So as a player would a loophole be available to you if you pursued a degree that was say 2 years?
- Sabresfan-365

If he went to a 4 year college and pursued a degree in 2 years, the 4 year graduating class scenario would still exist, I believe.

What Baker got hung up on was if the player leaves school before his senior season the drafting club would have 4 June 1sts with to negotiate from the time he was drafted. Peterson was drafted in 2013. So in essence the 4 years of June 1st after Petersen got drafted would be June 1st this year. But that won't apply because the 4 years of college still applies here. The CBA is very tricky when it comes to college players.

If he went to a 4 year college and pursued a degree in 2 years, the 4 year graduating class scenario would still exist, I believe.

What Baker got hung up on was if the player leaves school before his senior season the drafting club would have 4 June 1sts with to negotiate from the time he was drafted. Peterson was drafted in 2013. So in essence the 4 years of June 1st after Petersen got drafted would be June 1st this year. But that won't apply because the 4 years of college still applies here. The CBA is very tricky when it comes to college players.
- mhp

Thats probably where it got messy. I found it strange since you'd think if he actually was eligible for FA this year there would be more talk around it

Thats probably where it got messy. I found it strange since you'd think if he actually was eligible for FA this year there would be more talk around it
- Sabresfan-365

Agreed. I think the 4 years of college over rides the 4 June 1sts after a player was drafted.

Agreed. I think the 4 years of college over rides the 4 June 1sts after a player was drafted.
- mhp

or does it perhaps say 4 june 1sts from which you start college? so the year with the waterloo whatevers doesnt really count

Maybe GMTM trades Lehner at the deadline for a winger or d-man, calls up Ullmark to backup Nilsson then signs Cal Petersen to his ELC in March and starts in Rochester ?
- 22sabresQ

that's his boy, won't happen

or does it perhaps say 4 june 1sts from which you start college? so the year with the waterloo whatevers doesnt really count
- Sabresfan-365

4 June 1sts after you're drafted.

6/1/14-year 1
6/1/15- year 2
6/1/16- year 3
6/1/17- year 4


That is what I believe is the 4 June 1st clause in the CBA facing Cal Petersen. The 4 years as a college player over rides this though I believe.

4 June 1sts after you're drafted.

6/1/14-year 1
6/1/15- year 2
6/1/16- year 3
6/1/17- year 4


That is what I believe is the 4 June 1st clause in the CBA facing Cal Petersen. The 4 years as a college player over rides this though I believe.
- mhp

is there any recent example of this?

4 June 1sts after you're drafted.

6/1/14-year 1
6/1/15- year 2
6/1/16- year 3
6/1/17- year 4


That is what I believe is the 4 June 1st clause in the CBA facing Cal Petersen. The 4 years as a college player over rides this though I believe.
- mhp

they should make it 5 years

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19 is a bona fide college student at the time
of his selection in the Entry Draft, or becomes a bona fide college student
prior to the first June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft, and
remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college
class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for
his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation
of his college class. The Club need not make a Bona Fide Offer to such
Player to retain such rights.

He technically didnt become a college student till after the 1st june 1 following his draft no?

he is not our best goalie prospect
- homiedclown

You're right. It's Kasdorf...

He technically didnt become a college student till after the 1st june 1 following his draft no?
- Sabresfan-365

Idk, but therein lies the answer. That makes me a little nervous.

You're right. It's Kasdorf...
- bluengold12

it's the big one murray drafted

is there any recent example of this?
- Sabresfan-365

I have been looking at different players and haven't found one. The old CBA had a player like Justin Schultz leave Wisconsin after his junior year and the year he was drafted in 2008 he played that season in the BCHL. That accounted for the 4 years and he signed as a FA.

Most college players under the new CBA sign their ELC's with the club that drafted them. Vesey was the lone exception to my knowledge. Jake McCabe was drafted in his freshman year and he signed his ELC after his junior year.

He technically didnt become a college student till after the 1st june 1 following his draft no?
- Sabresfan-365

Yes. Cal Petersen was drafted in 2013 and became a college student in 2014.

it's the big one murray drafted
- homiedclown

Sorry but no chance. Petersen has proven all ready he's a prospect t be reckon with. Johansson hasn't proven anything yet. Just has size

Yes. Cal Petersen was drafted in 2013 and became a college student in 2014.
- mhp

does that change things in any way?

Sorry but no chance. Petersen has proven all ready he's a prospect t be reckon with. Johansson hasn't proven anything yet. Just has size
- bluengold12

the best american hockey players are not playing college hockey at 21

It's not that I don't believe you guys, but what makes Petersen so special? There's plenty of goaltenders that put up good stats in college that never translate to the next level.

Honestly curious because I've never watched him play myself.

Sorry but no chance. Petersen has proven all ready he's a prospect t be reckon with. Johansson hasn't proven anything yet. Just has size
- bluengold12

solid numbers in sweden this year. goalies are hard to predict but id give the edge to petersen


interesting that Johansson is credited with a silver medal from the world juniors in 2014. I dont remember him being there, was he the backup?

I have been looking at different players and haven't found one. The old CBA had a player like Justin Schultz leave Wisconsin after his junior year and the year he was drafted in 2008 he played that season in the BCHL. That accounted for the 4 years and he signed as a FA.

Most college players under the new CBA sign their ELC's with the club that drafted them. Vesey was the lone exception to my knowledge. Jake McCabe was drafted in his freshman year and he signed his ELC after his junior year.
- mhp

http://www.lighthousehock...lege-loophole-ncaa-change


New CBA: The same, but slightly different

The rule in (iii) -- for traditional college players who do not play in the USHL after being drafted -- remains the same in the new CBA. But here is how the new CBA treats the next section (emphasis and line breaks mine, in a futile attempt at clarity):

8.6 (c) (iv)

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and does not remain a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain exclusive rights for the negotiation of his services until the later of:

(a) the fourth June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft,

or (b) thirty (30) days after NHL Central Registry receives notice that the Player is no longer a bona fide college student;

provided that **IF** the Player ceases to be a bona fide college student on or after January 1 of an academic year and the Player:

(1) is in his fourth year of college and has commenced his fourth year of NCAA eligibility,

or (2) is in his fourth year of college and is scheduled to graduate from college at the end of his fourth year, then in the circumstances described in (1) or (2), the Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for such Player's services through and including the August 15 following the date on which he ceases to be a bona fide college student.

(The 30 days point is interesting, because you used to hear media refer to a 30-day notice under the old CBA, but that was not actually in the CBA. If it was a rule before, it wasn't written in the published document.)

Anyway, if I'm reading this right -- and Bossy knows that's always iffy when dealing with CBA-ese -- the CBA ensures that if a prospect legitimately wants to leave college in his third college year (if he did a post-draft USHL year, thus making his third college year his "fourth" June 1) -- or even in his fourth year if he quits college before January 1 -- to start his career, he can still do so and, if not signed by his drafting club by June 1, he is free to shop his services.

However, a prospect who is completing all his credits (or very nearly) as a senior in college (so, he stayed enrolled past Jan. 1 his fourth year, probably because he wanted to finish his hockey season first), cannot then use the loophole to "leave college" early and become a free agent on June 1. Such a player's rights would be held through Aug. 15.

As fans we tend to wring our hands over "loopholes" and stuff like this because we want all the marbles and all the prospects and all the indentured servants to be ours, ours, mine mine mine.

But this clause has always tried to strike a balance between two things: 1) Most prospects' rights are held for only two years, and 2) Most college players will inherently not want to sign until beyond two years (They're in college! Someone is probably paying for their degree!).

So if you decide college isn't your thing anymore, the NHL says you still belong to your drafting team -- unless you've put in three years (for USHL or junior B-type players) or four years (for traditional college-bound draftees) without your drafting team coaxing you out of college already. I've always read that minor "loophole" as some sort of recognition for the fact that a prospect in his fourth June 1 since his draft has already given up some earning potential by pursuing his degree through age 21-23 instead of taking an ELC at age 18-20.

What the new CBA spells out is that a prospect cannot go through the full college experience except for that final course or semester and then use this well-intentioned loophole to abandon his drafting team and shop his services to the highest bidder on June 1.

It's not that I don't believe you guys, but what makes Petersen so special? There's plenty of goaltenders that put up good stats in college that never translate to the next level.

Honestly curious because I've never watched him play myself.
- chilliard77

I have watched him play a few times each year

the college game IMO is slower than the AHL game

It's not that I don't believe you guys, but what makes Petersen so special? There's plenty of goaltenders that put up good stats in college that never translate to the next level.

Honestly curious because I've never watched him play myself.
- chilliard77

Not only does he have the stats but he was named the captain of his team which rarely happens for a goalie, he has played a lot of games in a row and that proves he is all ready tested with endurance which is often a problem for young goalies. Those are all intangibles to me that put him over the edge to go along with the stats.

does that change things in any way?
- Sabresfan-365

I don't because I believe the 4 years in college super cedes the four June 1sts.

when does Garth have Bobby Ryan GMTM rumours going? Tomorrow morning?

when does Garth have Bobby Ryan GMTM rumours going? Tomorrow morning?
- DDM-Coga

The same time the Avs have one about Zadorov struggling