Love him!
But notice how his production, (points), has increased with his confidence?
- puckhead17

Yeah.. it goes both ways. I just want to see him continue on this path.. Showed me a lot also with that block and still crawling to get into the play. Warrior!

Because he's getting shadowed, and beaten up again, because there's no #2C threat that scares anyone, even when Couturier is in.
- puckhead17

The trouble is, the production of late has come from the 2nd line and depth guys like Weise.

Giroux not scoring every night isn't a huge issue. Yes, he does need to produce points, but he can not have stretches where he is largely not a factor if this team is going to have success. The last few games, he's been a non factor and you can't have that from your best player.

That's not to say he's washed up or that he's in decline. But he needs to be much more of a factor moving forward than he's been of late.

I think it was part of it for sure. The Flyers seemed like a tired team last night, but were still in position to win the game. Breakdowns and individual mistakes are what really cost them the game.
- MJL

Poor excuse. Half the team spent the pks sitting on the bench. It was time to play sound positional hockey. They didn't do that and it wasn't because they were tired.

That's simply a logical fallacy. My simple point is that a player who is capable of playing away from the puck defensively like Couturier can, along with scoring in the 40 point range, is still a very valuable player in this league, and very much worth what he is getting paid, even if that's where he tops out offensively. Now if we want to say, that if he is going to be the #2 center, then yes, we need him to produce more offensively. Either way, Couturier is still a building block for this team moving forward, and a lot of teams would be perfectly willing to insert Couturier into their lineup, and pay him what he's signed for.
- MJL

Plain and simple, I love the guy, but people ca't female dog about G getting a blanket while this guy is not creating, and missing nets here, and there.
You think G gets a heavy blanket with a Zibanejad, or a brassard, or a Filppula on our 2nd line?

The trouble is, the production of late has come from the 2nd line and depth guys like Weise.

Giroux not scoring every night isn't a huge issue. Yes, he does need to produce points, but he can not have stretches where he is largely not a factor if this team is going to have success. The last few games, he's been a non factor and you can't have that from your best player.

That's not to say he's washed up or that he's in decline. But he needs to be much more of a factor moving forward than he's been of late.
- Jsaquella

Jesus, I'm copying this and pasting it.
Plain and simple, I love the guy, but people ca't female dog about G getting a blanket while this guy is not creating, and missing nets here, and there.
You think G gets a heavy blanket with a Zibanejad, or a brassard, or a Filppula on our 2nd line?

The trouble is, the production of late has come from the 2nd line and depth guys like Weise.

Giroux not scoring every night isn't a huge issue. Yes, he does need to produce points, but he can not have stretches where he is largely not a factor if this team is going to have success. The last few games, he's been a non factor and you can't have that from your best player.

That's not to say he's washed up or that he's in decline. But he needs to be much more of a factor moving forward than he's been of late.
- Jsaquella

It's very true. After the Florida game someone said, was G even out there tonight, and I thought back and couldn't remember one play where he was noticeable. Not good.

The trouble is, the production of late has come from the 2nd line and depth guys like Weise.

Giroux not scoring every night isn't a huge issue. Yes, he does need to produce points, but he can not have stretches where he is largely not a factor if this team is going to have success. The last few games, he's been a non factor and you can't have that from your best player.

That's not to say he's washed up or that he's in decline. But he needs to be much more of a factor moving forward than he's been of late.
- Jsaquella

Yeah, your right, he gets a double blanket every night but needs to fight through it like Crosby. The fact that they have 2 skilled centers means nothing, It's all on Giroux.

It's very true. After the Florida game someone said, was G even out there tonight, and I thought back and couldn't remember one play where he was noticeable. Not good.
- Hextall271

Production is coming from the 2nd line because there's no C threat to create.
Again, take Malkin, (wow, and Bonino), out of the Pitt lineup and watch Crosby fight out of the D blanket.
Not

Plain and simple, I love the guy, but people ca't female dog about G getting a blanket while this guy is not creating, and missing nets here, and there.
You think G gets a heavy blanket with a Zibanejad, or a brassard, or a Filppula on our 2nd line?
- puckhead17

Yes they can, because they're individual players, and both are responsible for their own play. The last few games, Giroux's play has been unacceptable. Really nothing to do with who else is in the lineup. He simply has played terrible hockey. Giroux has played most of the season with Voracek on the 2nd line. Giroux ranks 136th in the league is ES scoring to this point.

Production is coming from the 2nd line because there's no C threat to create.
Again, take Malkin, (wow, and Bonino), out of the Pitt lineup and watch Crosby fight out of the D blanket.
Not
- puckhead17

Crosby would still be scoring at a high level, and still be a dominant player.

Yes they can, because they're individual players, and both are responsible for their own play. The last few games, Giroux's play has been unacceptable. Really nothing to do with who else is in the lineup. He simply has played terrible hockey. Giroux has played most of the season with Voracek on the 2nd line. Giroux ranks 136th in the league is ES scoring to this point.
- MJL

It's funny how everyone in here agrees who to (frank)ing bash after a loss, regardless of anything occurring.

Jesus, I'm copying this and pasting it.
Plain and simple, I love the guy, but people ca't female dog about G getting a blanket while this guy is not creating, and missing nets here, and there.
You think G gets a heavy blanket with a Zibanejad, or a brassard, or a Filppula on our 2nd line?
- puckhead17

I am far more worried about others than Giroux moving forward. Even if he is in decline, he can still be a very effective guy.

My worry is when you have a guy 5 years into his career and he's still maddeningly inconsistent in terms of production and being involved, that's a bigger issue. The Flyers expect Brayden Schenn to be an impactful top 6 guy. He's more pssenger than driver. They expect Couturier to be a high end 2C who can fill a shut down role and score 20-25 goals. He might not be that.

If that's the case, they need to address it.

Crosby would still be scoring at a high level, and still be a dominant player.
- MJL

Sure he would, with no #2C

You go boy

Duh

I am far more worried about others than Giroux moving forward. Even if he is in decline, he can still be a very effective guy.

My worry is when you have a guy 5 years into his career and he's still maddeningly inconsistent in terms of production and being involved, that's a bigger issue.
- Jsaquella

You ,mean Coots?

Yeah, he loves his D, loves it!
Meanwhile, lets blanket G, and win.

Crosby would still be scoring at a high level, and still be a dominant player.
- MJL

Whatever creditability you think you have, you lost on this one.

Sure he would, with no #2C

You go boy

Duh
- puckhead17

Malkin has missed plenty of games over the years, where Crosby has remained the same top player. Giroux simply has not played well lately.

I haven't seen one hint of chemistry between the top line. They're getting hemmed in their own zone constantly and attacking as individuals in the offensive zone, unless they're in a prime scoring area of course...Then they decide to pass. I can't remember that combination ever working in the past and I have my doubts it will work this time around. Move Schenn down the line up so he can provide more value on a thin offensive line up.

Vandevelde may be the popular whipping boy around here but it's really Bellemare who has earned a seat in the press box for me. Countless failed clears and definitely isn't providing the energy on the fore check he's provided in the past.

Manning has now cost them 2 games by my count with careless blown coverage late in a game. It's pretty basic fundamentals to tie a guy's stick up when he's anywhere around your crease. He had a great start but his play is getting more erratic by the game. Time for him to sit.

Raffl-Giroux-Voracek
Konecny-Schenn-Simmonds
Read-Cousins-Weise
Vandevelde-Laughton-Lyubimov

Provorov-Streit
Macdonald-Gudas
Del Zotto-Ghost

Whatever creditability you think you have, you lost on this one.
- puckhead17

Let's just look at last season. Malkin only played 57 games last season. Crosby scored 36 goals, and 49 assists for 85 points and finished 2nd in the league in scoring. I'm not sure that you should be questioning anyone's credibility.

The Flyers need more out of Giroux's line, especially at 5 on 5. They need Schenn to provide far better play. He's had some production, but he's not really involved physically or doing much else. Could have signed Brandon Pirri for 1/5th of the money and gotten what Schenn has provided thus far.

I'm concerned about that contract being a poor one. Not necessarily a bad one, just a deal where the guy is slightly overpaid and really doesn't provide full value. They also need Couturier to produce when he returns. Couturier does a lot besides produce, so it's not as glaring for him. But if he's going to be the 2C, he needs to produce more. You can have great advanced numbers and generate shots, but they also need to go in more consistently.

Damned loss has me feeling more pessimistic than I have for awhile. The future is still very bright, but after 5-6 seasons in the NHL you want to see more from guys being paid like core pieces. Giroux, Schenn, Couturier, even Voracek need to be better. Simmonds and Konecny are really the only two in top six puling weight right now.
- Jsaquella

I don't wanna start a heated debate of Schenn vs Couturier but I feel Couturier has been far worse than Schenn this season. Couturier had a very good handful of games to start the season but since than he's been inconsistent offensively, he looks slower than his line mates and has had a few costly turnovers. Couturier doesn't look engaged to me nightly.

As for Schenn, yes, same story of if he's not bringing his offensive game, he's not offering very much. I do think Schenn does do some of the small things right. He can make passes in site places, most noticeably in the crease if need be. He's an offensive threat and if he doesn't produce, he's hard to watch.

I haven't seen one hint of chemistry between the top line. They're getting hemmed in their own zone constantly and attacking as individuals in the offensive zone, unless they're in a prime scoring area of course...Then they decide to pass. I can't remember that combination ever working in the past and I have my doubts it will work this time around. Move Schenn down the line up so he can provide more value on a thin offensive line up.

Vandevelde may be the popular whipping boy around here but it's really Bellemare who has earned a seat in the press box for me. Countless failed clears and definitely isn't providing the energy on the fore check he's provided in the past.

Manning has now cost them 2 games by my count with careless blown coverage late in a game. It's pretty basic fundamentals to tie a guy's stick up when he's anywhere around your crease. He had a great start but his play is getting more erratic by the game. Time for him to sit.

Raffl-Giroux-Voracek
Konecny-Schenn-Simmonds
Read-Cousins-Weise
Vandevelde-Laughton-Lyubimov

Provorov-Streit
Macdonald-Gudas
Del Zotto-Ghost
- Baxter27

I think both VandeVelde and Bellemare should be spare parts at best. I have no idea how Bellemare is still getting as much opportunity as the coaching staff hs given him. I feel Lyubimov has been better than both. I also agree with your line combos.

I'd tweak the D pairs. Manning has had a few rough games, but I don't think MacDonald has played well at all of late. I like MDZ-Ghost as a pair, and I'd put Provorov with Gudas and then have a pair comprised of 2 out of Streit, Schultz, Manning and AMac.

I haven't seen one hint of chemistry between the top line. They're getting hemmed in their own zone constantly and attacking as individuals in the offensive zone, unless they're in a prime scoring area of course...Then they decide to pass. I can't remember that combination ever working in the past and I have my doubts it will work this time around. Move Schenn down the line up so he can provide more value on a thin offensive line up.

Vandevelde may be the popular whipping boy around here but it's really Bellemare who has earned a seat in the press box for me. Countless failed clears and definitely isn't providing the energy on the fore check he's provided in the past.

Manning has now cost them 2 games by my count with careless blown coverage late in a game. It's pretty basic fundamentals to tie a guy's stick up when he's anywhere around your crease. He had a great start but his play is getting more erratic by the game. Time for him to sit.

Raffl-Giroux-Voracek
Konecny-Schenn-Simmonds
Read-Cousins-Weise
Vandevelde-Laughton-Lyubimov

Provorov-Streit
Macdonald-Gudas
Del Zotto-Ghost
- Baxter27

I think your lines would be a good start.

I don't wanna start a heated debate of Schenn vs Couturier but I feel Couturier has been far worse than Schenn this season. Couturier had a very good handful of games to start the season but since than he's been inconsistent offensively, he looks slower than his line mates and has had a few costly turnovers. Couturier doesn't look engaged to me night.

As for Schenn, yes, same story of if he's not bringing his offensive game, he's not offering very much. I do think Schenn does do some of the small things right. He can make passes in site places, most noticeably in the crease if need be. He's an offensive threat and if he doesn't produce, he's hard to watch.
- SuperSchennBros

I agree with you. I don't think Schenn has been as bad as some say, but he does need to produce more. The issue with Couturier is not only has he been struggling offensively, but he also has had some issues defensively, and with puck management. That's normally a very consistent part of Couturier's game.

I think both VandeVelde and Bellemare should be spare parts at best. I have no idea how Bellemare is still getting as much opportunity as the coaching staff hs given him. I feel Lyubimov has been better than both. I also agree with your line combos.

I'd tweak the D pairs. Manning has had a few rough games, but I don't think MacDonald has played well at all of late. I like MDZ-Ghost as a pair, and I'd put Provorov with Gudas and then have a pair comprised of 2 out of Streit, Schultz, Manning and AMac.
- Jsaquella

Yep.

I agree with you. I don't think Schenn has been as bad as some say, but he does need to produce more. The issue with Couturier is not only has he been struggling offensively, but he also has had some issues defensively, and with puck management. That's normally a very consistent part of Couturier's game.
- MJL

Sean Couturier has not been good this year and I'm with you. That ability to check any line hasn't been there so far this year.

I don't wanna start a heated debate of Schenn vs Couturier but I feel Couturier has been far worse than Schenn this season. Couturier had a very good handful of games to start the season but since than he's been inconsistent offensively, he looks slower than his line mates and has had a few costly turnovers. Couturier doesn't look engaged to me nightly.

As for Schenn, yes, same story of if he's not bringing his offensive game, he's not offering very much. I do think Schenn does do some of the small things right. He can make passes in site places, most noticeably in the crease if need be. He's an offensive threat and if he doesn't produce, he's hard to watch.
- SuperSchennBros

The problem with Schenn isn't the offense, it's that he's not doing much of anything. He's not involved physically. He's losing puck battles. He's not creating anything. There's nights where there' no indication he's in the line up.

Basically, he's the same inconsistent guy he's been for the past 5 years. He gets points, but they're a by-product of his usage, not because he's playing well. To me, his play hasn't been worth his contract.

Couturier has struggled too, but generally over his career, he's always been a good two way player. Even if he's not producing there's a lot of value to what he does. With Schenn, if he's not involved and being a physical factor, he's next to worthless.

If it's just points you want, trade Schenn for picks and prospects and sign Brandon Pirri for 1/5th of the cash. He can score you 20-25 goals and bring nothing else a whole lot cheaper than Schenn. The trouble is we all know Schenn can do more. That's why he's infuriating. It's 5 years in, he needs to find that consistency.