In fairness, no cups = no cups. Two finals appearances just means they lost in clutch moments twice (though we all know Hull's foot was in the paint)

I think it's far better to look at the current landscape of the teams.

I think you guys are a bit better up front, mainly because Matthews hasn't played yet. O'Reilly is better than Kadri, but also makes 2.5 mil more. I think Van Riemsdyk is pretty stellar though and we have promising prospects like Marner and Nylander. Still give the edge to Buffalo though with Eichel, Ennis, Reinhart, etc. Pretty exciting group of forwards

The back end is a tire fire. Rielly is as good as any Buffalo Dman I think, but after that, Leafs have next to nothing.

I think Andersen is a far better goalie than Lehner though, and that can be a huge difference maker, as we saw first hand Miller would whoop our ass every time we played you, despite Derek Roy being the #1 and Tim Connolly stinking up the joint

Babcock, I think, has the edge on Bylsma. Otherwise, why was he Buffalo's first choice?

It's going to be a fun rivalry with Nylander vs Nylander and a bunch of other narratives that we can spin up over the next few years. Giddy up!
- WingmanWillie

I disagree that Andersen is head and shoulders above Lehner until he replicates the success in the Blue and White. We've seen many goalies go from great to average when they leave a team with good defense to one that doesn't have the same system or players in front of them. You want to say they're comparable, sure, but I can't say he gets the edge without him playing for you yet.

The sad part is, he is gloating about his trolling in the Leafs thread now. He is seriously proud of himself.
- ImThatGuy

A tool is a tool is a tool. Whatever. The kid will get banned if he comes back here.

The sad part is, he is gloating about his trolling in the Leafs thread now. He is seriously proud of himself.
- ImThatGuy

It's stupid that he can come in here for 2 hours and spout non- reality. The Leafs are the worst team in the NHL. I'm not just saying that because they're a rival. They blow in every way. Matthews hasn't played a game yet so whatever. In order to remember the last time they won the cup over those 6 other teams you would have to have been born 7 decades ago.

If he or anyone wants to have a circle jerk session about how great they think the Leafs are they should find another location. If it's lost it's fun and you need to come here well then I guess it just isn't that fun is it?

A tool is a tool is a tool. Whatever. The kid will get banned if he comes back here.
- TheSabresTaco

thats why you should come to our thread

The Leafs are the greatest ever. Ever.



Nice job today by the mods.
- Buffalo--Sabres

Unfortunately, decades of terrible motives set the team back a great deal.

For so long, 1st round picks and young prospects were moved for short term veterans to help them win at the present time. Not one single manager had an eye toward the future, nor did they know how to manage a hockey franchise for long-term sustainability.

It is a testament to the resilience of the fans that the Leafs remain a hugely profitable franchise in spite of decades of futility. That said, this was also a part of their downfall. Why plan for long-term success when you are sold out every night? the bottom line was always the same, and the dough would always roll in.

Finally, there is a glimmer of hope. Finally, a management staff that seems competent and seems to have a solid plan for the future.

I guess we are a bit overly optimistic because it's been so long since we could be.

So no. The Leafs are not the greatest ever, but with any luck, they will start to shed the stigma of 50 years of losing. The archaic jokes about hell freezing over, embarrassment, etc will hopefully become a thing of the past.

The sad part is, he is gloating about his trolling in the Leafs thread now. He is seriously proud of himself.
- ImThatGuy

The refs on this site are a complete joke. "You better stop that poop you've been doing for an hour or I'll ban you. Well, I guess a few more posts won't hurt anyone. Okay go over there and do it, that's fine."

Unfortunately, decades of terrible motives set the team back a great deal.

For so long, 1st round picks and young prospects were moved for short term veterans to help them win at the present time. Not one single manager had an eye toward the future, nor did they know how to manage a hockey franchise for long-term sustainability.

It is a testament to the resilience of the fans that the Leafs remain a hugely profitable franchise in spite of decades of futility. That said, this was also a part of their downfall. Why plan for long-term success when you are sold out every night? the bottom line was always the same, and the dough would always roll in.

Finally, there is a glimmer of hope. Finally, a management staff that seems competent and seems to have a solid plan for the future.

I guess we are a bit overly optimistic because it's been so long since we could be.

So no. The Leafs are not the greatest ever, but with any luck, they will start to shed the stigma of 50 years of losing. The archaic jokes about hell freezing over, embarrassment, etc will hopefully become a thing of the past.
- WingmanWillie

It's like the Buffalo Bills. They've broken me. I don't buy any of their crap they sell and I have so little faith in what they do. I'm tired of "Well every other move they've made failed so this one is going to be extra good". It won't. They are the worst team in the NFL and maybe the worst in all of the the major 4 sports.

The refs on this site are a complete joke. "You better stop that poop you've been doing for an hour or I'll ban you. Well, I guess a few more posts won't hurt anyone. Okay go over there and do it, that's fine."
- Zschalberg

Look, any kid that's starved for attention is going to go seeking it. Might as well get him to say poop he shouldn't.

The refs on this site are a complete joke. "You better stop that poop you've been doing for an hour or I'll ban you. Well, I guess a few more posts won't hurt anyone. Okay go over there and do it, that's fine."
- Zschalberg

Enjoy your ban for that.

Unfortunately, decades of terrible motives set the team back a great deal.

For so long, 1st round picks and young prospects were moved for short term veterans to help them win at the present time. Not one single manager had an eye toward the future, nor did they know how to manage a hockey franchise for long-term sustainability.

It is a testament to the resilience of the fans that the Leafs remain a hugely profitable franchise in spite of decades of futility. That said, this was also a part of their downfall. Why plan for long-term success when you are sold out every night? the bottom line was always the same, and the dough would always roll in.

Finally, there is a glimmer of hope. Finally, a management staff that seems competent and seems to have a solid plan for the future.

I guess we are a bit overly optimistic because it's been so long since we could be.

So no. The Leafs are not the greatest ever, but with any luck, they will start to shed the stigma of 50 years of losing. The archaic jokes about hell freezing over, embarrassment, etc will hopefully become a thing of the past.
- WingmanWillie

This guy can stay eh?

thats why you should come to our thread
- Arctic_AARDVARK

Enjoy.

In fairness, no cups = no cups. Two finals appearances just means they lost in clutch moments twice (though we all know Hull's foot was in the paint)

I think it's far better to look at the current landscape of the teams.

I think you guys are a bit better up front, mainly because Matthews hasn't played yet. O'Reilly is better than Kadri, but also makes 2.5 mil more. I think Van Riemsdyk is pretty stellar though and we have promising prospects like Marner and Nylander. Still give the edge to Buffalo though with Eichel, Ennis, Reinhart, etc. Pretty exciting group of forwards

The back end is a tire fire. Rielly is as good as any Buffalo Dman I think, but after that, Leafs have next to nothing.

I think Andersen is a far better goalie than Lehner though, and that can be a huge difference maker, as we saw first hand Miller would whoop our ass every time we played you, despite Derek Roy being the #1 and Tim Connolly stinking up the joint

Babcock, I think, has the edge on Bylsma. Otherwise, why was he Buffalo's first choice?

It's going to be a fun rivalry with Nylander vs Nylander and a bunch of other narratives that we can spin up over the next few years. Giddy up!
- WingmanWillie

I few things... in all fairness. I'll take Eichel and Reinhart who are both NHL proven 20+ goal scorers over the hopes of some kids who have barely played in the league. Look at TJ Brennan. Just because you got "it" in the AHL or CHL doesn't mean you will have "it" in the NHL.


Also... how do you go about gauging that Anderson is shoulders better than lehner? Anderson was a backup on a top tier team in the West. How have all of there rest of the WC goalies worked out when leaving? Toskala? Fasth? Bernier? How about even Nabakov? They all have not faired well at all.


All "potential" means is that you haven't done NOTHING...... yet.

It's like the Buffalo Bills. They've broken me. I don't buy any of their crap they sell and I have so little faith in what they do. I'm tired of "Well every other move they've made failed so this one is going to be extra good". It won't. They are the worst team in the NFL and maybe the worst in all of the the major 4 sports.
- Buffalo--Sabres

I mean that's not true. The Bills are bad and have been bad for a while but I don't think you can say they're the worst in sports. They have the worst recent history, sure, but it's not like we're just barely putting a team together and getting destroyed. They went 7-9 last year, not like they fielded an 0-16 team.

Enjoy your ban for that.
- Buffalo--Sabres

I'd welcome it with open arms just to prove the hypocrisy.

What did I miss

I disagree that Andersen is head and shoulders above Lehner until he replicates the success in the Blue and White. We've seen many goalies go from great to average when they leave a team with good defense to one that doesn't have the same system or players in front of them. You want to say they're comparable, sure, but I can't say he gets the edge without him playing for you yet.
- Zschalberg

Yes we have seen goalies like this..cough...Bernier....cough

What did I miss
- SABRES 89

I mean that's not true. The Bills are bad and have been bad for a while but I don't think you can say they're the worst in sports. They have the worst recent history, sure, but it's not like we're just barely putting a team together and getting destroyed. They went 7-9 last year, not like they fielded an 0-16 team.
- Zschalberg

Getting their city up for another let down...playoffs!...oh wait we lost 5 in a row to end the year and just missed the cut...this is a hockey city..football was the 90's..Bills are an average team but the new pieces at least are somewhat exciting...what a shame we cant see our own first rd pick until halfway through the year.

I few things... in all fairness. I'll take Eichel and Reinhart who are both NHL proven 20+ goal scorers over the hopes of some kids who have barely played in the league. Look at TJ Brennan. Just because you got "it" in the AHL or CHL doesn't mean you will have "it" in the NHL.


Also... how do you go about gauging that Anderson is shoulders better than lehner? Anderson was a backup on a top tier team in the West. How have all of there rest of the WC goalies worked out when leaving? Toskala? Fasth? Bernier? How about even Nabakov? They all have not faired well at all.


All "potential" means is that you haven't done NOTHING...... yet.
- JVince11

Yep, I'd take those two as well. Forwards are definitely a win for BUF

Andersen was the starter in Anaheim, or at the very least a 1B. Lehner was a backup on a terrible team in the East, and I don't see what that has to do with anything? He lost his job to the Hamburglar. The Hamburglar!

Maybe "far better" was pushing it. But from what I have seen of both goalies, Freddy is the better of the two

I mean that's not true. The Bills are bad and have been bad for a while but I don't think you can say they're the worst in sports. They have the worst recent history, sure, but it's not like we're just barely putting a team together and getting destroyed. They went 7-9 last year, not like they fielded an 0-16 team.
- Zschalberg

And they lost tons of talent. Only the Bills would claw their way to 7-9 and get worse. They are the worst team in sports till they prove they aren't anymore.

- bluengold12

Great show! But did they sharpen their swords?

- bluengold12

sword fight?.

Yes we have seen goalies like this..cough...Bernier....cough
- Beezer33

Bernier played 1/3rd of the games when Leafs acquired him that Andersen has played.

The jury is out, sure. But let's hearken back to this line of conversation sometime next year and re-evaluate our stances

Yep, I'd take those two as well. Forwards are definitely a win for BUF

Andersen was the starter in Anaheim, or at the very least a 1B. Lehner was a backup on a terrible team in the East, and I don't see what that has to do with anything? He lost his job to the Hamburglar. The Hamburglar!

Maybe "far better" was pushing it. But from what I have seen of both goalies, Freddy is the better of the two
- WingmanWillie

They both have a little more than 100 games played, Andersen has a .918 and Lehner has a .916. They're comparable. You might have proved the point a bit more that Lehner was on a terrible team while Andersen was on Anaheim and they have comparable numbers.

Like I said, neither of them have really proved anything to me.

Yep, I'd take those two as well. Forwards are definitely a win for BUF

Andersen was the starter in Anaheim, or at the very least a 1B. Lehner was a backup on a terrible team in the East, and I don't see what that has to do with anything? He lost his job to the Hamburglar. The Hamburglar!

Maybe "far better" was pushing it. But from what I have seen of both goalies, Freddy is the better of the two
- WingmanWillie

I'm not really sure about that. While Freddie does in fact have more success because of the larger set of games on a good to great team, he has been inconsistent. Lehner of course has been too, but I honestly believe Lehner has a higher ceiling. I don't think it's fair to really judge him until he puts up a few seasons or two now that he's reaching his prime.