I'd rather pick 8th, take the slow road to building this team up, and have the franchise maintain some dignity unlike EDM, TOR, BUF, etc.

What's the point in watching if we aren't trying to win?
- NorthNuck

What's the point of watching if they can't win?

Again, If you look at the volume of quality players picked in the top-5 as opposed to the other 25 picks (26 starting this year) it is very significant. if you take the top-5 from 2006 to 2016 (ten years) and compare it to the rest of the first round picks, the 50 players in the top-5 range is a who's who of HOFer's. While the rest of the first round has a solid amount of those types of performers, it's statistically not even close (even if you just compare 1-5 to 6-10 it's not very close) which shouldn't be much of surprise. In "weak' drafts like some are alleging this year's is, picking in the top-5 is actually even more pertinent.

I do agree with that getting more picks is very important (I really, really hope we do), but the value of top-5 picks is simply undeniable.
- neem55

So what you're saying is... Juolevi is money in the bank

JBs trades haven't put us where we are. If you really think that, you have a very short memory...
- NorthNuck

Never said they have. But he hasn't really improved the roster all that much. What positive impact has he had?

Again, If you look at the volume of quality players picked in the top-5 as opposed to the other 25 picks (26 starting this year) it is very significant. if you take the top-5 from 2006 to 2016 (ten years) and compare it to the rest of the first round picks, the 50 players in the top-5 range is a who's who of HOFer's. While the rest of the first round has a solid amount of those types of performers, it's statistically not even close (even if you just compare 1-5 to 6-10 it's not very close) which shouldn't be much of surprise. In "weak' drafts like some are alleging this year's is, picking in the top-5 is actually even more pertinent.

I do agree with that getting more picks is very important (I really, really hope we do), but the value of top-5 picks is simply undeniable.
- neem55

Now go back and look again for the past 10 years and remove the top 2 from the equation, which are bloody expensive to acquire. I'm with Belcher, I'd much rather pick at 8 and 25 then move up a few spots.

Also, from what I understand this draft doesn't have the elite guys at the top but is deep enough. Do you really want to trade up to acquire a Linden type?

I'd rather pick 8th, take the slow road to building this team up, and have the franchise maintain some dignity unlike EDM, TOR, BUF, etc.

What's the point in watching if we aren't trying to win?
- NorthNuck

For me, If I'm a fan of any of those teams I'd be more excited than I am to watch Canucks games now. They've got a ton of potential and each are on the right track. I agree watching your team lose isn't fun, but it's a lot more fun when you've got the young pieces like those teams have visibly improving. For me Bo is that player for us. But those teams have an abundance of young talent and will be good for a long time. Did Chicago have dignity when they tanked for Kane and Toews or when they won 3 cups? The recipe doesn't work for every team, but it is the best chance we have for long term success.

Never said they have. But he hasn't really improved the roster all that much. What positive impact has he had?
- bloatedmosquito

It's too soon to call but the Gudbranson deal looks like it'll work out well, we got a reliable Dman and future Assistant Captain. I like the Baertschi deal as well, think him being on the team has helped to spark Horvat more than once.

Now go back and look again for the past 10 years and remove the top 2 from the equation, which are bloody expensive to acquire. I'm with Belcher, I'd much rather pick at 8 and 25 then move up a few spots.

Also, from what I understand this draft doesn't have the elite guys at the top but is deep enough. Do you really want to trade up to acquire a Linden type?
- golfingsince

Why would I do that? i want us to pick as high as possible, if I take out the highest picks of course drafting high doesn't seem like a good idea

For me, If I'm a fan of any of those teams I'd be more excited than I am to watch Canucks games now. They've got a ton of potential and each are on the right track. I agree watching your team lose isn't fun, but it's a lot more fun when you've got the young pieces like those teams have visibly improving. For me Bo is that player for us. But those teams have an abundance of young talent and will be good for a long time. Did Chicago have dignity when they tanked for Kane and Toews or when they won 3 cups? The recipe doesn't work for every team, but it is the best chance we have for long term success.
- neem55

I just think so much of it comes down to luck though. There's a reason tanking and finishing so low is still called "buying a lottery ticket". If someone asked me today, what team should I pick to cheer for in the NHL, with no prior bias, I would immediately say Winnipeg.

I just think so much of it comes down to luck though. There's a reason tanking and finishing so low is still called "buying a lottery ticket". If someone asked me today, what team should I pick to cheer for in the NHL, with no prior bias, I would immediately say Winnipeg.
- NorthNuck

Which is safe for you to say because the only reason Shiefele fell out of the top-5 is because it was an extremely strong draft

Why would I do that? i want us to pick as high as possible, if I take out the highest picks of course drafting high doesn't seem like a good idea
- neem55

His point was we aren't going to finish in the bottom 2/3 and it would cost us an arm and a leg to move up to those spots. Your point was that the draft drops off after 5 so we should move up there but by that logic we should move up to 1/2 because the talent drops off after that by comparison.

Which is safe for you to say because the only reason Shiefele fell out of the top-5 is because it was an extremely strong draft
- neem55

Laine

Again, If you look at the volume of quality players picked in the top-5 as opposed to the other 25 picks (26 starting this year) it is very significant. if you take the top-5 from 2006 to 2016 (ten years) and compare it to the rest of the first round picks, the 50 players in the top-5 range is a who's who of HOFer's. While the rest of the first round has a solid amount of those types of performers, it's statistically not even close (even if you just compare 1-5 to 6-10 it's not very close) which shouldn't be much of surprise. In "weak' drafts like some are alleging this year's is, picking in the top-5 is actually even more pertinent.

I do agree with that getting more picks is very important (I really, really hope we do), but the value of top-5 picks is simply undeniable.
- neem55

This year is not a weak draft, it is stronger than last year. There just doesn't seem to be a Matthews/Laine. Just a bunch of Pulijarvi, Tkachuk, Jost, etc types.

Laine
- NorthNuck

So they have two top5 players leading their team... I fail to see how this is countering my argument in any way, shape or form.

It's too soon to call but the Gudbranson deal looks like it'll work out well, we got a reliable Dman and future Assistant Captain. I like the Baertschi deal as well, think him being on the team has helped to spark Horvat more than once.
- NorthNuck

Really? That's it? Not much to get excited about.

The Gudbranson trade hurt the Panthers more than it helped the canucks. He's a big mobile Dman but definitely not a game changer. He's needed on this team but I wouldn't call him franchise corner-stone material.

Baer has to be much more consistent before I call that trade a winner. Horvat is good because he is a good hockey player regardless of who plays with him. That is one you have to give to Gillis regardless of your opinion of him.

How about the signings of Miller, Vrbata, Eriksson? How about the 'A' on Burrows? His choice of coaching staff? There is a lot more negatives then positives.

This year is not a weak draft, it is stronger than last year. There just doesn't seem to be a Matthews/Laine. Just a bunch of Pulijarvi, Tkachuk, Jost, etc types.
- Retinalz

I think the popular opinion is that it is weak, I don't think it's weak either.

It's too soon to call but the Gudbranson deal looks like it'll work out well, we got a reliable Dman and future Assistant Captain. I like the Baertschi deal as well, think him being on the team has helped to spark Horvat more than once.
- NorthNuck

I think Baerschi is starting to show the spark that he could be a 2LW. He is now on pace for about 40pts, that is kind of what you would expect out a 2nd line player. 40-60 is 2nd line and 60+ is first in todays NHL.

This year is not a weak draft, it is stronger than last year. There just doesn't seem to be a Matthews/Laine. Just a bunch of Pulijarvi, Tkachuk, Jost, etc types.
- Retinalz

I try not to be too rude on here but man you're (frank)ed.

I think Baerschi is starting to show the spark that he could be a 2LW. He is now on pace for about 40pts, that is kind of what you would expect out a 2nd line player. 40-60 is 2nd line and 60+ is first in todays NHL.
- Retinalz

So they have two top5 players leading their team... I fail to see how this is countering my argument in any way, shape or form.
- neem55

Do you by any chance remember how they got Laine?? Pure dumb luck. That's my point right there. You can tank all you want to give yourself the great odds, alienate your fanbase and create a laughing stock as you do it, but you can still be undone by dumb luck.

So they have two top5 players leading their team... I fail to see how this is countering my argument in any way, shape or form.
- neem55

I bet if NN was a GM and was offered the first overall, I don't seem him saying "no thanks, we're happy at picking 8th and twenty-(frank)ing-something".

First overall picks rock. They're perfect. What GMs choose to do with the 1stOA is where plans fall apart.

Really? That's it? Not much to get excited about.

The Gudbranson trade hurt the Panthers more than it helped the canucks. He's a big mobile Dman but definitely not a game changer. He's needed on this team but I wouldn't call him franchise corner-stone material.

Baer has to be much more consistent before I call that trade a winner. Horvat is good because he is a good hockey player regardless of who plays with him. That is one you have to give to Gillis regardless of your opinion of him.

How about the signings of Miller, Vrbata, Eriksson? How about the 'A' on Burrows? His choice of coaching staff? There is a lot more negatives then positives.
- bloatedmosquito

So you're using his choice of coaching staff and free agent signings as reasons we shouldn't trust him to acquire and effectively use draft picks?

I bet if NN was a GM and was offered the first overall, I don't seem him saying "no thanks, we're happy at picking 8th and twenty-(frank)ing-something".

First overall picks rock. They're perfect. What GMs choose to do with the 1stOA is where plans fall apart.
- bloatedmosquito

I'm talking about reality. The canucks will not finish in last, or 2nd last, or 3rd last. If we win the lottery in the spring I'll be just as happy as you will. However. Chances are if we wanted to move from where we will be slated in the first round up to 1st or 2nd overall it will cost us a massive amount of assets and probably be a horrible deal. Do you really want to set the team back further for the sake of getting 1 good player?

I think the popular opinion is that it is weak, I don't think it's weak either.
- neem55

It is deeper, which means stronger IMO. Matthews and laine are in a league of their own. But I think Patrick is as slightly better than Puljarvi or Dubois Which is not bad. If Patrick was in last years draft he would have been a guaranteed 3rd OA, not just because CBJ needed a center.

So you're using his choice of coaching staff and free agent signings as reasons we shouldn't trust him to acquire and effectively use draft picks?
- NorthNuck

No, didn't say that either. The original comment was that JB must trade to gain draft picks so he can "work his magic".

My comment was that I don’t think JB is the best person to initiate trades to gain draft picks based on his actions to date. I’m not dishing his draft record, I dishing his GM abilities.

No, didn't say that either. The original comment was that JB must trade to gain draft picks so he can "work his magic".

My comment was that I don’t think JB is the best person to initiate trades to gain draft picks based on his actions to date. I’m not dishing his draft record, I dishing his GM abilities.
- bloatedmosquito

Well I guess in the next few months we'll see if you're right? If the TDL comes and goes and we're not setup better for the draft I will concede that you were right