I'm sticking with Onnit really screwed him up, there's much more to it than just diet. I really hope he bailed on them.
- walleyeb1

He hasn't posted a single thing about it on his Instagram this year, which he did ton last year.

He hasn't posted a single thing about it on his Instagram this year, which he did ton last year.
- JRoenick97

I think he looked much thinner the last 2 years. I know you want speed but Panik and Hossa have speed but are not twigs.

If the Hawks trade Hossa's deal (and I think they will), it will be to a perennial floor team, where the contract (with a $1 million salary and $5.25m cap hit) makes TONS of sense.
- John Jaeckel

Another factor to consider is that perennial floor teams are there because they do not have the revenue stream to support a salary range near the cap ceiling. In other words the cap ceiling is $75 mil. The cap floor is $55.4. Small market teams would lose their ass if they were paying salaries up to the cap ceiling. So they may have their own self imposed budget of let's say $65 to $70 mil (in actual salaries). So given a suitable incentive they could take on the Hossa contract.

They only payout $1mil per year for 4 years on Hossa's contrac. They take on a cap hit of $5.275mil for 4 years which means nothing to them. In consideration of them doing that they pick up assets (some combination of players, prospects and draft picks). I believe the Hawks could also retain $1 mil per year in salary so the receiving team would have no cash outlay.

If the Hawks trade Hossa's deal (and I think they will), it will be to a perennial floor team, where the contract (with a $1 million salary and $5.25m cap hit) makes TONS of sense.
- John Jaeckel

That $1m cash versus $5.25m cap hit I think is very attractive to a floor team. For that reason, I don't see the Hawks needing to give away the farm in a trade to move that contract. I see it as a small give.

Hawks have to use some of Hossa's LTIR money on having a full roster. Right now, places like Capgeek list them at 3 goalies, 5 defensemen, 13 forwards + Hossa, and right at the cap. Taking away the third goalie won't cover the cost of adding 2 more defensemen, so about 1m of Hossa's LTIR money is already needed elsewhere. For Hawks to add Kane, they'd need Sabres to retain salary.

If Buffalo is willing for a Kane trade to include Hossa's contract & retain salary, there is little reason for either team to wait until the season starts. Teams would rather have their roster actually in camp, not training in someone else's system. If Sabres are willing to trade Kane, either before camp, or closer to the deadline seems ideal for them. And Hawks would likely want it done before camp as well. Only reason to wait is if teams believe NHL won't allow cap relief of Hossa's full cap hit from LTIR, or if Sabres are unwilling to make Hossa's contract part of the deal.

Historically, a player like Kane as a rental is worth a first and high end prospect on his own. TVR cost Carolina a pick, and according to JJ the cost of Carolina taking on Hossa's contract would be a pick and a high end prospect. Which to me says the cost of moving Hossa's contract is a high end prospect. So a Kane trade involving Hossa's contract would need a first and two high end prospects. Who knows what Buffalo thinks of them, but I'm guessing you'd need better prospects going Sabres way than Forsling & Hino. Obviously, some people develop better than expected, some people worse; but think former first or second rounders, or guys who if their draft were redone today would have been in that 20-40 range.
- Antilles

Remember when you said any Panarin or Hjallmerson trade would be a cap dump and only bring back picks?

Do you make stock picks? I'd really love to short a few.

So if the hawks put Hossa on LTIR after the start of the year, my question is what happens next summer and the following years if he remains unable to play?

Stan has said going the off-season LTIR path ties his hands for flexibility during the season.

Specifically, are the Hawks' hands tied next summer as they are this summer? Or can they put him on LTIR this in-season, then are scot free going forward? If that's the case, why would they trade his contract? Seems there's a reason to trade it to be able to make moves THIS off-season, but maybe that whole incentive goes away on day 2 of the season.

I wish I better understood the nuances of LTIR cap relief.

Another factor to consider is that perennial floor teams are there because they do not have the revenue stream to support a salary range near the cap ceiling. In other words the cap ceiling is $75 mil. The cap floor is $55.4. Small market teams would lose their ass if they were paying salaries up to the cap ceiling. So they may have their own self imposed budget of let's say $65 to $70 mil (in actual salaries). So given a suitable incentive they could take on the Hossa contract.

They only payout $1mil per year for 4 years on Hossa's contrac. They take on a cap hit of $5.275mil for 4 years which means nothing to them. In consideration of them doing that they pick up assets (some combination of players, prospects and draft picks). I believe the Hawks could also retain $1 mil per year in salary so the receiving team would have no cash outlay.
- -Doh-

No, Hawks can't. The percent of actual salary they pay has to match with the percent of the cap hit they retain.

I was on the Schmaltz train until another poster provided a link to his Instagram and the first shot was Nicky Boy in swim trunks this past May. Yikes.

That kid needs to get really serious about training. He has NHL talent but a house league Midget body at this point. He literally looks like he's never picked up a weight.

I think Raddysh as an NHL piece this year is probably a pipe dream.

The guy I am anxious to see, if/when he's fully healthy is Fortin, because he looked every bit ready last year, then got hurt after he was sent down, had a "minor" surgery recently that is holding him out of prospect camp.

Dauphin, yes. Hoping he can be a revelation on the PK, certainly has the tools and the mentlity to be that.

Hayden? Not sure where he slots in this year, NHL or AHL. But yeah, over time, anxious to see what he can become. The concussion in the playoffs HAS to be at least a minor concern because you need him to be a physical factor or he will just be another Hugh Jessiman.

Sikura is intriguing to me because I continue to hear good things about him.

I dunno, to me, like I said, the guy I am most excited about right now is Fortin, assuming he is healthy when pro camp starts.
- John Jaeckel

I just looked a that pic. Yikes. At least he called his body "chicken tendery" and Dylan Larkin commented "time to hit the gym" on it.

Remember when you said any Panarin or Hjallmerson trade would be a cap dump and only bring back picks?

Do you make stock picks? I'd really love to short a few.
- tredbrta

I never said that, though I multiple times said Hawks couldn't trade them and get cap space back as well as equal or better players for next year. I was right. I'm not surprised you didn't comprehend though, you see another teams tag on a user and instantly assume they are wrong unless agreeing with whatever Hawks fans hope to be true.

Thanks for sharing those tweets. Sikura is who I am interested in the most, too. Of our prospects not named Debrincat and Fortin, he has top-6 potential. I remember back in the spring he did state he was going to finish up his degree first at Northeastern, but that would be great if he could get a cup of coffee once the NCAA season is over in the spring.

His game seems similar to Schmaltz's, not to mention his frame. Glad to hear Sikura has packed on some pounds. I remember when the Hawks drafted him a few years ago, he weighed 145 lbs!
- AEL_Fox

These prospect camps are a lot of fun, a lot to be excited about a la the baseball hot stove league often in January.

Anyway, what these camps really mean to the Blackhawks and their prospects, is they work on certain aspect of their game and take direction or input on what the Blackhawk coaches etc al want them to work on.

Now this is something many are aware about, yet I do not know what specific things Sikura might be directed to improve upon as he can in his collegiate season.

I want to also look at the bigger picture. I am thinking that eventually either a Sikura or Schmautz prove to be, not be the answer as the #2 center in Chicago. You have to project where they might wind up. Because neither us going to be long term solution as a #3 center. They may prove good depth, offensive players early on in their maiden NHL journey.

As I said it is a lot of fun to watch and dream about the newest skill prospects. Eventually they and Mr Toews back will tell us a lot more than we might guess right now

That $1m cash versus $5.25m cap hit I think is very attractive to a floor team. For that reason, I don't see the Hawks needing to give away the farm in a trade to move that contract. I see it as a small give.
- Cmonalready

Exactly, if they max the cap (which will have no problem doing) they'll get the full value of Hossa's cap hit via LTIR. Stan's not under the gun to move his contract, which is a good thing.

Another factor to consider is that perennial floor teams are there because they do not have the revenue stream to support a salary range near the cap ceiling. In other words the cap ceiling is $75 mil. The cap floor is $55.4. Small market teams would lose their ass if they were paying salaries up to the cap ceiling. So they may have their own self imposed budget of let's say $65 to $70 mil (in actual salaries). So given a suitable incentive they could take on the Hossa contract.

They only payout $1mil per year for 4 years on Hossa's contrac. They take on a cap hit of $5.275mil for 4 years which means nothing to them. In consideration of them doing that they pick up assets (some combination of players, prospects and draft picks). I believe the Hawks could also retain $1 mil per year in salary so the receiving team would have no cash outlay.
- -Doh-

I think they can only retain a % of salary so if they retained 25% they would have a 1.35 AAV on there books and pay $250K so that would not work. the only thing they could do is trade for guys that are in the minors or on the team. that the team does not really want anymore that is on a one contract and making below the buried amount. They could also possible trade for a back loaded contract IE AAV of 2 mil But owed 3 mil and have them retain 50% and we could bury the AAV of $1mil but we are actually saving the team 1.5 Mil.

With the cap nearly flat the least few years, teams struggling to hit the floor isn't a thing anymore. Last year, Carolina was the only team who didn't end the year at least 10 million above the cap floor. This year, every team is already clear of the cap floor, or will be even if they sign their remaining RFA's for league minimum.
- Antilles

You're right. The Hawks should probably just quit and fold the franchise. They're doomed.

Powers notes on day 1:

https://theathletic.com/7...nent-place-on-blackhawks/

Mentions ADB as not looking flashy because it was mostly 1 on 1 drills, which isn't really his game. Also mentions he will likely not make the club right away, because that's really hard to do as a 19 year old.

Exactly, if they max the cap (which will have no problem doing) they'll get the full value of Hossa's cap hit via LTIR. Stan's not under the gun to move his contract, which is a good thing.
- walleyeb1

No, he's not. Ultimately, he'll move the deal (if he can) to avoid the same LTIR dance every year.

Powers notes on day 1:

https://theathletic.com/7...nent-place-on-blackhawks/

Mentions ADB as not looking flashy because it was mostly 1 on 1 drills, which isn't really his game. Also mentions he will likely not make the club right away, because that's really hard to do as a 19 year old.
- JRoenick97

Thanks for the insight, Scott.

So if the hawks put Hossa on LTIR after the start of the year, my question is what happens next summer and the following years if he remains unable to play?

Stan has said going the off-season LTIR path ties his hands for flexibility during the season.

Specifically, are the Hawks' hands tied next summer as they are this summer? Or can they put him on LTIR this in-season, then are scot free going forward? If that's the case, why would they trade his contract? Seems there's a reason to trade it to be able to make moves THIS off-season, but maybe that whole incentive goes away on day 2 of the season.

I wish I better understood the nuances of LTIR cap relief.
- Cmonalready

My understanding is he has to do a yearly LTIR/replacement thing. I don't think he can take on a long-term deal that "replaces" Hossa over the term of his contract.

Thanks for the insight, Scott.
- John Jaeckel

Said if he played every game until he turns 20, he'd be fourth all time in games played by a 19 year old for the Hawks.

"Patrick Kane leads the list. He broke into the NHL as an 18-year-old and played in 79 games after turning 19. Jonathan Toews was 19 as a rookie and played in 64 games. Nick Leddy is next with 35 games played while he was 19. After him, Steven McCarthy played in 18 games during the 2000-01 season."

He hasn't posted a single thing about it on his Instagram this year, which he did ton last year.
- JRoenick97

Still say the diet thing is vastly overblown. He def came in to camp this year about 5-10 pounds lighter. Think that had to do with an overall training/diet regimen and a specific goal.

Did it work? Hard to say.

he looked pretty damn good in the worlds, then hurt his back and looked pretty anemic through the season til about midway through—when he started looking Old Toews dominant—at which point, I heard about the back injury and that he was feeling much better.

What happened after and in the playoffs? Hard to say. Recurrence of the back? (very possibly) Fatigue? Maybe he was playing at too light a weight.

This year should be telling. I just think (and I don't own stock in Onnit or have any connection to Joe Rogin) to blame Onnit is silly. They're just supplements, and lots of their endorser athletes do quite well while on it.

It's really other things with Toews.

You're right. The Hawks should probably just quit and fold the franchise. They're doomed.
- John Jaeckel

Even better, lets go back to the James Norris days and give the Redwings all our stars for cash that moves form the right pocket to the left...

Said if he played every game until he turns 20, he'd be fourth all time in games played by a 19 year old for the Hawks.

"Patrick Kane leads the list. He broke into the NHL as an 18-year-old and played in 79 games after turning 19. Jonathan Toews was 19 as a rookie and played in 64 games. Nick Leddy is next with 35 games played while he was 19. After him, Steven McCarthy played in 18 games during the 2000-01 season."
- JRoenick97

Based on all I have heard, I don't think he's going to see much NHL action, if any, this year.

You're right. The Hawks should probably just quit and fold the franchise. They're doomed.
- John Jaeckel

Wow, going all in on the hyperbolic straw man arguments today, aren't we? When you say

a floor team that "projects" as a non-floor team can always acquire the deal now to help them get over

it seems like a perfectly reasonable part of the discussion to point out that no team needs help to get over the cap floor now.

You yourself referenced the fact Carolina wanted a pick and a high prospect for a player that's only worth a pick on his own (TVR). The idea that teams will covet Hossa's contract because the cap hit is much higher than the salary doesn't make sense given teams current cap situation. The incentive will be whatever high prospect is included in the deal. And I'm not sure why you're upset at that being pointed out.

I was on the Schmaltz train until another poster provided a link to his Instagram and the first shot was Nicky Boy in swim trunks this past May. Yikes.

That kid needs to get really serious about training. He has NHL talent but a house league Midget body at this point. He literally looks like he's never picked up a weight.

I think Raddysh as an NHL piece this year is probably a pipe dream.

The guy I am anxious to see, if/when he's fully healthy is Fortin, because he looked every bit ready last year, then got hurt after he was sent down, had a "minor" surgery recently that is holding him out of prospect camp.

Dauphin, yes. Hoping he can be a revelation on the PK, certainly has the tools and the mentlity to be that.

Hayden? Not sure where he slots in this year, NHL or AHL. But yeah, over time, anxious to see what he can become. The concussion in the playoffs HAS to be at least a minor concern because you need him to be a physical factor or he will just be another Hugh Jessiman.

Sikura is intriguing to me because I continue to hear good things about him.

I dunno, to me, like I said, the guy I am most excited about right now is Fortin, assuming he is healthy when pro camp starts.
- John Jaeckel

Thanks for your insights on some Hawks prospects.

Not sure if Raddysh will ever pan out at all as a serviceable NHL rearguard but I just wonder if him being older than most prospects makes him a surprising dark horse like van Riemsdyk was a few years ago. He dominated with Erie but did so as an overage player so you do have to put an asterisk by his 2016-17 season.

I think Hayden is best suited to start in the AHL to develop under Colliton, possibly as a top-6 forward, then hopefully earn a call up later in the season. If he does become a regular on the Hawks, I don't think it will be until the end of the season but more realistically next season.

As for Sikura, one has to wonder if he may be the Hawks top prospect at this point given that Debrincat doesn't seem to get glowing reviews during camps yet Sikura does. Bowman even said last year that Sikura was one of the prospects that impressed him the most, then he exploded with a huge junior year at Northeastern and could be poised for an even stronger senior year. Hopefully the pounds he's packing on is muscle and he is also hitting the weights (unlike doughy Schmaltz, haha).

Still say the diet thing is vastly overblown. He def came in to camp this year about 5-10 pounds lighter. Think that had to do with an overall training/diet regimen and a specific goal.

Did it work? Hard to say.

he looked pretty damn good in the worlds, then hurt his back and looked pretty anemic through the season til about midway through—when he started looking Old Toews dominant—at which point, I heard about the back injury and that he was feeling much better.

What happened after and in the playoffs? Hard to say. Recurrence of the back? (very possibly) Fatigue? Maybe he was playing at too light a weight.

This year should be telling. I just think (and I don't own stock in Onnit or have any connection to Joe Rogin) to blame Onnit is silly. They're just supplements, and lots of their endorser athletes do quite well while on it.

It's really other things with Toews.
- John Jaeckel

Yeah, I wasn't a huge fan of it, but I doubt it was the cause of any issues. He was also posting crazy explosive training videos last year. I noticed an absence of it this year. Maybe he's just not training yet.

With the cap nearly flat the least few years, teams struggling to hit the floor isn't a thing anymore. Last year, Carolina was the only team who didn't end the year at least 10 million above the cap floor. This year, every team is already clear of the cap floor, or will be even if they sign their remaining RFA's for league minimum.
- Antilles

Who was talking about meeting the cap floor this year? No one here.

There will always be a number of teams whose owners will look to shed real salary regardless of cap growth the next few years based on records etc.... Kroenke in Colorado is one. No way that owner will continue carrying that much real salary while rebuilding if it can be helped. Also, what happens if Tavares walks or is traded from NY? Snow probably is canned and they go into full rebuild.

But thanks again for trolling errr I mean outlining your hopes and concerns for the future here. Maybe it will help the Blues get a cup some day?