Like Hitchcock is known for?
- puckhead17

When Hitch coached here, he allowed skilled guys like Forsberg and Roenick to still play aggressively. He did the same with Modano in Dallas. You can play a D first system without completely hamstringing your better players

Since it's full on doom and gloom, what could the Flyers realistically get from ARZ if we offered Giroux and Simmonds? I'm using ARZ because 1. They will have top draft pick. 2. They have cap space and have a fair amount of pending UFAS and cheap young players. 3. Some added veteran players would fit their age group / balance of their team (especially Simmonds as a team leader).
- arichardson22

Why would Arizona give up the younger players we need for Giroux. They're in the same situation we're in.

They'd likely be trading the best player in the deal, which is never a good thing. Trading a star player for a bunch of prospects and spare parts isn't my idea of good asset management.
- jmatchett383

Who wants that type of return? Who were the best players at the time in the Richards and carter deals?

Actually, Provorov would get the best return. Who should we shop him to?
- jmatchett383

I consider Provy untouchable and that's why I don't throw him into the best return category. Like I said, I don't want to trade Simmonds; he's my favorite flyer and has been for years. But, as most have said and agreed on, he's our most tradable asset and if this team continues to struggle, you have to consider options to improve which may include trading him.

Last night I actually thought they played a good game until that 1st goal. They seemed to be going to the net. Playing a tight defense, not giving up chances. They just have a small degree of wiggle room to win games.
- J35Bacher

They played a very solid first period. Aggressive on the forecheck, and got a number of pucks to the net, and some good scoring chances including a couple of second chance efforts. It was downhill offensively from there.

Who wants that type of return? Who were the best players at the time in the Richards and carter deals?
- Just5

Probably Richards and Carter, but you were trading them for 2 young but veteran wingers that you needed as well as a top-10 pick and the prospect considered the best player not in the NHL. You had Giroux ready as the #1C and Hartnell was a 30-goal scorer. Not exactly an apples-to-apples situation. If you lose Simmonds, you open up a huge hole in the lineup both in terms of skill and attitude.

That's not what I saw last night. They were pretty aggressive and played a style that isn't anywhere near taking it too far.
- MJL

At times yes. It just seems like the entire lineup is gripping their sticks too tight and are afraid to make mistakes. They are getting some shots, but very few prime scoring chances.

I consider Provy untouchable and that's why I don't throw him into the best return category. Like I said, I don't want to trade Simmonds; he's my favorite flyer and has been for years. But, as most have said and agreed on, he's our most tradable asset and if this team continues to struggle, you have to consider options to improve which may include trading him.
- arichardson22

He, Voracek, and Provorov are the only 3 untouchable players on the team (barring something crazy) to me.

Edit: Something crazy is like Jamie Benn for a Simmonds package or McDavid in a Provorov package.

He, Voracek, and Provorov are the only 3 untouchable players on the team (barring something crazy) to me.
- jmatchett383

At this point, knowing they are likely 3-4 years from truly contending, no one over 25 should truly be untouchable.

Why would Arizona give up the younger players we need for Giroux. They're in the same situation we're in.
- MJL

Yeah. I don't think Arizona is ideal. I actually think Ottawa would be a good place. I think he would waive to go there. Just my thoughts with no information. Problem would be making money work. This will make people laugh but I think you would have to take Bobby Ryan back.

When Hitch coached here, he allowed skilled guys like Forsberg and Roenick to still play aggressively. He did the same with Modano in Dallas. You can play a D first system without completely hamstringing your better players
- BiggE

I kind of remember he & Roenick butting heads because they were too defensive, quashing any creativity some of the offensive guys had.

Seperate topic. You remember who was on the ice when Carter scored in overtime?
Weiss, and Manning I believe.
Is this an example, (albeit a slight example), of not utilizing the proper players he has?
Matt Read scored a blazer on Price, and 2 games later is scratched, makes you wonder what this guy is thinking.

St Louis dominated board play, especially in transition. I lost count of how many times the Flyers lost position trying to go wide on the defense

Yeah. I don't think Arizona is ideal. I actually think Ottawa would be a good place. I think he would waive to go there. Just my thoughts with no information. Problem would be making money work. This will make people laugh but I think you would have to take Bobby Ryan back.
- J35Bacher

Why would the Flyers do that???

Probably Richards and Carter, but you were trading them for 2 young but veteran wingers that you needed as well as a top-10 pick and the prospect considered the best player not in the NHL. You had Giroux ready as the #1C and Hartnell was a 30-goal scorer. Not exactly an apples-to-apples situation. If you lose Simmonds, you open up a huge hole in the lineup both in terms of skill and attitude.
- jmatchett383

They have lindblom. Who admittedly isn't as good of a player as simmonds. But at least can come up and play his natural LW spot which would allow them to slot konecny and b schenn in rw slots where they're arguably best at.

The answer to finding a top line center isn't sitting on our hands and waiting for rubstov, hoping g can rebound, or hoping it's whoever is there at 15 in this draft

At times yes. It just seems like the entire lineup is gripping their sticks too tight and are afraid to make mistakes. They are getting some shots, but very few prime scoring chances.
- BiggE

They had probably 5 prime scoring chances in the first period from around the net and in the slot. The 2nd period the Blues ramped up their checking game, and the Flyers didn't push back hard enough. Once the Blues got the lead, they packed it in, keeping the Flyers to the outside. As far as gripping their sticks, I bet they are. They're a low scoring offensive team in a goal scoring slump which adds up to well, basically nothing.

The sky isn't falling. The Flyers are a bubble team that has been making over the farm system simultaneously (with encouraging signs). No more and no less.
- bmeltzer

Bill, I could not agree more. Last year making the playoffs was a surprise. The preseason line was that they could very well take a step or two backwards this year. What is disheartening to me is the poor play 5 on 5 by Giroux's line and the lack of attention to defense on the PP. I really like Giroux, but if he is supposed to be one of the best in the league shouldn't we see that more often reflected as a positive on the score sheet? Same with Jame. Ghost is sitting when he isn't even the worst offender on ice when it comes to defensive breakdowns.

They were at least another full year away before the season started and they still are. It is just that the scenery on this stretch of the road is pretty nasty.

He, Voracek, and Provorov are the only 3 untouchable players on the team (barring something crazy) to me.

Edit: Something crazy is like Jamie Benn for a Simmonds package or McDavid in a Provorov package.
- jmatchett383

If the Flyers sign over their franchise to Edmonton, they wouldn't trade them McDavid.

They have lindblom. Who admittedly isn't as good of a player as simmonds. But at least can come up and play his natural LW spot which would allow them to slot konecny and b schenn in rw slots where they're arguably best at.

The answer to finding a top line center isn't sitting on our hands and waiting for rubstov, hoping g can rebound, or hoping it's whoever is there at 15 in this draft
- Just5

And the only player we can trade for one is to move Simmonds? That is the only way? You can't sign Tavares in UFA or trade for him? You can't trade anyone else for one? No one else has any value at all?

Also, Lindblom has played exactly zero games in the NHL.

Edit: If something comes along where you can't turn it down, anyone on the roster can be traded. But to me, it would have to be a ridiculous overpayment for Simmonds, not a Duchesne type return.

If the Flyers sign over their franchise to Edmonton, they wouldn't trade them McDavid.
- PLindbergh31

Which is why it would be crazy.

Why would the Flyers do that???
- jmatchett383

I wouldn't do a one for one.


I think if you move Giroux your getting a Rick Nash type of return. Not sexy but probably very useful.

Bill, I could not agree more. Last year making the playoffs was a surprise. The preseason line was that they could very well take a step or two backwards this year. What is disheartening to me is the poor play 5 on 5 by Giroux's line and the lack of attention to defense on the PP. I really like Giroux, but if he is supposed to be one of the best in the league shouldn't we see that more often reflected as a positive on the score sheet? Same with Jame. Ghost is sitting when he isn't even the worst offender on ice when it comes to defensive breakdowns.

They were at least another full year away before the season started and they still are. It is just that the scenery on this stretch of the road is pretty nasty.
- wbon22

Gostisbehere has hands down been the worst defender among the defenseman for the Flyers. His defensive game has been a mess.

I wouldn't do a one for one.


I think if you move Giroux your getting a Rick Nash type of return. Not sexy but probably very useful.
- J35Bacher

I just mean that moving Giroux and his contract for Bobby Ryan and his contract makes no sense, unless Ottawa retains a good amount ant throws in something much better.

Why would Arizona give up the younger players we need for Giroux. They're in the same situation we're in.
- MJL

ARZ is pretty weak up the middle. Even more so if Hanzal doesn't resign in offseason. I used Giroux because it's been thrown around here that he's hard to trade. Package him with Simmonds and it's more attractive of a deal. Their age group is extremely young as I stated. And even more so with Vbrtaa, Hanzal, and Doan all possibly going. You add Giroux you have a 1C/2C, a good faceoof guy, a PP specialist and a player to add to the marketing of the team. The main component of the deal for ARZ is getting Simmonds; Giroux is more a salary move on our end and a opportunity for ARZ to get him for a discount I suppose. At the end of the day, it's hypothetical talk fitting the doom and gloom vibes of the thread / recent times.

Which is why it would be crazy.
- jmatchett383

What is the best case scenario for the Flyers D prospects? They all pan out and they have a legit contending d core in 5 years?? If that dream scenario happens, where is the scoring coming from??

Trade everyone for other stuff because Flyers.