My gut feeling is that Butcher will not sign with the Avs. Sounds like there may be some residual effects of last year Patty telling him they weren't interested in signing him and this is his way of telling the Avs to go shove it.

My gut feeling is that Butcher will not sign with the Avs. Sounds like there may be some residual effects of last year Patty telling him they weren't interested in signing him and this is his way of telling the Avs to go shove it.
- Avsrchamps01

I understand where he is coming from but he is sort of wanting it both ways.

If Avs were interested to sign him early when Roy was around... he wouldnt of been at the U of D this year and become such a notable name. He would have been just another dude in the AHL.

So him not getting an ELC last summer was the best thing for him since he got the Baker, the National Championship, his name is out there now.

If he is mad that Avs didn't believe in him early well he wouldnt be where he is now. Im really indifferent to him signing or not. He would be great to have in the Rampage but I don't think hes a make or break D core prospect

Lame attempt from a sad sad man, be a better troll if this is going to be your schtick on the internet.
- DDM-Coga

If anyone was going to Butcher me....I'm glad it was you

Get rid of these duds if at all possible...Colborne, Comeau, Grigorenko, Beauchemin, Wiercioch. Trade Barrie for a solid reliable young Dman. Trade Soderberg just to have his contract off the books.

Possible line combos for next year:

Landeskog Mackinnon Rantanen
Patrick/Hishier Jost Duchene
Andrighetto Compher Nieto
UFA *Soderberg UFA

Johnson Zadorov
Bigras Barberio
*Barrie UFA

Varly
Picks

I understand where he is coming from but he is sort of wanting it both ways.

If Avs were interested to sign him early when Roy was around... he wouldnt of been at the U of D this year and become such a notable name. He would have been just another dude in the AHL.

So him not getting an ELC last summer was the best thing for him since he got the Baker, the National Championship, his name is out there now.

If he is mad that Avs didn't believe in him early well he wouldnt be where he is now. Im really indifferent to him signing or not. He would be great to have in the Rampage but I don't think hes a make or break D core prospect
- DDM-Coga

He could very well be a bust at the big boy level, that's a definite possibility. I fear the Avs are going to develop a reputation that no one wants to come here because of how this season went. Winning will cure that though.

He could very well be a bust at the big boy level, that's a definite possibility. I fear the Avs are going to develop a reputation that no one wants to come here because of how this season went. Winning will cure that though.
- Avsrchamps01

I don't see that happening long term. NCAA guys like Jost, Greer, and Compher signed no worries. Avs have signed basically everyone of their prospects since the 2013 draft.

Coyotes would have this issue if that was the case, Oilers would have had it for a decade before McDavid. I don't this is a major issue

Good lord man, triggered much? It's not that serious. And, not for nothing, you're reaching hard.

1. He projects somewhere between a bottom pairing powerplay specialist and a fringe NHL/AHL dman. At best, he's Torey Krug light (this is absolute best case scenario). At worst, he's Matt Gilroy. He likely falls somewhere in between.

2. What about that quote was "cherry picked"? You're acting as if it's some complex, smoke and mirrors statement that can be perceived several different ways. Pretty cut and dry what he said: he wants to go to UFA.

Signed,

Another Flyers fan.
- mochoson

Just wanted to give you an update to follow up on why I said it was cherry picking...Look at the follow up from BSN today

WILL BUTCHER UPDATE

Avalanche general manager Joe Sakic met for coffee Tuesday with University of Denver defenseman Will Butcher and a “family adviser”, and while no contract was signed by the Hobey Baker winner with the Avalanche, the two are expected to talk again next week.

The Avs expected Butcher to take his time on thinking it over, so there is no animus just because he didn’t sign right away. The Avs called the meeting “very positive” overall.

So who knows what happens with him, but I don't think it was a cut and dry he is going to UFA automatically route. I think he really wants to figure out his place in the org first

Good to hear, I hope he signs with us

Just wanted to give you an update to follow up on why I said it was cherry picking...Look at the follow up from BSN today

WILL BUTCHER UPDATE

Avalanche general manager Joe Sakic met for coffee Tuesday with University of Denver defenseman Will Butcher and a “family adviser”, and while no contract was signed by the Hobey Baker winner with the Avalanche, the two are expected to talk again next week.

The Avs expected Butcher to take his time on thinking it over, so there is no animus just because he didn’t sign right away. The Avs called the meeting “very positive” overall.

So who knows what happens with him, but I don't think it was a cut and dry he is going to UFA automatically route. I think he really wants to figure out his place in the org first
- DDM-Coga

It's like Mike chambers doesn't have a clue. But one of him or AD is wrong so see who wins in the battle of the butcher signing story!... damn i don't want either to win

I agree with ypur first point. Not the second. Talk to avs then talking to his family by no means, means he doesn't want to sign with the avs.
- skywalker1987

Umm, it kinda does. I mean, sure, TECHNICALLY he could eventually still sign with the Avs. But failing to admit that it's looking highly unlikely is literal ignorance. Think about it. He was drafted 4 years ago. He's had 4 years to think about playing for the Avalanche. He would be signed already if it were up to Sakic. He wants to go to UFA and talk to other teams. Theres no reason for him to loop back around to the Avs and find their offer mind blowingly better than any of the others he's bound to here.

He just won the Hobey Baker and a National Championship. He's going to be highly, highly sought after by teams way better than the Avs. It's much more likely he signs with a contending team, or at least a team that's pretty close to contending. He's going to get the same offer from every team. It's about fit for him. He's had plenty of time to consider the Avs a fit. He's already thinking elsewhere.

And if he says no to avs then he'll be traded. If he says no to that team then he has black balled 2 nhl teams... and he has no leverage, missed out on a money now and missed an opportunity with 2 nhl teams. I think he will sign a loaded contract with the avs, ahl one year min.

This is silly and lacks precedent. He's not trade-able now that every other team knows he wants to explore free agency. He wants to be able to choose for himself where he signs. Why would a team give up an asset just to be told the same thing the Avs were told? He wouldn't be "black-balling" anyone. He doesn't owe the Avs or anyone else in pro-hockey anything. He's accomplished a great deal on his own and has earned the right to continue his hockey career somewhere he finds comfortable.

He has ALL of the leverage. Every free agent has leverage, especially those who are highly sought and utilize this fact when negotiating to get the best deal possible. He'll sign a loaded deal, no doubt. But it's highly unlikely he signs with the Avs, unfortunately.

He's much more likely to sign with a team like Pittsburgh, Chicago, Washington or a team close to contending like Carolina or Buffalo. Avs are highly likely to be at the bottom of his list.

It's like Mike chambers doesn't have a clue. But one of him or AD is wrong so see who wins in the battle of the butcher signing story!... damn i don't want either to win
- skywalker1987

Chambes is a very lazy writer, he just likes his own narrative.
He has been wrong almost at every part of his career as the Avs beat writer taking over for Dater.

Could Butcher say no to the Avs....sure, but for him to phrase as its nope done deal hes not interested at all is just bull poop. Especially how the Avs have talked to him since then and have other meetings schedule.

Chambers just likes Chambers storylines and thats the Avs do not like the NCAA system...which he was fully covering for years and is his first love

Umm, it kinda does. I mean, sure, TECHNICALLY he could eventually still sign with the Avs. But failing to admit that it's looking highly unlikely is literal ignorance. Think about it. He was drafted 4 years ago. He's had 4 years to think about playing for the Avalanche. He would be signed already if it were up to Sakic. He wants to go to UFA and talk to other teams. Theres no reason for him to loop back around to the Avs and find their offer mind blowingly better than any of the others he's bound to here.

He just won the Hobey Baker and a National Championship. He's going to be highly, highly sought after by teams way better than the Avs. It's much more likely he signs with a contending team, or at least a team that's pretty close to contending. He's going to get the same offer from every team. It's about fit for him. He's had plenty of time to consider the Avs a fit. He's already thinking elsewhere.



This is silly and lacks precedent. He's not trade-able now that every other team knows he wants to explore free agency. He wants to be able to choose for himself where he signs. Why would a team give up an asset just to be told the same thing the Avs were told? He wouldn't be "black-balling" anyone. He doesn't owe the Avs or anyone else in pro-hockey anything. He's accomplished a great deal on his own and has earned the right to continue his hockey career somewhere he finds comfortable.

He has ALL of the leverage. Every free agent has leverage, especially those who are highly sought and utilize this fact when negotiating to get the best deal possible. He'll sign a loaded deal, no doubt. But it's highly unlikely he signs with the Avs, unfortunately.

He's much more likely to sign with a team like Pittsburgh, Chicago, Washington or a team close to contending like Carolina or Buffalo. Avs are highly likely to be at the bottom of his list.
- mochoson

If he believes he is an NHL talent ready to make the jump this year, sure why wouldnt he. But Scouts would probably say the same thing as Avs fans are saying who has watched him this year with all the U of D coverage...hes still a prospect that needs time. Hi

The kid had a great year, and has some talent, but he is still a long way out. At Development Camps he still looked lost against guys like Rantanen and Zadorov, etc etc when he was attending to the Avs.

Would be nice to have a prospect like him in the system, but hes still a prospect that needs a solid year in the AHL first, its skillset and game might not transition well to the Pro game. Hes an offensive Dman who doesnt have the natural silky smooth offensive talent you want to see from a guy of his side. hes a smart player though

Just wanted to give you an update to follow up on why I said it was cherry picking...Look at the follow up from BSN today

WILL BUTCHER UPDATE

Avalanche general manager Joe Sakic met for coffee Tuesday with University of Denver defenseman Will Butcher and a “family adviser”, and while no contract was signed by the Hobey Baker winner with the Avalanche, the two are expected to talk again next week.

The Avs expected Butcher to take his time on thinking it over, so there is no animus just because he didn’t sign right away. The Avs called the meeting “very positive” overall.

So who knows what happens with him, but I don't think it was a cut and dry he is going to UFA automatically route. I think he really wants to figure out his place in the org first
- DDM-Coga

This isn't a follow-up? This is referring to the same meeting and simply offering a more optimistic perspective of its outcome. It's literally the same general information just packaged differently.

The meeting being referred to next week would be when Butcher is likely to tell the Avs he'd like to be a free agent or have the right to talk to other teams so the Avs can receive an asset in a trade for his rights. It makes the most sense for Butcher and his future. He will be sought after by contending teams that will likely offer him a legitimate shot at winning an NHL job next year.

That means not only is he making an NHL salary, but he is in the best possible situation to succeed individually. This, again, favors him monetarily. If he's playing well on a talented team, he's in the best possible position to hit certain bonuses, not to mention, quickly establishing himself as a talented player and building a foundation towards his next deal, which would likely be more guaranteed money should he turn out to be a decent player.

I'm sorry. I really am. This situation is not at all in the Avs favor at present. If it's any consolation, I think the Avs will still be much better next year.

This isn't a follow-up? This is referring to the same meeting and simply offering a more optimistic perspective of its outcome. It's literally the same general information just packaged differently.

The meeting being referred to next week would be when Butcher is likely to tell the Avs he'd like to be a free agent or have the right to talk to other teams so the Avs can receive an asset in a trade for his rights. It makes the most sense for Butcher and his future. He will be sought after by contending teams that will likely offer him a legitimate shot at winning an NHL job next year.

That means not only is he making an NHL salary, but he is in the best possible situation to succeed individually. This, again, favors him monetarily. If he's playing well on a talented team, he's in the best possible position to hit certain bonuses, not to mention, quickly establishing himself as a talented player and building a foundation towards his next deal, which would likely be more guaranteed money should he turn out to be a decent player.

I'm sorry. I really am. This situation is not at all in the Avs favor at present. If it's any consolation, I think the Avs will still be much better next year.
- mochoson

It is a follow up. The Denver Post is saying Butcher will never sign there and the BSN guys who followed up are saying the 2 are still talking. Its referring to a different meeting. Sakic and Butcher have spoken before the Finals, after the finals, and will be speaking again. Sorry but Av fans do not take anything that Denver Post as fully reliable. They have been skewing storylines for a long time now and have constantly been proven incorrect.

I dont really care about Butcher. He is no Vesey who we all knew about for years coming into that offseason. Butcher if wasn't the captain of the Pios, no one would even knew he existed. He had a nice little perfect storm there, not even considered one of the Top 3 or 4 best players on the best team in the country to win the Hobey Baker. Happy for the guy but Im not going to pretend his some stud now bc over night winning the award vs running up.

If he believes he is an NHL talent ready to make the jump this year, sure why wouldnt he. But Scouts would probably say the same thing as Avs fans are saying who has watched him this year with all the U of D coverage...hes still a prospect that needs time. Hi

The kid had a great year, and has some talent, but he is still a long way out. At Development Camps he still looked lost against guys like Rantanen and Zadorov, etc etc when he was attending to the Avs.

Would be nice to have a prospect like him in the system, but hes still a prospect that needs a solid year in the AHL first, its skillset and game might not transition well to the Pro game. Hes an offensive Dman who doesnt have the natural silky smooth offensive talent you want to see from a guy of his side. hes a smart player though
- DDM-Coga

I totally agree with all of that, although I wouldn't rule out him playing in the NHL next year. None of that changes the fact that hes very likely considering the idea of going to free agency now. He knows he's going to get many offers if he does, and some will be with contenders. Hell, he may already know where he wants to sign.

Again, he's had 4 years to think really hard about playing in Denver. There isn't a team he could use him more than the Avs, but it's just not looking good right now. Who knows, maybe he signs next week and he makes me look like a moron. Maybe he is just a super humble kid and wanted to enjoy some time off first.

I totally agree with all of that, although I wouldn't rule out him playing in the NHL next year. None of that changes the fact that hes very likely considering the idea of going to free agency now. He knows he's going to get many offers if he does, and some will be with contenders. Hell, he may already know where he wants to sign.

Again, he's had 4 years to think really hard about playing in Denver. There isn't a team he could use him more than the Avs, but it's just not looking good right now. Who knows, maybe he signs next week and he makes me look like a moron. Maybe he is just a super humble kid and wanted to enjoy some time off first.
- mochoson

http://www.denverpost.com...aftee-first-nhl-contract/

Just an example of how much of a Tard Chambers is when covering Will Butcher. 2 weeks ago he puts this out.

So there’s a good chance the Avalanche asks Butcher to sign his ELC with the team, but also a decent chance that Butcher declines to become a free agent.

The more likely scenario is that Butcher takes his time in turning pro. His adviser is handling everything about his next move and Butcher doesn’t want anything to disrupt his focus on winning the national championship.

Nothing has really changed in those 2 weeks...its the same process Butcher and the Avs have apparently talked about but he just puts out an article that basically conducts himself with his current article...Butcher might not ever sign there!
Nothing has changed Chambers, its the same process...chill out man

The start of the season he had multiple articles about how the Avs won't sign Butcher, don't even want him. The guy is really a nut job when it comes to covering this kid

It is a follow up. The Denver Post is saying Butcher will never sign there and the BSN guys who followed up are saying the 2 are still talking. Its referring to a different meeting. Sakic and Butcher have spoken before the Finals, after the finals, and will be speaking again. Sorry but Av fans do not take anything that Denver Post as fully reliable. They have been skewing storylines for a long time now and have constantly been proven incorrect.

I dont really care about Butcher. He is no Vesey who we all knew about for years coming into that offseason. Butcher if wasn't the captain of the Pios, no one would even knew he existed. He had a nice little perfect storm there, not even considered one of the Top 3 or 4 best players on the best team in the country to win the Hobey Baker. Happy for the guy but Im not going to pretend his some stud now bc over night winning the award vs running up.
- DDM-Coga

I suggest you look at the Post article again. The meeting they had and the article from the post both happened yesterday. I understand theyve met multiple times. This is irrelevant to any bias you believe the Post has (I'm impartial, and wouldn't know any better on that matter).

This meeting is the same "after the finals" meeting. The meeting next week essentially determines his fate as an Av. He will either sign or tell Sakic he's going FA. This most recent meeting was basically him just politely asking for some time and space to enjoy his success, which is more than fair.

http://www.denverpost.com...aftee-first-nhl-contract/

Just an example of how much of a Tard Chambers is when covering Will Butcher. 2 weeks ago he puts this out.

So there’s a good chance the Avalanche asks Butcher to sign his ELC with the team, but also a decent chance that Butcher declines to become a free agent.

The more likely scenario is that Butcher takes his time in turning pro. His adviser is handling everything about his next move and Butcher doesn’t want anything to disrupt his focus on winning the national championship.

Nothing has really changed in those 2 weeks...its the same process Butcher and the Avs have apparently talked about but he just puts out an article that basically conducts himself.

The start of the season he had multiple articles about how the Avs won't sign Butcher, don't even want him. The guy is really a nut job when it comes to covering this kid
- DDM-Coga

Sounds more like he's just a typical journalist who's abusing the situation for content ad naseum. Doesn't surprise me.

Sounds more like he's just a typical journalist who's abusing the situation for content ad naseum. Doesn't surprise me.
- mochoson

thats basically him in a nut shell, he is essentially over sensationalized ever little part of this kid bc its his interest. This is the same guy who threw a hissy fit online that the Avs wouldnt leak story to the DP anymore and were doing their own press releases. Talking about how thats an insult to them.

Butcher should take his time...why wouldnt he. Hes not a dumb kid. So I am not shocked by him saying that. It makes sense. But for the DP to spin it like well thats it, hes gone, hes a UFA is a bit premature since its the exact same thing they were talking about 2 weeks ago. Could he go UFA...sure there is always a chance and probably a decent one, whowever i don't think its a guarantee as they make it out to be, I wouldnt say it is yet.

Umm, it kinda does. I mean, sure, TECHNICALLY he could eventually still sign with the Avs. But failing to admit that it's looking highly unlikely is literal ignorance. Think about it. He was drafted 4 years ago. He's had 4 years to think about playing for the Avalanche. He would be signed already if it were up to Sakic. He wants to go to UFA and talk to other teams. Theres no reason for him to loop back around to the Avs and find their offer mind blowingly better than any of the others he's bound to here.

He just won the Hobey Baker and a National Championship. He's going to be highly, highly sought after by teams way better than the Avs. It's much more likely he signs with a contending team, or at least a team that's pretty close to contending. He's going to get the same offer from every team. It's about fit for him. He's had plenty of time to consider the Avs a fit. He's already thinking elsewhere.



This is silly and lacks precedent. He's not trade-able now that every other team knows he wants to explore free agency. He wants to be able to choose for himself where he signs. Why would a team give up an asset just to be told the same thing the Avs were told? He wouldn't be "black-balling" anyone. He doesn't owe the Avs or anyone else in pro-hockey anything. He's accomplished a great deal on his own and has earned the right to continue his hockey career somewhere he finds comfortable.

He has ALL of the leverage. Every free agent has leverage, especially those who are highly sought and utilize this fact when negotiating to get the best deal possible. He'll sign a loaded deal, no doubt. But it's highly unlikely he signs with the Avs, unfortunately.

He's much more likely to sign with a team like Pittsburgh, Chicago, Washington or a team close to contending like Carolina or Buffalo. Avs are highly likely to be at the bottom of his list.
- mochoson

i see your point man, i have nothing against him if he chooses not to sign here, thats his choice, and if he feels he is NHL ready then great, but as someone who has seen him play and followed him, i personally think he is not ready. He is very smart with the puck, and uses it to his advantage but everything else is average. I think its in his best interest to sign with us, develop, most likely get a shot i the nhl in the 2018 season and go from there. it wold be stupid of sakic too garentee him a spot on the avs until he earns it.

Youre right about him being a player teams will look at, but when aug 15 rolls around, why would a bunch of teams have a spot open for him? I dont see a contending team now or soon to be waiting for him, so thats why if he is not signed by the draft, a team who really wants him will trade for him. Buffalo did it for Jimmy vesey last year. and gave up a 3rd rd pick.

but we will see what happens. I still hope avs get him, more prospects the better. its not the news i hoped to hear. i was hoping for a, "hobby baker award winner signs with the Avalanche!" im hoping now for 1st OA goes to Colorado Avalanche

i see your point man, i have nothing against him if he chooses not to sign here, thats his choice, and if he feels he is NHL ready then great, but as someone who has seen him play and followed him, i personally think he is not ready. He is very smart with the puck, and uses it to his advantage but everything else is average. I think its in his best interest to sign with us, develop, most likely get a shot i the nhl in the 2018 season and go from there. it wold be stupid of sakic too garentee him a spot on the avs until he earns it.
- skywalker1987

All thats fine and good. None of that changes the fact that the Avs are nowhere close to competing. It has nothing to do with immediately starting in the NHL. He may or may not have that oppurtunity be it with the Avs or a contender like the Penguins. What matters is theres no comparing hearing that the Penguins or Blackhawks want you and knowing that the Avs want you. Who would you pick if the money is the same?

Youre right about him being a player teams will look at, but when aug 15 rolls around, why would a bunch of teams have a spot open for him? I dont see a contending team now or soon to be waiting for him, so thats why if he is not signed by the draft, a team who really wants him will trade for him. Buffalo did it for Jimmy vesey last year. and gave up a 3rd rd pick.

It has nothing to do with "spots" being open. When he plays in the NHL remains to be seen and is honestly irrelevant. What matters is he's probably going to have offers from more than half the league if he hits free agency, and there's no reason all 30 other teams wont at least inquire.

Buffalo trading for Vesey is an example that needs context. That happened because Buffalo had several 3rd round picks; they basically had nothing to lose. However, thats not to say they that can't happen again. A team with multiple mid round picks could offer a similar deal for him if decides to go UFA.

My point is that what this ultimately comes down to is Butcher has to really be sold the Avs are going to be a legitimate contender at some point to sign there knowing that, presently, they're not even close. To sign there and throw away the opportunity of hearing what would be at least 10-15+ identical offers would be silly, especially when some of those offers are contenders.

He has absolutely nothing to lose going to free agency. If he truly thinks the Avs are the best situation for him after hearing many others, he can still sign there. It's not like Sakic didn't just sell him hard on what he would mean to the organization. Every team loves having as many talented defensemen as possible, but the Avs need him desperately, and he knows that.

Tim Erixon did it, Mike Reilly did it, Jimmy Vesey did it. This is nothing new. Like I said, if the kid wasn't sold at some point over the last 4 years over the idea of playing for the Avs, he's probably going elsewhere. That's saying something considering he's been living in the area and knows it well. You'd think it'd be a slam dunk and make sense since he'd be comfortable there.

He's a goner IMO. We'll see.

All thats fine and good. None of that changes the fact that the Avs are nowhere close to competing. It has nothing to do with immediately starting in the NHL. He may or may not have that oppurtunity be it with the Avs or a contender like the Penguins. What matters is theres no comparing hearing that the Penguins or Blackhawks want you and knowing that the Avs want you. Who would you pick if the money is the same?



It has nothing to do with "spots" being open. When he plays in the NHL remains to be seen and is honestly irrelevant. What matters is he's probably going to have offers from more than half the league if he hits free agency, and there's no reason all 30 other teams wont at least inquire.

Buffalo trading for Vesey is an example that needs context. That happened because Buffalo had several 3rd round picks; they basically had nothing to lose. However, thats not to say they that can't happen again. A team with multiple mid round picks could offer a similar deal for him if decides to go UFA.

My point is that what this ultimately comes down to is Butcher has to really be sold the Avs are going to be a legitimate contender at some point to sign there knowing that, presently, they're not even close. To sign there and throw away the opportunity of hearing what would be at least 10-15+ identical offers would be silly, especially when some of those offers are contenders.

He has absolutely nothing to lose going to free agency. If he truly thinks the Avs are the best situation for him after hearing many others, he can still sign there. It's not like Sakic didn't just sell him hard on what he would mean to the organization. Every team loves having as many talented defensemen as possible, but the Avs need him desperately, and he knows that.

Tim Erixon did it, Mike Reilly did it, Jimmy Vesey did it. This is nothing new. Like I said, if the kid wasn't sold at some point over the last 4 years over the idea of playing for the Avs, he's probably going elsewhere. That's saying something considering he's been living in the area and knows it well. You'd think it'd be a slam dunk and make sense since he'd be comfortable there.

He's a goner IMO. We'll see.
- mochoson

I would love to hear what Sakic said about the organizations direction to butcher
Butif he turns into a 3rd rd pick I won't complain to much.

Thoughts on Sakic allegedly protecting Varlamov over Pickard?

Thoughts on Sakic allegedly protecting Varlamov over Pickard?
- willschulme

Smart move imo. Proven, going to be health. I don't think Vegas would take either of our goalies though too many good ones out there. Fleury, Chicago's, raanta, can sign bishop of they wanted....

Thoughts on Sakic allegedly protecting Varlamov over Pickard?
- willschulme

Goalies are a weird bunch, Varly is still the better goalie and if they didn't protect him I guaranteed that messes with his head. Pickard is the back up and not a good one last year. So there is no worries of him being picked by Vegas when there will be way better younger goalie starters and back up available.