB as playing it safe with some mid round picks in order to get young NHL bodies, rather than using those picks on bodies that he might not even be around to see if they make it in the NHL
- WhiteLie

That's a good analogy but if 21 is being a cup contender, I'd say the Nucks are closer to sitting with a 12 and taking a guaranteed 4. Risk is not always a bad thing, especially if you subject yourself to the right kind of risk.

He wasnt very visible for Pitt most of the year either (granted his new linemates really explain that). Bonino had an amazing stretch in Vancouver too, scoring a bunch in a hot streak, consistency is tough in the NHL though
- WhiteLie

Nobody was very visible under the Pens former coach.

My issue is so many people in Carol's thread pissing on Bonino's playoff success just to make themselves feel better about the trade. If you can't see that then I don't know what you are reading.

I am trying to encourage people to embrace reality and move on without having to make up complete bullpoop to avoid accepting an uncomfortable reality (i.e., Bonino's recent success). Instead all we see is excuses about how poopty Bonino is and ridiculous mockery about how he is going to command $8M next season blah blah blah.

If encouraging people to act like adults is me being a wienerhead then sign me up...


What's so wrong with me criticizing people's biased outlooks? Maybe I over-generalized a bit too much (some Nucks fans here seem to have a more grounded perception).

Is this becoming a safe-space similar to JJ's thread free from any outside criticism?

Not the first time that comparison has been made by me or many others.
- RonPielep

Well I'll diffinitely disagree with a lot of what you said, as I stated your first statement that Bonino is not far down the list of Conn Smythe finalist is fine, good point and great hockey engaging discussion.

The second statement is a blatant attempt at provoking the fan base, how in your reality is that an attempt to encouraging people to act like adults. with an immature statement?

And there are a lot of posters here that applaud Bonino and wish him success in his new found success...you are purposely twisting posts that say he wasn't the right fit for the canucks at the time and Sutter was better suited for this team in JB mind.

And Carols blog will be free for open discussion from anyone wanting to engage in respectful manner, conversations, arguments, debates, disagreements are all welcome. Provoking, name calling, belittling, etc. is not welcome, if you think that's too harsh for you, sorry but that's the way things roll here.

I explained in an earlier comment. But yes, to sum it up for you I'm basically just shaking in my boots at the thought of all you internet tough guys chirping me about my favorite team...
- RonPielep

Nobody is expecting you to quake in your boots. What kind of reaction were you looking for?

I am trying to encourage people to embrace reality and move on without having to make up complete bullpoop to avoid accepting an uncomfortable reality (i.e., Bonino's recent success). Instead all we see is excuses about how poopty Bonino is and ridiculous mockery about how he is going to command $8M next season blah blah blah.

If encouraging people to act like adults is me being a wienerhead then sign me up...



- RonPielep

you are signed up.

He wasnt very visible for Pitt most of the year either (granted his new linemates really explain that). Bonino had an amazing stretch in Vancouver too, scoring a bunch in a hot streak, consistency is tough in the NHL though
- WhiteLie

He had a hot start in Vancouver that raised everyone's expectations.

That's a good analogy but if 21 is being a cup contender, I'd say the Nucks are closer to sitting with a 12 and taking a guaranteed 4. Risk is not always a bad thing, especially if you subject yourself to the right kind of risk.
- RonPielep

Yes the team would be a 12, but when youre looking at his trades and trading of draft picks I would say he is acquiring solid NHL players (bottom 6 forwards, bottom 4 D) but risking those midround draft picks who may turn out to be stars (though most wont even be regular NHLers). Its an odd tactic, as drafting and developing talent has been the go-to method, but he's cutting the risk of drafting 7 players per year and maybe seeing a total of 3 or 4 of those selected in 4+ years from draft day (which would be at home from TV as he wouldnt survive 4+ years of not pushing moves for NHL players)

Classy pal, go straight to the name-calling instead of trying to form an appropriate response.

I'm sure if I did the same to you I would be flagged and banned by Makita in less than an hour.
- RonPielep

Also I think you'll find me the most tolerant ref on this site, last nights posts from Jeropotato in here was BS and I certainly didn't ban him, and in Hendersons blog prismo totally made that accusation up that sent Jero here looking for a fight.

Nobody is expecting you to quake in your boots. What kind of reaction were you looking for?





you are signed up.
- hillbillydeluxe

The boots shaking thing was in response to you implying that I was scared when you failed to read the previous comment. Thought that was self-explanatory enough.

Well I'll diffinitely disagree with a lot of what you said, as I stated your first statement that Bonino is not far down the list of Conn Smythe finalist is fine, good point and great hockey engaging discussion.

The second statement is a blatant attempt at provoking the fan base, how in your reality is that an attempt to encouraging people to act like adults. with an immature statement?

And there are a lot of posters here that applaud Bonino and wish him success in his new found success...you are purposely twisting posts that say he wasn't the right fit for the canucks at the time and Sutter was better suited for this team in JB mind.

And Carols blog will be free for open discussion from anyone wanting to engage in respectful manner, conversations, arguments, debates, disagreements are all welcome. Provoking, name calling, belittling, etc. is not welcome, if you think that's too harsh for you, sorry but that's the way things roll here.
- Makita

I'm not twisting anything. If you need to see an example of people grasping at straws to make that trade look like a win right now look no further than my location.

The second statement is a direct response to such blatantly biased and homeristic perceptions (although admittedly and mistakenly I over-generalized and should have been more careful about my word choice).

What's wrong with provoking a discussion about fan bias and perception? That's entirely different than blatant trolling.

It's not like a just flat out started calling people names like wienerhead or something... That would be inappropriate.

Yes the team would be a 12, but when youre looking at his trades and trading of draft picks I would say he is acquiring solid NHL players (bottom 6 forwards, bottom 4 D) but risking those midround draft picks who may turn out to be stars (though most wont even be regular NHLers). Its an odd tactic, as drafting and developing talent has been the go-to method, but he's cutting the risk of drafting 7 players per year and maybe seeing a total of 3 or 4 of those selected in 4+ years from draft day (which would be at home from TV as he wouldnt survive 4+ years of not pushing moves for NHL players)
- WhiteLie

Yeah I guess my point was he is pissing away opportunities to open himself up to the kind of positive risk I was referring to which is taking high-risk high-reward type players in middle/later rounds in hopes of finding an Ondrej Palat or Tyler Johnson (although he was undrafted).

The other problem I have is he doesn't seem very adept at embracing analytics and while I'm not trying to advocate that they are the end-all be-all but if you are not using them as a valuable part of your tool box you are just being regressive in this day and age imo.

Also I think you'll find me the most tolerant ref on this site, last nights posts from Jeropotato in here was BS and I certainly didn't ban him, and in Hendersons blog prismo totally made that accusation up that sent Jero here looking for a fight.
- Makita

Likely, unless you are the guy who keeps banning me in Tanner's thread...

Yeah I guess my point was he is pissing away opportunities to open himself up to the kind of positive risk I was referring to which is taking high-risk high-reward type players in middle/later rounds in hopes of finding an Ondrej Palat or Tyler Johnson (although he was undrafted).

The other problem I have is he doesn't seem very adept at embracing analytics and while I'm not trying to advocate that they are the end-all be-all but if you are not using them as a valuable part of your tool box you are just being regressive in this day and age imo.
- RonPielep

I can see that, everyone loves the undrafted or 7th round superstar but I am actually happy he's gone after former 1st round picks. Sure they are reclamation projects but I have more faith in them finding a useful role in the NHL than whatever comes from the next 4th or 5th round picks. Also those are again risks I doubt he ever sees come to fruition. Rebuilding GM's rarely see the fruits of their labour, they are usually gone and the remnants carry the load (Canucks for example in 2011). Its a totally different way of behaving, but I think he has a shot to make a competitive team soon enough since he is really focused on his 1st round youth to be the next core

I think he does use analytics though to a certain extent. Linden says they look at it and understand it has value but dont take it as be-all-end-all, which is how they should be used. But I also liked his response on how he helped build/win a Stanley Cup without analytics

Western conference rebuilding teams draft picks for this year in the 1st 4 rounds.

Edmonton Oilers - 4, 32, 63, 84, 90

Calgary Flames - 6, 35, 54, 56, 66, 95

Arizona Coyotes - 7, 20, 37, 53, 68

Winnipeg Jets- 2, 22, 36, 96

Columbus - 3, 34- 65

Vancouver Canucks - 5, 64
- belcherbd

You forgot the 2010 third overall pick.

The boots shaking thing was in response to you implying that I was scared when you failed to read the previous comment. Thought that was self-explanatory enough.
- RonPielep

Sorry, thought you were calling me an internet tough guy

so by not choosing a team, you have deeply seeded commitment issues or something?

maybe it is just me, but when I see a poster without team affiliation that is new or doesn't post in this thread often and they only post to criticize the Canucks or a Canuck poster, it usually means that guy is a troll.

you know the saying, don't throw stones if you live in a glass house? guys without team affiliations don't live in houses and usually have plenty of rocks.

I apologize for bringing up Bonino and destroying the spirit of this thread

Brouwer will be on the 1040 at 3.30 . Two interviews in one week