Stan had to chose that day, and


- vabeachbear

Thanks bud. Means a lot to me

Totally disagree here. I don't remember the exact circumstances, but I believe Iginla was delivering payback for a dirty hit on a teammate. I saw too much sneering on opposing benches last year when that happened to one of our players and the opposition knew that they could do it willingly without consequences.
- 67hawks

Do what the Penguins do when their players get run, score on the powerplay. That's the consequences we need...an improved powerplay. Not some joker who can fight. If a guy can actually play (or still play) and be tough or whatever, that's fine.

I just made a post about John Hayden's hit totals so I don't want to be in a no check league, but what excites me about him isn't just the physical side, but the skill, can he put up 40-45 points? In a fourth line role, probably not....on line 3? Maybe so. That's what excites me.

If Iggy can't do it anymore pass...and he doesn't get an exception because he "can fight"....he should be brought into the Hawks ONLY if he can still play.

Not the biggest TVR fan myself, but neither of us are Q—who has guys he trusts (see: Rozsival, M and van Riemsdyk, T) who everyone else says "suck" and guys he doesn't trust (see: Daley, T.) who do pretty well elsewhere.

I am pretty sure if the tip I got was accurate—and the source is generally in the ballpark at least—then this would be a move to give Q some continuity, trust, comfort he needs on the blue line, not to appease the stats jockeys.
- John Jaeckel

The last thing the Hawks need to do is bring him back. Make Q play some of the dmen we have now. They are just as good if not better then TVR imo.

I would not trade ADB for a 6th d-man. Now, for $4-5 million worth of cap space over the next 4 years? Dunno, maybe.

All these "scouting reports" on this kid are based on his play against 16-19 year olds, 95% of whom will never get a whiff of the NHL. So all these amazing things he's done so far are akin to the amazing things that Kyle Beach, Rob Schremp and many other never was's did at the same level of competition.

I would go by the guys paid to scout and coach at the OHL level, whose opinions on ADB are somewhat mixed.

POSITIVES:

Lethal shot and release
Shifty/good short area quickness
High motor (in the offensive zone)
Fearless and not contact averse (but this is at a lower and much less physical level of competition)

NEGATIVES:

Only average speed (this, again, at a lower level of competition, what does that mean as an NHL winger? This allegedly kept him off the US WJC gold medal team this past winter)
Questionable commitment to defense/work ethic

Honestly, very few guys make the jump successfully from junior—with zero pro experience— to the NHL, and even less with the questionmarks ADB has. Actually, if I had to bet, while ADB may have the higher longterm upside, Fortin may be a better bet to make the team this year. He certainly looked a lot more ready in camp last year.

Hawk fans, some not all, tend to get out over their skis over the "premier prospect(s)" year after year, but with the exception of last year, the team generally doesn't anymore. If I had to bet DeBrincat (and possibly guys like Hayden, Hinostroza and possibly even Forsling) end up in top half of the roster roles in Rockford this year—which is probably what's best for their development.

Anyway, I veered off topic a bit. Point is, DeBrincat is not a sure thing as far as an elite or near-elite NHL player, and I did hear his name included in a package offered last year for Duchene.

A scout I know mentioned yesterday on a Twitter thread, he sees DeBrincat eventually as a 25/25 guy in the NHL. Personally, I see his highest upside as a 60 point guy, but he would also need to overcome some things to get there.

So, untouchable? No, as is always the case, depends on the return.
- John Jaeckel

I never said that DeBrincat should be viewed as untouchable. Arguably, in the Hawks system only Kane falls into this category. I also NEVER get "over my skis" with respect to Hawks' prospects. There are also very, very few players who truly deserve the "sure thing" tag and I never said that DeBrincat was a "sure thing". Actually, I would never say this in Chicago where Q is a huge impediment to young players.

What I did say was that's when I have watched DeBrincat play he showed he possesses many elite qualities. Apparently, I am not alone in this assessment as he was awarded the OHL's Player of the Year. Additionally, to say he was playing as an older player against younger players last year ignores the fact that he also excelled as a younger player against older players from the moment he entered the OHL.

His failing to make the USA World Junior Team had much to do with his taking a major penalty at the previous year's World's, after he did make the team. Also, as pointed out in articles at the time there was "politics" involved as the USA leans towards College players and the management teams have their prejudices. The teams from Canada and the USA are notorious for their often surprising team compositions. Many elite players have been left off. I was disappointed DeBrincat was left off but he is one of many to have met this fate.

I'm hoping that DeBrincat shines as a member of the Blackhawks system. However, I worry about the Q factor. DeBrincat might be the perfect example of the split in approach that exists between the GM and the Coach.

Hartman should be locked and loaded as L3-RW.

I am STILL banking on John Hayden to turn heads this year. Hayden didn't look out of place in his 12 games last year and if you extrapolate his hit totals over a full 82 games ONLY ONE man in the NHL would have had more hits. His point totals would equal around 30, all of that getting only about 11 minutes of ice time per game last year. More of a role, I can easily see him adding 15 points to that total. You may have a 45 point/ 300 hit guy on our hands. Nawt bad. He is also a very grounded, intelligent kid. If he doesn't make the team I'll be personally offended.
- kwolf68

Wolfy, Hartman was tied for 7th in rookie goals last year with Marner and that was at 12:46 per game TOI!! Check out the TOI of the guys he kept company with and his 19 goals are even more impressive. http://www.nhl.com/ice/ro...rt=goals&viewName=summary

I'm 100% with you on Hayden. Whether or not he helps this year who knows but not hard to project this kid out as a Ryan Reaves type but with a bit of offensive pop. Maybe a 250 hit 20+ point guy. ...... Really great guy to have on a roster and something the Hawks rarely have.

I never said that DeBrincat should be viewed as untouchable. Arguably, in the Hawks system only Kane falls into this category. I also NEVER get "over my skis" with respect to Hawks' prospects. There are also very, very few players who truly deserve the "sure thing" tag and I never said that DeBrincat was a "sure thing". Actually, I would never say this in Chicago where Q is a huge impediment to young players.

What I did say was that's when I have watched DeBrincat play he showed he possesses many elite qualities. Apparently, I am not alone in this assessment as he was awarded the OHL's Player of the Year. Additionally, to say he was playing as an older player against younger players last year ignores the fact that he also excelled as a younger player against older players from the moment he entered the OHL.

His failing to make the USA World Junior Team had much to do with his taking a major penalty at the previous year's World's, after he did make the team. Also, as pointed out in articles at the time there was "politics" involved as the USA leans towards College players and the management teams have their prejudices. The teams from Canada and the USA are notorious for their often surprising team compositions. Many elite players have been left off. I was disappointed DeBrincat was left off but he is one of many to have met this fate.

I'm hoping that DeBrincat shines as a member of the Blackhawks system. However, I worry about the Q factor. DeBrincat might be the perfect example of the split in approach that exists between the GM and the Coach.
- Z3Hawk

So apparently you're unaware of how many young players Q has played/devoloped.

Who'd he miss out on? Pirri? Morin? Jimmy Hayes?

Wolfy, Hartman was tied for 7th in rookie goals last year with Marner and that was at 12:46 per game TOI!! Check out the TOI of the guys he kept company with and his 19 goals are even more impressive. http://www.nhl.com/ice/ro...rt=goals&viewName=summary

I'm 100% with you on Hayden. Whether or not he helps this year who knows but not hard to project this kid out as a Ryan Reaves type but with a bit of offensive pop. Maybe a 250 hit 20+ point guy. ...... Really great guy to have on a roster and something the Hawks rarely have.
- Mr Ricochet

Good stuff Rico. I postulated on an earlier blog that Hartman could be in line for RW-1, at least a look there. He and Panik are similar players in they are strong on the board and bring a physical element so either would give that to 19 and 20....the chemistry Panik showed with 19 last year will probably see him getting first look at L1-RW.

Hartman has a chance of being one of Stan's better draft picks...Saad was obviously his crowning achievement and Shaw was a hell of a nice pick too, but after that Harty looks good, and I think has better upside than Shawzer.

Hayden would be a great guy to have on LW, because he has played center, so he could be a righty faceoff option. If Sharp slides into L2-LW or L1-LW, then Hayden has a shot at L3-LW. I am not buying Jurco ahead of him.

Pass on Iginla and pass on Jagr. Both are bound for the Hall of Fame but their day has past. Right now I would take both Kane (obviously) and Panik before those guys. I wouldn't want either of them to take Hartman's spot as 3RW either, we need him to continue to develop.
- DarthKane

I think you are right. The Hawks brought back Sharp, and that is likely a good risk, but I don't think that adding too many aging superstars will help. Putting my Q hat on, I would say the team likely is looking to add more pace and quickness to their puck movement and I don't think Jagr or Iginla do that.

Hartman had a good rookie year and the question will be, does he improve on or cement that progress or does he stumble now? He might get a bit more opportunity now with Hossa gone. The Hawks did lose #2 and #3 in terms of goals per game (in Panarin and Hossa). Saad/Sharp likely fill some but not all of that void in scoring goals, so there will be a need to have someone step up from last season.

I never said that DeBrincat should be viewed as untouchable. Arguably, in the Hawks system only Kane falls into this category. I also NEVER get "over my skis" with respect to Hawks' prospects. There are also very, very few players who truly deserve the "sure thing" tag and I never said that DeBrincat was a "sure thing". Actually, I would never say this in Chicago where Q is a huge impediment to young players.

What I did say was that's when I have watched DeBrincat play he showed he possesses many elite qualities. Apparently, I am not alone in this assessment as he was awarded the OHL's Player of the Year. Additionally, to say he was playing as an older player against younger players last year ignores the fact that he also excelled as a younger player against older players from the moment he entered the OHL.

His failing to make the USA World Junior Team had much to do with his taking a major penalty at the previous year's World's, after he did make the team. Also, as pointed out in articles at the time there was "politics" involved as the USA leans towards College players and the management teams have their prejudices. The teams from Canada and the USA are notorious for their often surprising team compositions. Many elite players have been left off. I was disappointed DeBrincat was left off but he is one of many to have met this fate.

I'm hoping that DeBrincat shines as a member of the Blackhawks system. However, I worry about the Q factor. DeBrincat might be the perfect example of the split in approach that exists between the GM and the Coach.
- Z3Hawk

I'm a guy who has a lot of questions about DeBrincat but I can't ignore he put up 104 points in the OHL as a 16yr old. Now many will point out that he played on a line with McDavid and Dylan Strome when doing so, and they were only 17 at the time, but that's good, real good.

The kid has plenty as a prospect to get excited about but I feel he dropped 9 picks into the 2nd round as a result of his CHL Top Prospects game.

Personally, I'd like to see them play Hayden in Rockford...and play center. See if he can develop there...learn to play both ends of the ice and win draws.

Good stuff Rico. I postulated on an earlier blog that Hartman could be in line for RW-1, at least a look there. He and Panik are similar players in they are strong on the board and bring a physical element so either would give that to 19 and 20....the chemistry Panik showed with 19 last year will probably see him getting first look at L1-RW.

Hartman has a chance of being one of Stan's better draft picks...Saad was obviously his crowning achievement and Shaw was a hell of a nice pick too, but after that Harty looks good, and I think has better upside than Shawzer.

Hayden would be a great guy to have on LW, because he has played center, so he could be a righty faceoff option. If Sharp slides into L2-LW or L1-LW, then Hayden has a shot at L3-LW. I am not buying Jurco ahead of him.
- kwolf68

It seems that somehow Hartman flies under the radar a bit, even amongst Hawk fans. Those are impressive goals per minute stats he had last year as a rookie and he played a physical game. Once the kid learns the league he has a chance to be a nice one who checks a lot of boxes.

And another thing about him is his game allows a coach flexibility. He can reasonably slot on any line depending on linemates and make up of the team. That adds a lot of value to a team.

I trust Q to slot him correctly. With Saad, Panik, Hartman, Wingels, Dauphin the Hawks have gotten some decent size, skating and physicality and hopefully Jurco can add to that. Maybe Hayden too........Either way it gives Q some reasonable hard cap depth to have some flexibilty and options. Love how Q worked that rookie strewn lineup last year and look forward to seeing how he works next year's roster without as many rookies, at forward at least. The defense, well that seems is this years version of hard cap hell to work around.

Wolfy, Hartman was tied for 7th in rookie goals last year with Marner and that was at 12:46 per game TOI!! Check out the TOI of the guys he kept company with and his 19 goals are even more impressive. http://www.nhl.com/ice/ro...rt=goals&viewName=summary

I'm 100% with you on Hayden. Whether or not he helps this year who knows but not hard to project this kid out as a Ryan Reaves type but with a bit of offensive pop. Maybe a 250 hit 20+ point guy. ...... Really great guy to have on a roster and something the Hawks rarely have.
- Mr Ricochet

Totally agree...... this kid must be given a shot. This team can not continue to allow visiting teams to waltz into the UC and play dance partners with another no-hit Quenneville team. It's embarassing to watch them get pushed around on home ice repeatedly and guys like Hayden are needed to change that mindset.
He will take the body and probably get his share of points as well. I guarantee that Hayden's hits will charge up the the crowd and perhaps ignite a few of the others to follow suit.

It seems that somehow Hartman flies under the radar a bit, even amongst Hawk fans. Those are impressive goals per minute stats he had last year as a rookie and he played a physical game. Once the kid learns the league he has a chance to be a nice one who checks a lot of boxes.

And another thing about him is his game allows a coach flexibility. He can reasonably slot on any line depending on linemates and make up of the team. That adds a lot of value to a team.

I trust Q to slot him correctly. With Saad, Panik, Hartman, Wingels, Dauphin the Hawks have gotten some decent size, skating and physicality and hopefully Jurco can add to that. Maybe Hayden too........Either way it gives Q some reasonable hard cap depth to have some flexibilty and options. Love how Q worked that rookie strewn lineup last year and look forward to seeing how he works next year's roster without as many rookies, at forward at least. The defense, well that seems is this years version of hard cap hell to work around.
- Mr Ricochet

Agree. I still don't love our center situation, but having wingers who can also take draws can help out. Say Kero is centering Wingels...Wingels can take draws say in the right d dot, as an example.

Defense is a HUGE "?" ... we have some prospects there, but more questions than answers and they will all play to how good the Hawks will be

-Does Keith rebound to being the Norris D man capable?
-Will Seabrook keep the legs churning?
-Is Murhphy capable of a Top 4 role on a champion team?
-Will Kempny make that next jump and apply his considerable talent to the Hawks?
-How much will Forsling progress?
-Is Rutta a candidate? Raddyish? Osterle?
-Is there any hope for Gustaffson or Svedberg?
-They signed Pokka. This has to be his last chance with the Hawks. Can he surprise?
-Is there someone out there (Karlson?? Snugerad? sp) that may surprise at Defense?

And do these questions go bad and we're left with...

Thanks bud. Means a lot to me
- Stan_Bowman

Dear Stan....just make sure you pass on bringing back 57. Tell your head coach to find a kid from his neighborhood to wash Q's car.

Do what the Penguins do when their players get run, score on the powerplay. That's the consequences we need...an improved powerplay. Not some joker who can fight. If a guy can actually play (or still play) and be tough or whatever, that's fine.

I just made a post about John Hayden's hit totals so I don't want to be in a no check league, but what excites me about him isn't just the physical side, but the skill, can he put up 40-45 points? In a fourth line role, probably not....on line 3? Maybe so. That's what excites me.

If Iggy can't do it anymore pass...and he doesn't get an exception because he "can fight"....he should be brought into the Hawks ONLY if he can still play.
- kwolf68

Agree with you on Iggy ...pass. The Penguins obviously felt they were taking too much nonsense so they added Reaves as a deterent. I feel the NHL may start getting a little rougher then it's been the last few years. I felt the Hawks looked a little too timid last year and it seemed teams were taking liberties with them. You can'thave guys like Watson running around looking to put players tthrough the boards every shift and have no one to keep him somewhat in line. I would rather not have a guy simply tojust fight but I think we need a couple guys who are willing to answer other teams when things get out of hand.

The last thing the Hawks need to do is bring him back. Make Q play some of the dmen we have now. They are just as good if not better then TVR imo.
- chelios99

Why is that the last thing they need to do? If 3rd pairing guys are a dime a dozen why are both of the ones penciled into the Hawks lineup question marks as things stand today?

TVR is a good 3rd pairing guy on a good team. If Rutta is as good or better, great. I thought Forsling looked decent in limited time but he also may be better served in the A if Collitin can do what he was brought in to do.

It seems that somehow Hartman flies under the radar a bit, even amongst Hawk fans. Those are impressive goals per minute stats he had last year as a rookie and he played a physical game. Once the kid learns the league he has a chance to be a nice one who checks a lot of boxes.

And another thing about him is his game allows a coach flexibility. He can reasonably slot on any line depending on linemates and make up of the team. That adds a lot of value to a team.

I trust Q to slot him correctly. With Saad, Panik, Hartman, Wingels, Dauphin the Hawks have gotten some decent size, skating and physicality and hopefully Jurco can add to that. Maybe Hayden too........Either way it gives Q some reasonable hard cap depth to have some flexibilty and options. Love how Q worked that rookie strewn lineup last year and look forward to seeing how he works next year's roster without as many rookies, at forward at least. The defense, well that seems is this years version of hard cap hell to work around.
- Mr Ricochet

One thing that goes overshadowed with Ryan Hartman is not only his defensive play, but his shot. Has a good, hard wrist shot. Still think he is Marchand-lite.

Doesn't seem likely from Carolina's standpoint. If they trade TVR back to the Hawks, they're going to need another depth Defenseman again.

Francis has previously stated he doesn't want to trade any of his top 7 defensemen.

That, and we've already got too many depth NHL forwards. I just don't see a real benefit to this for CAR

Doesn't seem likely from Carolina's standpoint. If they trade TVR back to the Hawks, they're going to need another depth Defenseman again.

Francis has previously stated he doesn't want to trade any of his top 7 defensemen.

That, and we've already got too many depth NHL forwards. I just don't see a real benefit to this for CAR
- BINGO!

Super news. I have no interest in this rumor.

Why the top 7? Why not just say I don't want to trade my top 20 D-men. if Carolina wants to add scoring punch (that's all I've heard they may be interested in) it's laughable to think they'd get it with their "8th" Dman. See Montreal trade for Drouin of what you have to give up to get legit scoring forwards.

IMO - send him to Rockford first and let him force his way onto the Hawk's roster thru excellent play.

At this point nobody really knows what he can be as a pro - could be Rocco Grimaldi or he could be a slower but stronger version of Johnny Hockey.

He should not be in the Hawks plans for this season, after that ........
- RickJ

Yup

I'm a guy who has a lot of questions about DeBrincat but I can't ignore he put up 104 points in the OHL as a 16yr old. Now many will point out that he played on a line with McDavid and Dylan Strome when doing so, and they were only 17 at the time, but that's good, real good.

The kid has plenty as a prospect to get excited about but I feel he dropped 9 picks into the 2nd round as a result of his CHL Top Prospects game.
- Mr Ricochet

Well he could get up and down the ice with McDavid who is probably the fastest and maybe best skater in the league so his foot speed can't be that bad.

And he didn't lose a step playing with Strome who isn't the same type of player as McDavid so you'd think he's adaptable.

At a minimum he should be able to find a soft spot and rip one timers in from the back side. Put him with Toews and Kane so they start with the puck and he will get a bunch of alone time to reap those rewards.

Super news. I have no interest in this rumor.
- kwolf68

LOL! I agree with you about dealing a top prospect just to make a deal the league allowed go away.

I'd be fine with getting TVR back if he cost was minimal. Still a young guy who when Q plays him on his correct side is good 3rd pairing dman.

Not sure what some are thinking a decent 3rd pairing guy is supposed to look like.

Super news. I have no interest in this rumor.

Why the top 7? Why not just say I don't want to trade my top 20 D-men. if Carolina wants to add scoring punch it's laughable to think they'd get it with their "8th" Dman.
- kwolf68

They're willing to trade picks and prospects, but they don't want to trade any D off their current roster.

Basically what they're saying is "Our depth in the next few years is great, but at this moment it's pretty thin."

That's why they acquired TVR and Kruger. they wanted cheap, effective depth pieces. I don't see them trading any of that away for futures.

Agree. I still don't love our center situation, but having wingers who can also take draws can help out. Say Kero is centering Wingels...Wingels can take draws say in the right d dot, as an example.

Defense is a HUGE "?" ... we have some prospects there, but more questions than answers and they will all play to how good the Hawks will be

-Does Keith rebound to being the Norris D man capable?
-Will Seabrook keep the legs churning?
-Is Murhphy capable of a Top 4 role on a champion team?
-Will Kempny make that next jump and apply his considerable talent to the Hawks?
-How much will Forsling progress?
-Is Rutta a candidate? Raddyish? Osterle?
-Is there any hope for Gustaffson or Svedberg?
-They signed Pokka. This has to be his last chance with the Hawks. Can he surprise?
-Is there someone out there (Karlson?? Snugerad? sp) that may surprise at Defense?

And do these questions go bad and we're left with...



- kwolf68

Hahaha YES!

LOL! I agree with you about dealing a top prospect just to make a deal the league allowed go away.

I'd be fine with getting TVR back if he cost was minimal. Still a young guy who when Q plays him on his correct side is good 3rd pairing dman.

Not sure what some are thinking a decent 3rd pairing guy is supposed to look like.
- HawkintheD

I think we know how Q at minimum sees TVR, which I suspect is really the whole point if there's something to the rumor