TORONTO SUN: Steve Simmons reports that, by his count, the Vegas Golden Knights “will have to move at least four NHL defenceman, maybe five, between now and the start of their first season. That’s a lot of dealing to do and a not a lot of time for GM George McPhee.”

All you had to do is mention TvR as opposed to one of the Golden Knight cast offs and the discussion here will swing to the hawks acquiring TvR (WHO WILL want a REAL Fat deal next year) becuase they are acquiring his brother (who will ALSO want a REAL fat deal) from the leafs because they "need" the space to make a play for Tavares asa UFA or resign Mathhews and his two little brothers at 11 million each.

I just don't see another one year move to TvR as winning a Cup, CAP stability or as a long term solution.
- wiz1901

Not sure why Simmons thinks that, Vegas has nine Dmen, two of which are unsigned RFS's.

The Hawks would be insane to consider DiBrincat as a trade piece. The Hawks were lucky beyond comprehension that he fell to the Second Round because of his size. I watched him in the play-offs where opponents were trying to key on him. He borders on being unhittable. Additionally, he can find the open ice to receive passes and can pin-point pass while surrounded. He is built like a bulldog too and does not avoid the high traffic areas - in fact he searches them out. Many goals scored from close in. Appreciate what we have in DiBrincat and stop talking of including him in deals for 6th D-Men.
- Z3Hawk

Z3. Amen.

Not sure why Simmons thinks that, Vegas has nine Dmen, two of which are unsigned RFS's.
- walleyeb1

NHL.com shows them with 12.

NHL.com shows them with 12.
- Davewn

NHL.com is counting two players that are waiver exempt, so they can play in the minors and there's no rush to move as many as 4 d-men. Vegas thus has 9 non-waiver exempt guys, so they're probably looking to move at least 2, but it could be more if they want any of their waiver exempt guys to play in the NHL instead of AHL.

Bold are waiver exempt. Italicized are RFA.

Bischoff
Engelland
Garrison
Hunt
McNabb
Merrill
Miller
Reinhart
Sbisa
Schmidt
Stoner
Theodore

CapFriendly has 9 listed because that's how many they have under contract that were in the NHL last year. They're excluding Theofore and Schmidt from the count because they are not under contract currently and Bischoff is listed in the AHL because he was a college FA signing / not on a NHL roster last season.

Jesus, TVR back again......

Q does not need another excuse not to pair 2/7 again. Remember the elimination game against NSH? Pairing TVR with Keith??

Hard pass on that deal. A 5/6 guy at best - not top four material, no matter what Q thinks.

If Hossa goes on LTIR this year I don't think they need to do the dance to get cap compliant next year. I think if the player ends the season on LTIR they can stay there.
- Quicky72

I hope you are right about this but I'm not sure you are. JJ could you give us a clarification of this rule.

If Hossa goes on LTIR this year I don't think they need to do the dance to get cap compliant next year. I think if the player ends the season on LTIR they can stay there.
- Quicky72

I've been researching this a little bit since I saw your post and the best answer I'm finding is that the player "will be factored into the calculations of the year end salary cap of the team." This is a SJ Sharks blog: https://www.fearthefin.co...ckey-101-long-term-injury

What type of "fat" deal would you expect TvR to demand? I'm a fan of his but right now TvR is a member of the supporting cast and I don't think his demands will Ben that high. Keep in mind the Hawks have around $3.5 million coming off the books next season (Panarin's bonuses) and the only significant RFA is Hartman who will not be demanding an outrageous contract.
- DarthKane

My thinking is the one that seems to be prevelant to all the against and the players:
You think TvR takes $3.850,000 that C Murphy gets or 4 plus?
Or does he take 3 million "already proven flop" DelZotto gets as a UFA?

I don't think there is much loyalty towards winning teams and their Caps whether you love the city the teammates the fit, except when you have already made your BIG contract(s), not when you 25 and have not yet hit a BIG CONTRACT deal.

Hawks have room for that?

Unless the Cap rises at a super fast rate, they cannot pay anyone presently on the team at forward OR defense if more than a couple turn out to be higher end long time keepers, much less continue to pay the overpayment on Saad (granted it is not tied to as many Panarin bonuses) and Saad knows they are not gonna play soft ball in the next deal either...

...and the idea tied to brother James coming and RESIGNING on the cheap as so many think THERE is room to hapoen, seems like more of the same non-reality based progress.

But I can see how Vegas might eat part of the salary on one of their defenseman; if they don't teams will be able to select one of the waived guys, and McPhee knows this, StanBo know this, and maybe one of the unwanted 8 was the Hawk "get" in this contrived three team dance of the former hawks, not any return back to the band, by
That is really what my train of thinking was....

I've been researching this a little bit since I saw your post and the best answer I'm finding is that the player "will be factored into the calculations of the year end salary cap of the team." This is a SJ Sharks blog: https://www.fearthefin.co...ckey-101-long-term-injury
- matt_ahrens

The article you reference is from 2010. I'm pretty sure the LTIR rules have been modified somewhat since then.

The article you reference is from 2010. I'm pretty sure the LTIR rules have been modified somewhat since then.
- garacat

@ScottPowers 6/22/17 twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/bysco...status/878008315539734529
The way I've read and been explained long-term injured reserve the Blackhawks have three main options with Hossa.

1) They can trade Hossa to a team that could use his cap hit to get to the lower cap limit.

2) They can place him on the LTIR after the season begins. The key is getting close to the cap ceiling with him on the roster.

3) They place him on the LTIR just before the season begins & build an offseason roster that exceeds the cap ceiling by his cap hit or less.

@ScottPowers 6/22/17 twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/bysco...status/878008315539734529
The way I've read and been explained long-term injured reserve the Blackhawks have three main options with Hossa.

1) They can trade Hossa to a team that could use his cap hit to get to the lower cap limit.

2) They can place him on the LTIR after the season begins. The key is getting close to the cap ceiling with him on the roster.

3) They place him on the LTIR just before the season begins & build an offseason roster that exceeds the cap ceiling by his cap hit or less.
- Marlowe

#3 is how I understood CapFriendly (direct copy from CapGeek?) explains it for the offseason. So for the 'Hawks this upcoming season they can have just under $80.275M.

However (and this has been a question mark for me as well) that implies Hossa is one of the 23 on the roster. So as he is put on LTIR that makes it 22. Or can the 'Hawks have Hossa as the 24th, thus putting him on LTIR makes it 23....?

#3 is how I understood CapFriendly (direct copy from CapGeek?) explains it for the offseason. So for the 'Hawks this upcoming season they can have just under $80.275M.

However (and this has been a question mark for me as well) that implies Hossa is one of the 23 on the roster. So as he is put on LTIR that makes it 22. Or can the 'Hawks have Hossa as the 24th, thus putting him on LTIR makes it 23....?
- blackhawk24

Not sure how the roster numbers would work. Logic (sometimes not applicable so take it for what it is - speculative) suggests that the roster spot is taken at least until the player goes on LTIR status.

More in the discussion from Scott Powers:
Option 1 is easiest, but possibly not doable. No. 2 gives them in-season cap flexibility. No. 3 provides more offseason possibilities.

TVR = slow

The Hawks would be insane to consider DiBrincat as a trade piece. The Hawks were lucky beyond comprehension that he fell to the Second Round because of his size. I watched him in the play-offs where opponents were trying to key on him. He borders on being unhittable. Additionally, he can find the open ice to receive passes and can pin-point pass while surrounded. He is built like a bulldog too and does not avoid the high traffic areas - in fact he searches them out. Many goals scored from close in. Appreciate what we have in DiBrincat and stop talking of including him in deals for 6th D-Men.
- Z3Hawk

Insane? Ok....... The kid looked ok, nice one timer, the game I saw vs Winsdor as a 20 yr old in the Memorial Cup Finals vs kids up to a couple years younger. I'd suggest You Tubing the CHL Top Prospect game for a look see how he fared vs top competition. Not too much different than he showed at Hawk Prospect Camp last year. .... Context.

Like any other prospect time will tell but IMO unless the Hawks are married to the kid and he can be part of a package to bring back a Slavin they'd be nuts not to. All depends how they have him rated as I mentioned before.

LBR, and anyone else interested, I did some poking around about Hayden and what position he played at Yale. Sent a DM on Twitter to Chris Dilks who writes for SB Nation College Hockey. The guy is money for NCAA info and very good on prospects down to 15-16 yrs old.

Told me he's listed as a RW in all the boxes this year and I went all the way back to 13/14 his freshman year starting with this year: http://collegehockeystats.net/1617/schedules/yalm

He never played center at Yale from what I could see in the boxscores.

The article you reference is from 2010. I'm pretty sure the LTIR rules have been modified somewhat since then.
- garacat

could be. i'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to figure it out. I was even looking through the CBA but haven't found it yet.

Insane? Ok....... The kid looked ok, nice one timer, the game I saw vs Winsdor as a 20 yr old in the Memorial Cup Finals vs kids up to a couple years younger. I'd suggest You Tubing the CHL Top Prospect game for a look see how he fared vs top competition. Not too much different than he showed at Hawk Prospect Camp last year. .... Context.

Like any other prospect time will tell but IMO unless the Hawks are married to the kid and he can be part of a package to bring back a Slavin they'd be nuts not to. All depends how they have him rated as I mentioned before.
- Mr Ricochet

Few if any NHL teams will even think about trading a young defenseman like Slavin, let alone for an unproven kid like Debrincat.

But I'd give Debrincat every opportunity to succeed in a role, even if it is to just make their PP work. Nobody knows at this point whether he can play at the NHL level or not, but the track record says he's a point producer who can put the puck in the net kind of guy. That gets a lot of coaches and GM's very excited. Because they know all of the guys in the league who can't - like Rasmussen, Kruger, McLement, Zach Hyman etc. etc.

Jesus, TVR back again......

Q does not need another excuse not to pair 2/7 again. Remember the elimination game against NSH? Pairing TVR with Keith??

Hard pass on that deal. A 5/6 guy at best - not top four material, no matter what Q thinks.
- Return of the Roar

Agreed...

to TVR finding his way back to the Hawks roster. At best TVR is a borderline NHL talent...on a lousy club.

I give SB a very long leash, but that maneuver would piss me off.

LBR, and anyone else interested, I did some poking around about Hayden and what position he played at Yale. Sent a DM on Twitter to Chris Dilks who writes for SB Nation College Hockey. The guy is money for NCAA info and very good on prospects down to 15-16 yrs old.

Told me he's listed as a RW in all the boxes this year and I went all the way back to 13/14 his freshman year starting with this year: http://collegehockeystats.net/1617/schedules/yalm

He never played center at Yale from what I could see in the boxscores.
- Mr Ricochet

From what I've read and heard, Hayden entered Yale as a "Center", but was moved to the right side. The last 2 season's Hayden was at RW most of the time, and I assume that's where he'll play in the NHL.

7 years ago today, the Sharks signed Niklas Hjalmarsson to an offer sheet, forcing the #Blackhawks to choose Hjalmarsson or Antti Niemi.

could be. i'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to figure it out. I was even looking through the CBA but haven't found it yet.
- matt_ahrens

Agree. Just trying to figure it out myself. Would definitely be advantageous if the Hawks could just put Hossa on LTIR this year and he would automatically stay on LTIR each year going forward until his contract ends. Somebody out there must know how this works. Anyone?

While this may not be popular, I'd be OK with them signing iginla to a 1yr deal for 1mil or less

He wasn't bad when he got to LA. And I think he'd be good for 15-17g but also 100hits, net presence as well - but more importantly no need for rookies all over the ice again

Saad-Toews-Iggy - I think he'd fit well with these two
XXXX - AA - Kane - LW can be Jurco, Hartman, Fortin, etc.....audition away
Sharp-Schmaltz-Panik - this line can contribute offensively
Bouma-Dauphin-Wingels - Kero, Hartman, Jurco can all battle for this line

If Sharp, Iginla falter...then they can rotate guys up/down from Rockford. If they don't trade Hossa's cap hit then they can use the room for someone else while having good depth up front

I'd REALLY hope that Bowman has a deal in the works, or is at least strongly pursuing, a trade for a Vegas surplus defenseman. If there is a trade package to be made with Carolina for a legit NHL depth dman, sure thing. Unless Bowman found another Panarin in Rutta, TVR or a comparable player would be a big upgrade for the 3rd pair. Not saying I love TVR, but he is a reliable 3rd pair guy. If Rosival and Campbell are the 3rd pair at any point this year, then the "youth/speed" movement is a fallacy. I still think that spending over the cap is what Bowman will do if the NHL franks around with the Hawks and doesnt rule on Hossa's IR situation before the season starts. As I understand it, the Hawks can spend up to 10% over the cap and then LTIR Hossa when the season starts to be salary cap compliant.

Agree. Just trying to figure it out myself. Would definitely be advantageous if the Hawks could just put Hossa on LTIR this year and he would automatically stay on LTIR each year going forward until his contract ends. Somebody out there must know how this works. Anyone?
- garacat

totally agree

@ScottPowers 6/22/17 twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/bysco...status/878008315539734529
The way I've read and been explained long-term injured reserve the Blackhawks have three main options with Hossa.

1) They can trade Hossa to a team that could use his cap hit to get to the lower cap limit.

2) They can place him on the LTIR after the season begins. The key is getting close to the cap ceiling with him on the roster.

3) They place him on the LTIR just before the season begins & build an offseason roster that exceeds the cap ceiling by his cap hit or less.
- Marlowe

I don't get the difference between 2 and 3. Don't both add to $80.25?

Let's say Mario Hossa (Marian's younger and slightly faster brother...to work w JJ's Hawks offseason goals) were available today on the FA market and wanted $4m/year for a 4 year contract.

Option 2: Wait until day 2 of season, build roster close to cap, place Marian on LTIR, sign Mario and have about $1.25m of room for the 2017/18 season.

Option 3: Place Marian on LTIR today, sign Mario today, and have about $1.25m of room for 2017/18.

What am I missing? I think maybe what I'm missing is that in scenarion 3, Hawks go into day 1 of season at $79m ($75m roster plus Mario), they are locked in at that $79m, and that $1.25m of room isn't available during the season? Is that it?