Lol
Just the other day I was thinking how nice it was not to be inundated with trolls from other teams. Then today happened.

Explains why the team doesn't quit and the heart Carol brought up in blog.
- Nuck4U

Heart can go a long long ways....
'82 & '94 cup runs were all about that.

- Why not just qualify offer Sbisa then? Why do 2 years and give him a raise after a bad season?

- What I meant was that clearly Benning laid out and presented a plan to Aquilini before being hired, all I'm saying is that he's done a poor job of executing it.

- Dorsett is a fringe NHL player these days, you can find guys like him in FA every year. Ryan White for example this past summer. No one's afraid of him and he's not very good at anything as a hockey player outside of being fast. Benning paid a draft pick for him and then paid him handsomely for what he brings. Another prime example of a little thing that hurts the team's flexibility.

- Sutter is what he is, a 3LC who can score goals and PK, but he doesn't produce enough overall offense so be a legit top 6 player.

- I've already stated that I think Gudbranson is better than what he's shown as a Canuck so far, so I have no clue how you take that as me judging him too soon.

- Do you have anything to back up that the Canucks play better with Dorsett and/or Gudbranson in the lineup? The stats I value all suggest otherwise.

- Yeah, I agree that injuries did force the Canucks to play those 2 more than they should have last year Thats because Benning and co. have done a piss poor job of adding quality vets in the AHL who can be called up as stopgaps. Benning should have learned by know that the Canucks are more susceptible to injuries with their travel schedule, yet the organization was super thin on forwards last year and this year Utica is a mess, making it even more difficult for prospects like Virtanen to develop and gain confidence when playing with guys who aren't even highly skilled by AHL standards.
- Nucker101

Yes, our old Sbisa argument playing out exactly the same over and over. You think Benning should have given Sbisa way less per year. I point out he got almost everything he had coming to him under the CBA and then remembering that, switch to his term... which was short to begin with and open to the expansion draft if not traded...and open to trade which doesnt look impossible now at all. So you will switch up and go on about how bad he is and you hate him... but this season he is much better and unlike last year, he is earning this years salary... so we have 1 of 2 seasons where he was over paid... the amount of Sbisa hate and team changing that centers around that contract is hillarious... really is... he's gone in a couple of months... how did he hurt the future again?


Dorsett is a a 4rth liner. He could be replaced by other 4rth liners to do 4rth line duty and break their face on people's fists but JB chose this 4rth line player to be a 4rth line player... get the point I'm getting at... JB like Dorsett and he is good at his job if you don't expect him to win fights against enforcers... which Dorsett is not. Overpaid... yes. There seems to be enough of that on the team to be critical for sure.... but often, that is all there is to be critical of in these arguements and I don't want to come across like it doesnt matter.... but you go too far... Sbisa's extra $200k for example being such a breaking point with you.

Sutter is a stop gap for a top 6 sometimes and isnt even a top 6 most nights 5 on 5. His special teams drive up his minutes. He's doing ok on a poop team. He'll be moveable if retaining salary in a couple of seasons. I'm not worried. He hasnt kept us from drafting high... we need to ice a team and two way players are needed why we transition... sigh... even if you could see these things... you wouldnt admit it. Every arguement you make is based off not tearing this team down more or less... I stated this earlier about you and Lefty, even when you acknowledge that the complete teardown was out of JB's doing... the list of grieviences continue tie into that over and over.

Sorry on Guddy. Sometimes we have a hard time remembering which one of you two posted a comment. I've been treating at as the same poster at times, it does look like you have access to his user account these days.

Sorry bud, you are going to have to do your own research on Guddy and Dorsett. I said they were more physical and abrasive. Can you find a quote where I said the Canucks play better with them in the line up or are you doing that thing again where I am given an opinion by you and then I'm challenged to defend it.

More physical and abrasive would mean I'm not talking about Tanev type hits where he is making soft contact on the puck battles and such. I'm talking about hits that wear down opponants on the boards, clearing the front of the net, after the whistle stuff... sticking up for players, fighting, intimidation, agitation... So, why don't you go find the stats that are going to show me I'm wrong?

Last paragraph...^^^ Like I said, Benning doesnt have your hind sight jedi skills nor the abilty to see things unfolding in the future the way people think they do here. I'm not talking about players getting old. You also said he should know about injuries by now... take a look at our D... he definitely learned that. We have depth beyond last season... last season we had enough depth to handle a few injuries on D as well... but it wasn't enough. Adjustents were made... but ignored by you.

This team needs time. Something you will never be willing to provide. Don't deny it. You panicked right away. You went into slant mode on everything and it made it hard for you to have discussions with people on here. I've never seen a person give prospects and young players so little time and patience.... well, Canucks that is. When it came to the Flames, you were willing to give their young players time... no wait, you bailed there after their one successful season was followed by an ebarassing one... never mind.

https://www.sportingchart...team-hit-statistics/2016/

Kings are 1st in hits per game, 22nd in the standings

Coyotes are 2nd in hits per game, but 2nd last in the league

Flyers are 5th in hits per game, yet 18th in the standings

Hawks dead last in hits, 6th in the league

Wild 29th in hits per game, yet 2nd in the league
- Nucker101

interesting in season stats....
too bad that means squat in the playoffs, hits win then

I've missed you

- The argument is about this regime's incompetence at everything, drafting included

- By all accounts JV is in pretty decent shape now, yet he's still struggling in the AHL. Again, there's very few examples in the entire history of the NHL of a prospect going on to have a prominent career after putting up the numbers he has in the AHL so far. His issues aren't just conditioning alone.

- What exactly is Gudbranson going to suddenly improve at? He's physically mature, has played a ton of games so mentally he's pretty much gone through it all in the NHL. I don't see him getting suddenly getting way bigger/faster and he's not suddenly going to develop offensive skill.

- Everytime someone speaks out against this regime, we get hit with the same old "be patient", "he's a professional" or "why don't you be the GM then?" And then even if a poster ends up being right about something we get called a "whiner" or told "hindsight is 20/20"

That poop gets tiresome man. Apparently singing Kumbaya and only female doging about other people female doging is the only thing that flies around here these days.

- I liked the Nonis/Gillis days here, both the supporters/detractors had the types of discussions we're having now, and yes it was repetitive back then too. Tons of the same debates over Raymond, Kesler's linemates and playmking ability. If Bieksa should stay or go, if AV was a good coach or not, etc. But the difference was that we didn't have a bunch of people crying about it.

You can't disagree with that, can you?
- Nucker101

The argument is about this regime's incompetence at everything, drafting included

You've been steering the conversation away the whole time... you say what it's about, but forget why posts were made in the first place. You picked up where Lefty and I left off and quoted me at times while off shooting replies. If you want to stick to the topic you hijacked, then it as about the teardown that Lefty says should have happened in 2014. By the time you posted 2 or 3 times, we were back to the old beefs over Sbisa etc... this stuff's due date has run out almost anyways. We are still drafting high or picked good prospects even with those end of the world contracts that have expired or soon to be gone...

No, it's not conditioning alone with JV. I agree. But you don't spend much time here and you've already done what you do so much of and paint my opinions for me. I am criticizing you for writing JV off already but I've been very honest with how it's playing out and if you were here more often, would have read me reminding people female doging about you that you were bang on with wanting Ehlers instead. I was happy with how JV looked late last season... there has been a set back obviouslya and there are red flags that we all talk about in here. I can't think of anyone who thinks there are no red flags. It's not like that... Set backs happen and no one should just give up over his struggles in the AHL after blowing his camp and getting demoted. I will put money down that he will not be a fat ass in camp next season and will have a new attitude. If I'm wrong, then I will have serious doubts and will say you are right to give up on rookies who struggle by the time they are 20. He can't be a (frank) face two summers in a row and expect to have an NHL career, that's for sure. I'm just not writing him off like you. I refuse to be criticized for that. That's totally backwards.

Guddy has time to get better defensively and he needs to do that to solidify his game.
TIME... again we come back to that...something you don't seem to be willing to give.

I'm sorry someone called you a whiner. It wasn't me. I argue with your opinions and get edgy when you start doing that bad habit where I'm expected to defend opinions I haven't expressed. Same old booner... that hasnt changed. I do tell you guys to be patient though... or say you are impatient, but that is not name calling.... not that I'm above that. Conversations like ours should be able to continue without us name calling... don't get butt hurt from sarcasm and edginess... you do your misquoting and stat spinning, I do my thing and toy with you a little in the discussion. I hate when one person plays the victim in this mutal game. Just hate it...

That poop gets tiresome man. Apparently singing Kumbaya and only female doging about other people female doging is the only thing that flies around here these days.

Easy now. You can't have it both ways. I'm still discussing the topic with you. Forget the one sentence shots people are firing at you. Those are not even inviting discussion. They burn themselves on an oportunity to encourage patience.




I don't miss the Nonis/Gillis days on here looking back. If I wanst sitting in a cabin trying to sober up and find a way to be distracted, I would have never put up with the poop in here. No mods enforcing anything, guys like Bloated and Bieksa03 litterally follwing me around taunting me both in thread and private mail... on any kind of discussion about the GM even if I attempted to just join the conversation, would turn chaotic. They were quite a few like that. Chompsey was another. You really think you are getting it bad around here... I'm sorry but I'm going to have to make a meme over that

Lol
Just the other day I was thinking how nice it was not to be inundated with trolls from other teams. Then today happened.
- dbot

ya I noticed it too.
Makita did a good job of putting an end to that.

Yeah, but the idea that Gudbranson needs to be paired with a good puck mover makes sense to me.

My other theory on why that pairing was doomed from the beginning was that Hutton apparently added another 5+ pounds of weight over the off-season and obviously was going to have to adjust to it, and Gudbranson was going to have to adjust to a whole new organization.
- Nucker101

Luckily we will sign him to 8 seasons and have time to find him one.

Hutton lost that 5 pounds as soon as he cut his hair so it's moot.

Not really, just that hits as a stat are overvalued by some posters around here.
- Nucker101

Honestly, I think everyone avoids his stats.


His coaches and team mates in Florida really didn't want to see him go it sounds like. It's not hard to think that there is more there than just stats with this guy. I saw two of his playoff games last season and he was seriously fired up and always on the ice. I think he's a pretty passionate player as well. Can character like his help a young team especially when he is a vet thats in his 20's for 6 more years? I'm intrigued by this. If we are in the playoffs in 2 or 3 seasons, I think he'll be a beast and still only 26 or 27.

I never felt Bieksa was that give it all great character guy... but everyone played that up about him regardless of him beating up team mates in public, going off on his never ending Rodney Dangerfield routine to the media that came back on us in more than one playoff season... or his clique with Kesler in the dressing room, or him firing shots at players who were just traded when you are a selfish clique guy... or just ignore his responsibilities because so and so tapped him in the shins and he's going to chase him down all night.... but be just standing there shooting off his mouth when Danny or Hank would get murdered with a dirty hit or a knocked out with an elbow even... Guddy is not selfish. I honor that and will give him credit for it. Bieksa, not a chance.

double post.

Triple Post?

That would require talent from within to the top 2 lines.
Thats not the Sedins problem they r on record saying they welcome it.
- Nighthawk

I don't agree at all with this.

When Gillis got here he swore he was going to change the look of the team in his first interview with his puffy eyes and white golf shirt. He said they would do things differently and be bigger and tougher and faster.

He had no intention of re-signing the twins because there was a huge pool of potential free agents. By the time July first came around almost everyone had resigned deals with their current clubs and Gillis had to back track and hop on a plane and do a last minute deal with the twins for 6 mil x 6 years. It was done out of desperation not done out of want.

Burkie also flew over to Sweden to sign them and it is really too bad that he didn't.
We knew back then we were a soft team and needed a new image . If we did lose them that year we could of had potentially Seguin or Hall and the following year Landeskog Huberdeau or Hamilton. See Lefty I can play the hindsight game too.

We did manage to have 2 years where we were a top team but we built it all around two players . Three if you count Luongo ( I don't ).

When the Twins were up for a new contract I wrote the blog one day for Esplen saying do not resign the twins for more than two years if you feel it is necessary to re-sign them at all. I said if they did a four year deal they would be slow in their final two years and impossible to move seeing there are two and they come as a package.

Lefty was all over this saying well they are 100 point players and even if they drop 40 % they are still 60 point players which is still good. They are 40 point players and that is horrible for 7 mil.

Now he wants the tear down. Too late. I don't like when people say I told you so but I funken told you so.

He and Nucker forget Benning walked into this mess with 9 of 23 contract that had a NMC or NTC.

He forgets that Gillis traded 40 goal first round pick for Ballard, and second round picks for Art Keith Carney and Derek Roy.

Benning had to come in here clean up Gillis's mess , keep the team competitive , keep the team happy and change everything about it.

Gillis gets credit for of course Bo but what about Shink Jensen Schroeder and trading Grabner who played on the fastedt line in hockey at the time.

Benning is now paying the bills for the charges that Mike Gillis left.This team for over a decade has been built around the Sedins an even though most on here have been happy about that I never was.

For a team that struggles to put up points, we have five players who earn one third of our salary cap with the leagues worst points per dollar ratio.

Out of 700 NHL plyers Burrows the twins Hansen and Eriksson are all over 400 worst productivity per dollar,

Only when I feel like it
- Nucker101

Switching teams , that's a shocker .

Is this another argument of yours on how culture change is all about stats?

- boonerbuck

He's a book reader, he never played competitively

I don't agree at all with this.

When Gillis got here he swore he was going to change the look of the team in his first interview with his puffy eyes and white golf shirt. He said they would do things differently and be bigger and tougher and faster.

He had no intention of re-signing the twins because there was a huge pool of potential free agents. By the time July first came around almost everyone had resigned deals with their current clubs and Gillis had to back track and hop on a plane and do a last minute deal with the twins for 6 mil x 6 years. It was done out of desperation not done out of want.

Burkie also flew over to Sweden to sign them and it is really too bad that he didn't.
We knew back then we were a soft team and needed a new image . If we did lose them that year we could of had potentially Seguin or Hall and the following year Landeskog Huberdeau or Hamilton. See Lefty I can play the hindsight game too.

We did manage to have 2 years where we were a top team but we built it all around two players . Three if you count Luongo ( I don't ).

When the Twins were up for a new contract I wrote the blog one day for Esplen saying do not resign the twins for more than two years if you feel it is necessary to re-sign them at all. I said if they did a four year deal they would be slow in their final two years and impossible to move seeing there are two and they come as a package.

Lefty was all over this saying well they are 100 point players and even if they drop 40 % they are still 60 point players which is still good. They are 40 point players and that is horrible for 7 mil.

Now he wants the tear down. Too late. I don't like when people say I told you so but I funken told you so.

He and Nucker forget Benning walked into this mess with 9 of 23 contract that had a NMC or NTC.

He forgets that Gillis traded 40 goal first round pick for Ballard, and second round picks for Art Keith Carney and Derek Roy.

Benning had to come in here clean up Gillis's mess , keep the team competitive , keep the team happy and change everything about it.

Gillis gets credit for of course Bo but what about Shink Jensen Schroeder and trading Grabner who played on the fastedt line in hockey at the time.

Benning is now paying the bills for the charges that Mike Gillis left.This team for over a decade has been built around the Sedins an even though most on here have been happy about that I never was.

For a team that struggles to put up points, we have five players who earn one third of our salary cap with the leagues worst points per dollar ratio.

Out of 700 NHL plyers Burrows the twins Hansen and Eriksson are all over 400 worst productivity per dollar,
- VANTEL

Good post Vantel. You are not jerking people around with this story at all.

I'm not going to claim I was against signing the Sedins. I was scared to think about life without them short term after watching Gillis destroy the Future. I was the one who nick named him "The Generation Killer". I think for me it was more "pay the toll on the other end" while in the wonder lust of being an elite team was all around me. What were we to do?

If Gillis didn't re-sign them and signed UFA's instead, it's probably the same thing today. Old free agents under contract still but maybe a year or two younger... and possibly signed for longer even.



Edit: Welcome to the the big post club. Nice novel

Good post Vantel. You are not jerking people around with this story at all.

I'm not going to claim I was against signing the Sedins. I was scared to think about life without them short term after watching Gillis destroy the Future. I was the one who nick named him "The Generation Killer". I think for me it was more "pay the toll on the other end" while in the wonder lust of being an elite team was all around me. What were we to do?

If Gillis didn't re-sign them and signed UFA's instead, it's probably the same thing today. Old free agents under contract still but maybe a year or two younger... and possibly signed for longer even.



Edit: Welcome to the the big post club. Nice novel
- boonerbuck

I agree about the signing UFAs we would be no better off as we are seeing with Eriksson . Vrbata did have impact the first year and I think Miller has been woth the contract.

Canucks have a loyalty to the twins Edler Burrows, almost to a fault.

If the Canucks did sign two different free agents for the same term four years ago and we were in the same state , then there would be no reason not to try to trade them , and we would be looking at trading one at a time ,seperate deals . Not a package deal.

He'd probably look a lot better if he had Brian Campbell as his partner again. To play in the top 4, he needs someone who can anchor the pairing. Hutton wasn't ready for it and so they struggled. Hutton actually looks a lot better without him though.
- Nucker101

It is not Gudbrandson's fault that Canucks don't have a Brian Campbell. He proved that he can be very effective if he has the proper partner. It is up to Canucks to find him one. Same as Eriksson is a garbage goal collector. He cleans up after scrums in front of the net, Unfortunately Canucks play a perimeter game.

I've missed you

- The argument is about this regime's incompetence at everything, drafting included

- By all accounts JV is in pretty decent shape now, yet he's still struggling in the AHL. Again, there's very few examples in the entire history of the NHL of a prospect going on to have a prominent career after putting up the numbers he has in the AHL so far. His issues aren't just conditioning alone.

- What exactly is Gudbranson going to suddenly improve at? He's physically mature, has played a ton of games so mentally he's pretty much gone through it all in the NHL. I don't see him getting suddenly getting way bigger/faster and he's not suddenly going to develop offensive skill.

- Everytime someone speaks out against this regime, we get hit with the same old "be patient", "he's a professional" or "why don't you be the GM then?" And then even if a poster ends up being right about something we get called a "whiner" or told "hindsight is 20/20"

That poop gets tiresome man. Apparently singing Kumbaya and only female doging about other people female doging is the only thing that flies around here these days.

- I liked the Nonis/Gillis days here, both the supporters/detractors had the types of discussions we're having now, and yes it was repetitive back then too. Tons of the same debates over Raymond, Kesler's linemates and playmking ability. If Bieksa should stay or go, if AV was a good coach or not, etc. But the difference was that we didn't have a bunch of people crying about it.

You can't disagree with that, can you?
- Nucker101

That's putting it mildly.

I agree about the signing UFAs we would be no better off as we are seeing with Eriksson . Vrbata did have impact the first year and I think Miller has been woth the contract.

Canucks have a loyalty to the twins Edler Burrows, almost to a fault.

If the Canucks did sign two different free agents for the same term four years ago and we were in the same state , then there would be no reason not to try to trade them , and we would be looking at trading one at a time ,seperate deals . Not a package deal.
- VANTEL

I think Benning and FA would welcome trading them now. I don't think they would hold onto them if they had a choice anymore. The package deal and NMC are a wall.

The devil returned to collect his dept now...

I think Benning and FA would welcome trading them now. I don't think they would hold onto them if they had a choice anymore. The package deal and NMC are a wall.

The devil returned to collect his dept now...


- boonerbuck

So true

Hindsight and Phucker's hate for 10 pages.

I don't agree at all with this.

When Gillis got here he swore he was going to change the look of the team in his first interview with his puffy eyes and white golf shirt. He said they would do things differently and be bigger and tougher and faster.

He had no intention of re-signing the twins because there was a huge pool of potential free agents. By the time July first came around almost everyone had resigned deals with their current clubs and Gillis had to back track and hop on a plane and do a last minute deal with the twins for 6 mil x 6 years. It was done out of desperation not done out of want.

Burkie also flew over to Sweden to sign them and it is really too bad that he didn't.
We knew back then we were a soft team and needed a new image . If we did lose them that year we could of had potentially Seguin or Hall and the following year Landeskog Huberdeau or Hamilton. See Lefty I can play the hindsight game too.

We did manage to have 2 years where we were a top team but we built it all around two players . Three if you count Luongo ( I don't ).

When the Twins were up for a new contract I wrote the blog one day for Esplen saying do not resign the twins for more than two years if you feel it is necessary to re-sign them at all. I said if they did a four year deal they would be slow in their final two years and impossible to move seeing there are two and they come as a package.

Lefty was all over this saying well they are 100 point players and even if they drop 40 % they are still 60 point players which is still good. They are 40 point players and that is horrible for 7 mil.

Now he wants the tear down. Too late. I don't like when people say I told you so but I funken told you so.

He and Nucker forget Benning walked into this mess with 9 of 23 contract that had a NMC or NTC.

He forgets that Gillis traded 40 goal first round pick for Ballard, and second round picks for Art Keith Carney and Derek Roy.

Benning had to come in here clean up Gillis's mess , keep the team competitive , keep the team happy and change everything about it.

Gillis gets credit for of course Bo but what about Shink Jensen Schroeder and trading Grabner who played on the fastedt line in hockey at the time.

Benning is now paying the bills for the charges that Mike Gillis left.This team for over a decade has been built around the Sedins an even though most on here have been happy about that I never was.

For a team that struggles to put up points, we have five players who earn one third of our salary cap with the leagues worst points per dollar ratio.

Out of 700 NHL plyers Burrows the twins Hansen and Eriksson are all over 400 worst productivity per dollar,
- VANTEL

Playoffs

Hindsight and Phucker's hate for 10 pages.
- Marwood

I enjoyed it. It's old it's new.

It's been getting stale around here... roster decisions roster decisions roster decisions... it was nice to revisit some of the debates from JB's first summer. Both sides of the arguement bared fruit a couple years later as we can see.

Mornin boys....coffee is good this morning, raring to go


Oh...and Booner, you need to go back and re-read my post, I never ever said you're "out to lunch" I said you're "out of touch". Skimming is understandable though, lots of fluff in the posts, mine included.

I enjoyed it. It's old it's new.

It's been getting stale around here... roster decisions roster decisions roster decisions... it was nice to revisit some of the debates from JB's first summer. Both sides of the arguement bared fruit a couple years later as we can see.
- boonerbuck

Sometimes I like to stir up the passion a bit, it can get a little vanilla in here at times.