Or not falling two spots in the draft and not being able to take Matthews or Laine...



I wonder how the Sportsnet guys would write their piece on the "You Are Doing It Wrong" when we were playing the Leafs this season if it were us with Matthews and they picked PULJUJARVI instead? With absolutely nothing being done different, it could have played out that way.

Post Sedins... Matthews, Horvat, Sutter, Gaunce or other prospect down the middle after the Sedins. Would that still be "doing it wrong"? Would Toronto after trading a 1st for a vet to win now and falling two spots and not having a 1st line C in the pipeline be still considered "doing it right still"? Perspectives would be different with nothing being done different.

I hate it but everything could be a hell of a lot different with some good luck, and not nearly as bad if we didnt have bad luck.
- boonerbuck

Of course you'll get the they played the better odds answer. That's why the plan works. But I am with you on this summary. Just like Oilers moved up and got Mcdavid.

When you catch a break on futility then it's all about how good you are. I wonder what may break the Nucks way? They had that one win on Bure and the hockey gods haven't smiled since. At least as far as we can see with what we have.

The Nucks are due for a win on an exceptionally gifted player out of nowhere. Let's see if its winner winner chicken dinner time soon.

Id be shocked if you could move them at this point. Maybe at the deadline next season you could pick up half their salaries to try and give them a run at the cup if they were willing... Wouldnt count on a return would just do it out of respect but would be tough when you factor in all the top teams are tight up against the cap. They would be fine as a 3rd liners how could play 2nd unit PP type idea.

Slim chance that happens though.
- mauryballstein

That would require talent from within to the top 2 lines.
Thats not the Sedins problem they r on record saying they welcome it.

The tear down should have begun 2013 but Lefty forgets he was cheering on Sedins and Edler back then and was constantly telling me you can't move the Sedins, Edler is our best Dman when I was saying move Edler for Simmonds and don't re-sign the twins . Now he is paying the price of what I told him be careful what you wish for.
- VANTEL

Hind sight GMing. It's even better when you compare things to teams who are going to be highly successful down the road... there has to be a name for combing hindsight with seeing the future and combining it all to judge someone's intelligence and competence.

Never? Oh come on... you are not that arrogant. These things can still play out differently and they are tied into what Benning did in the beginning.

What if JV comes around and with other future parts, gives us 8/10 years of exciting physical hockey and makes a difference?

So he traded away one of those prospects from his first draft...What if Gudbransson lives up to his reputation and meshes in with our young core and is everything people who know him have said he is with leadership, character, and heart and soul but McCann just ends up being a not hard to obtain generic depth offensive player that GM's like Brian Burke just give away(Granlund?)

What if trading Lack and signing Miller turns into a solid D man in Brisbois? It's a long shot but Miller could be moved for a pick.

When I sit here and look at the "should haves".... I see way more Mike Gillis. Time will tell on the JB "should have's". Take care of that crystal ball. Not many people have the privalidge of owning one.

- boonerbuck

I liked Gudrbransons game more last year and at this point he looks like a bottom pairing guy or at least he is on this team as he falls in behind tanev and stechter., then you factor in Tryamkin.. Hopefully a team will give us a 2nd rounder for him and we can move on before JB signs him to long term deal at huge money.

That would require talent from within to the top 2 lines.
Thats not the Sedins problem they r on record saying they welcome it.
- Nighthawk

oh ya i know i was referring them being third liners on another team.

I think he knew that when be said fill the age gap then draft & develop.
He further stated lately the age gap is done & time to keep picks.
In 2018 the old slate is totally cleaned & its all JB's team.
- Nighthawk

See, it's rational opinions like that that earn bad reps on here.

All kidding aside, I approach the topic like this. Not on fantasy text book rebuilds that are almost always under much different circumstances than ours.

I liked Gudrbransons game more last year and at this point he looks like a bottom pairing guy or at least he is on this team as he falls in behind tanev and stechter., then you factor in Tryamkin.. Hopefully a team will give us a 2nd rounder for him and we can move on before JB signs him to long term deal at huge money.
- mauryballstein

this team desperately needs EG. I'm sick of paying $ to watch this soft bunch of country club pussies

this team desperately needs EG. I'm sick of paying $ to watch this soft bunch of country club pussies
- CanuckDon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-6yxSgxk1U

Please name even 3 forwards who have his AHL stats through 40+ games that have gone on to have that kind of a career?

Gudbranson has played 300+ games, it's safe to assume that he is what he is at this point. He's probably a better player than what he's shown in Vancouver, but he's not some top 4 dman who can anchor a pairing. Yet Florida traded him because he was asking to be paid like one. If we're blindly trusting professional GM's here then doesn't it raise a red flag that Florida's GM traded a young dman like that instead of signing him?


Also, people need to stop forgetting about the pick that Benning traded with McCann for Gudbranson, it wasn't a straight up deal so it's unfair to evaluate it as one.
- Nucker101

You are writing JV off. We don't remember JV looking better in the NHL last season than he does now in the AHL after a conditioning issue at all? Just look only at his AHL games... you are being selective as usual. That's it. He has had poorer start in the AHL than he did in the NHL... it's over.

Gudbranson won't be worth much more to us down the road than McCann and that pick? We also know that right? Guddy was 23 when the trade went down by he way. Still room for improvement and that was besides my point. read what I said about him.

This is exactly what I mean. I present an arguement on what you don't know and can't judge... and immediately it is brushed aside and the crystal ball comes out... and the eraser for the past...

I see a lot of you and Lefty giving players, prospects, coaches, the GM, pretty much everything.... no time from the very start. You two are the least patient here. Clearly. You the most. You threw in the towel on everything immediately in JB's 1st season. Even if you are right about some things, and wrong about others... there has been zero patience.

this team desperately needs EG. I'm sick of paying $ to watch this soft bunch of country club pussies
- CanuckDon

Some forwards of his character would also be appreciated

You are writing JV off. We don't remember JV looking better in the NHL last season than he does now in the AHL after a conditioning issue at all? Just look only at his AHL games... you are being selective as usual. That's it. He has had poorer start in the AHL than he did in the NHL... it's over.

Gudbranson won't be worth much more to us down the road than McCann and that pick? We also know that right? Guddy was 23 when the trade went down by he way. Still room for improvement and that was besides my point. read what I said about him.

This is exactly what I mean. I present an arguement on what you don't know and can't judge... and immediately it is brushed aside and the crystal ball comes out... and the eraser for the past...

I see a lot of you and Lefty giving players, prospects, coaches, the GM, pretty much everything.... no time from the very start. You two are the least patient here. Clearly. You the most. You threw in the towel on everything immediately in JB's 1st season. Even if you are right about some things, and wrong about others... there has been zero patience.

- boonerbuck

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-6yxSgxk1U
- A_SteamingLombardi

wtf

Still with the Sbisa over payment. How much should have Benning paid him per season again?

The Leafs are doing a good job for what we've seen so far. Trading away first picks for vets would get you shot here though. Is it text book if the Leafs trade away another 1st rounder in less than a year with a young player/prospect to pick another vet? It sure seems like they've been hunting hard for a high end centre and/or a top 2 D... I've even heard a little chatter from inner circles myself. It's a little early to be making these claims especially when time is not given to our own management by you and Lefty. You two have uncanny hind sight and foresight. Possibly a time machine or some other kind of booth.

Great. Leafs have text books...Figure it out though. JB was not hired to do a teardown. The Sedins were here and dumping them surely wasn't on his job description. Neither was tearing the team down around them even though he did make a pretty good injection of youth into the sytem. Even when people accept this, they still soldier on thinking everything should be handled by Benning as a teardown in their arguements. Eriksson will not get in the way of that after the Sedins. He's 1 contract on a team shedding tens of millions soon. I don't think there is a team in the league who couldnt affort to pay a couple of vets after shedding the Sedins, Burrows, Miller and Edler... 30 millionish

...and no one is arguing the small poop don't matter. Often the small poop is being way over played. Often the small poop doesn't fit the posters idea... which is played off as counter-productive... but in truth, it's not... nor is his idea everything the way he thinks it is.
- boonerbuck

- Sbisa has no leverage, paying him 3.6M per was just inexcusable, it made no sense on any level

- Regarding the bold, it's hilarious to keep seeing these comments from you guys. Then 6-12 months later we get hit with "well hindsight is 20/20". Seems like a great way for you guys to just deflect anything.

- I'm well aware that JB/Linden sold Aquilini on the re-tool on the fly plan. That's fine, but their execution of that plan has been terrible. They've overvalued veteran role players and forced young players to play in over their heads(McCann struggled after a hot start, Virtanen before the WJHC was struggling, Hutton was expected to be a top 4 dman heading into this year, etc.).

Never....it has nothing to do with arrogance, it's just an opinion. I'll always feel like they should've build thru the draft starting in 2014. Bottom out and try to acquire as many picks as possible.
- LeftCoaster

How many GM's have done a teardown like you want coming out of everything we recently did... not because they can't make the playoffs... but because they keep getting eliminated in the 1st round? Add to it that FA made an investment in the Sedins that was still very new that he inteded to mature. You are brushing it all aside as something most other GM's would ignore and Benning is an idiot. No. It just doesn't play out like that. It's now hind sight gming today...

I get what you think. They should have. You are kind of dodging the point. What you think is unrealistic based on how things play out in the NHL. Teams in the Canucks position rarely switch gears like that immediately after dumping tens of millions of dollars into contracts with the ink still wet. Sedins, Burrows, Edler were all just signed... you were happy with it but a season later you are claiming the time is right for a teardown so let's start forcing contracts out. Please tell me my accusation of you being unrealistic, impatient and dismissive is wrong some more.

this team desperately needs EG. I'm sick of paying $ to watch this soft bunch of country club pussies
- CanuckDon

Let alone giving EG away for peanuts lol

What does that practically look like? How do you realistically get that done?
- Nuck4U

Gudbransson is a big shift in culture and young... but he likes McCann better he has stated a few times.

You are writing JV off. We don't remember JV looking better in the NHL last season than he does now in the AHL after a conditioning issue at all? Just look only at his AHL games... you are being selective as usual. That's it. He has had poorer start in the AHL than he did in the NHL... it's over.

Gudbranson won't be worth much more to us down the road than McCann and that pick? We also know that right? Guddy was 23 when the trade went down by he way. Still room for improvement and that was besides my point. read what I said about him.

This is exactly what I mean. I present an arguement on what you don't know and can't judge... and immediately it is brushed aside and the crystal ball comes out... and the eraser for the past...

I see a lot of you and Lefty giving players, prospects, coaches, the GM, pretty much everything.... no time from the very start. You two are the least patient here. Clearly. You the most. You threw in the towel on everything immediately in JB's 1st season. Even if you are right about some things, and wrong about others... there has been zero patience.

- boonerbuck

- So should we not criticize the Canucks brass for not being able to keep JV in shape or criticize them for not doing their homework on the kid's attitude?

- Gudbranson can be the best locker room guy ever, doesn't make him worth paying 4.5M+, and again, show me examples of a dman suddenly taking a clear step up after already playing 300+ NHL games? That's a very rare occurrence, he most likely is what he is at this point. Physically he's mature, mentally he's had tons of games of experience.

- Benning's in his 3rd year, at what point are fans allowed to criticize him? The majority of our players on the roster and in the farm system have all been acquired by him. I never saw these posts from you under Nonis/Gillis. I get that he's a professional, but there have been plenty of bad GM's in professional sports, just because they got hired, doesn't automatically mean that they're good at their jobs.

Gudbransson is a big shift in culture and young... but he likes McCann better he has stated a few times.
- boonerbuck

How so? The defense doesn't look any worse at all without him. You'd hope his loss would be more felt if you're planning to pay him top 4 dman money. Weird that Garrison/Hamhuis was criticized for being inconsistent and struggling against speed, but yet it's fine when Gudbranson struggled in similar fashion.

I think you're completely out of touch with your thinking, since the inception of the salary cap (2006) several uncompetitive teams have used the draft to bottom out and rebuild. What happened before that is irrelevant, the rules are different now.
- LeftCoaster

Out to lunch? You just shifted what I'm saying. I'm talking about the circumstances of what leads to teams deciding to tear it down and go all in on the draft. You know, the situation we were in this 2014 you keep on bringing up. Which of those teams went all in on the teardown/draft that hadn't missed the playoffs more than once in the last 9 or so seasons? Which teams just had a final recently, a couple of presidents trophies, scoring titles and Hart trophy? Which of those teams just resigned most of their core inside the last season or two? That is a huge investment for the owner to just flip on right away.

I'm out to lunch am I? All that crazy rationalization and lack of dismissing... quick, throw a net over me and get me to the funny farm before it spreads.

Hopefully we'll see a shift towards that train of thought this spring.
- LeftCoaster

Patience.

Gudbransson is a big shift in culture and young... but he likes McCann better he has stated a few times.
- boonerbuck

Yeah I have seen the McCann love. Well it's more about keeping all picks and developing them for the next several years. That was his beef.

But my focus was not on the past. He said they need to change now. Bottom out and do a tear down now.

So instead of giving a direct answer with specifics on how that realistically works he says it's obvious. I don't get how he sees that happening?

I liked Gudrbransons game more last year and at this point he looks like a bottom pairing guy or at least he is on this team as he falls in behind tanev and stechter., then you factor in Tryamkin.. Hopefully a team will give us a 2nd rounder for him and we can move on before JB signs him to long term deal at huge money.
- mauryballstein

??? Gudbransson for a 2nd


He has more trade value than that. He's 24 years old, 300 games experience, big, physical and fast and fights to protect his team. He also was a beast in the playoffs last season and had the most ice time for the Panthers. A half season here in this mess and he's now only worth a 2nd?

That's taking "what have you done for me lately" way too far.

Let alone giving EG away for peanuts lol
- Nighthawk

The unwanted are busts that need to be dumped. That's the attitude from those who don't like a player.

??? Gudbransson for a 2nd


He has more trade value than that. He's 24 years old, 300 games experience, big, physical and fast and fights to protect his team. He also was a beast in the playoffs last season and had the most ice time for the Panthers. A half season here in this mess and he's now only worth a 2nd?

That's taking "what have you done for me lately" way too far.
- boonerbuck

He'd probably look a lot better if he had Brian Campbell as his partner again. To play in the top 4, he needs someone who can anchor the pairing. Hutton wasn't ready for it and so they struggled. Hutton actually looks a lot better without him though.

this team desperately needs EG. I'm sick of paying $ to watch this soft bunch of country club pussies
- CanuckDon

FKN right.


We want a culture change people say... but only through the draft. That isn't realistic at all... drafting by culture and type... Lefty again is out to lunch. I understand drafting best player available and drafting by position... but typically, your culture will be defined later as a group and if they are coming from the draft mostly, it's going to be like throwing a cup of dice.