You are acting like with hornqvist we don't have a net front guy. ZAR and Guentzel have that ability. Crosby certainly does too. If Hornqvist is the piece to land a 3c then I value a 3c over what hornqvist brings to the team. Simple matter of which position are we deeper at. I would miss hornqvist, but 3c is more essential.

For us to really get a good 3c we are going to have to move more than just picks. Probably need to shed some salary. And we need to move an asset that another team would value. I don't think hagelin has high trade value. Hornqvist does. Sheary does. Maatta does. Our 1st round pick has some value, but I'm in the camp that I don't like moving a 1st this time of year. We need to stock our system with prospects ideally; but if we would take a significant injury during the year the 1st round pick is the easiest thing you can use to replace a 2nd pairing defenseman or a 3c (if the one we get is injured or malkin suffers something).

Of our best tradable assets I veiw Hornqvist as the most expandable.
- sditulli

Guentzel is not a net front presence. Crosby was more in front then he was when they played there together. Guentzel did what Crosby often does hanging around the net but really looking to set up a screen.

ZAR is unproven and won't even be on the opening roster. So no, I don't see plenty of replacements as a net front guy.

If there is a good trade for a 3C for Hornqvist I'm fine with that. I was referencing a cimment that nust wanted to dump him for salary space. I do think that most of you are overvaluing the return they'd get for Hornqvist with one year left on his deal though. We're a win now team and the team that tends to do the best for itself immediately is the team trading for the one year rental. But if Rutherford finds a nice deal for Hornqvist I'm for it, he isn't on my untouchable list.

Guentzel is not a net front presence. Crosby was more in front then he was when they played there together. Guentzel did what Crosby often does hanging around the net but really looking to set up a screen.

ZAR is unproven and won't even be on the opening roster. So no, I don't see plenty of replacements as a net front guy.

If there is a good trade for a 3C for Hornqvist I'm fine with that. I was referencing a cimment that nust wanted to dump him for salary space. I do think that most of you are overvaluing the return they'd get for Hornqvist with one year left on his deal though. We're a win now team and the team that tends to do the best for itself immediately is the team trading for the one year rental. But if Rutherford finds a nice deal for Hornqvist I'm for it, he isn't on my untouchable list.
- Tojo.

No reason to dump hornqvist for cap space. We don't need cap space. Personally I'd trade hornqvist for a pick and sign Jagr but that is personal taste as I think Jagr has a better overall game.

Main reason to move Hornqvist is for a 3c. I have concerns he is getting pushed out of a top 6 role by other guys in which case he becomes just a pp specialist.

Fehr wouldn't make it any better. Dude is burnt out and a bad fit here. I liked the signing but it didn't work out.
- Victoro311

Agreed but we're still down 2 centers

No reason to dump hornqvist for cap space. We don't need cap space. Personally I'd trade hornqvist for a pick and sign Jagr but that is personal taste as I think Jagr has a better overall game.

Main reason to move Hornqvist is for a 3c. I have concerns he is getting pushed out of a top 6 role by other guys in which case he becomes just a pp specialist.
- sditulli

People simply don't like it when people point out you have to give to get. If Hornqvist didn't have a skill set that was legitimately valued, we wouldn't be floating around the idea of using him to acquire a 3C. We are deep at RW. Hornqvist has value, burn isn't a star like Kessel or cost controlled like Sheary and Guentzel. Therefor Hornqvist is our most expendable assett of value at our greatest position of strength. But people would rather trade from a position of weakness and trade Maatta and role with Top 4 D Man Hunwick or just sit on our hands and do nothing at all and roll with 3C Rowney. Its perplexing.

Agreed but we're still down 2 centers
- 668710

That's also true. Too bad we traded Sundqvist for a guy who plays the position of our strongest organizational strength.

That's also true. Too bad we traded Sundqvist for a guy who plays the position of our strongest organizational strength.
- Victoro311

Yea interesting it had to be Sundqvist especially after the Blues acquired Schenn. Who knows maybe our development guys didn't see that fight in Sundy and said to move him

That's also true. Too bad we traded Sundqvist for a guy who plays the position of our strongest organizational strength.
- Victoro311

From what I remember of Dominik Simon is that he plays a good 2 way game, and it is possible that with 2 years in the AHL(94 pts.) & with a handful of NHL games, he is the replacement for Sundqvist. Is he ready for a 4C role in the NHL, I don't know, but he looks to be able to play a big role for the WilkesBarre Penguins.

From what I remember of Dominik Simon is that he plays a good 2 way game, and it is possible that with 2 years in the AHL(94 pts.) & with a handful of NHL games, he is the replacement for Sundqvist. Is he ready for a 4C role in the NHL, I don't know, but he looks to be able to play a big role for the WilkesBarre Penguins.
- so_buzz11

Don't tell JR that. As soon as he hears Simon is ready for the big leagues, he'll ship his ass out for another RW.

People simply don't like it when people point out you have to give to get. If Hornqvist didn't have a skill set that was legitimately valued, we wouldn't be floating around the idea of using him to acquire a 3C. We are deep at RW. Hornqvist has value, burn isn't a star like Kessel or cost controlled like Sheary and Guentzel. Therefor Hornqvist is our most expendable assett of value at our greatest position of strength. But people would rather trade from a position of weakness and trade Maatta and role with Top 4 D Man Hunwick or just sit on our hands and do nothing at all and roll with 3C Rowney. Its perplexing.
- Victoro311

FWIW, the Pens org just signed another RW, Ryan Haggerty, to an AHL contract! Could something be brewing on the trade front?

From what I remember of Dominik Simon is that he plays a good 2 way game, and it is possible that with 2 years in the AHL(94 pts.) & with a handful of NHL games, he is the replacement for Sundqvist. Is he ready for a 4C role in the NHL, I don't know, but he looks to be able to play a big role for the WilkesBarre Penguins.
- so_buzz11

I was under the impression Simon was a LW?

I was under the impression Simon was a LW?
- Victoro311

WBS has him listed as a center, eurohockey DB has him as Center, Elliteprospects has him as C,LW

Rotowire has him as the 5th C on NHL Pens behind Rowney and McKegg.

To be honest I don't remember the game he played for the Pens at the end of the year in the NHL. He had an assist with Bonino and Kessel and he did not take a faceoff, so he may have played LW in that game.

Really? when I play ball hockey no one gives a sh!t about net front presence. Hell there never ends up being positions either.
- DeflatedPucks

We take all forms of hockey very seriously up here....perhaps too seriously...

That's also true. Too bad we traded Sundqvist for a guy who plays the position of our strongest organizational strength.
- Victoro311

Prediction: by Christmas time or sooner you will like Reaves...

But yeah I hear ya...too bad he wasnt LW haha...

Prediction: by Christmas time or sooner you will like Reaves...

But yeah I hear ya...too bad he wasnt LW haha...
- MattStrat

I don't think he's hating on Reaves, it's just that we gave up a center prospect for him when we are now low on centers. But like I said earlier maybe the development guys didn't see that fire in him that he was gonna a make the leap.

The fact that I started that entire paragraph with the disclaimer "I think" and later included "I am of the mind" should clue you in that it is just my opinion and not a declaration of fact. What a ridiculous statement for you to make. Of course my opinion doesn't make it true.

I did not state anything as fact or true other than minor league goalies don't have much value, which is widely accepted as a true statement. I could be wrong about everything I have ever posted and will post on this site. Ok now?

Yes, nobody knows what JR is willing to give up except JR. Obviously. This forum is for fans to, among other things, speculate and post their opinions about what might happen. Which is what I did. Instead of getting caught up in falsely insinuating that I am making declarations as fact, how about offering YOUR opinion about my opinion?

Do YOU think the Pens would trade ZAR? Should the Pens trade ZAR? Do YOU think Sprong is expendable for the purposes of trading for a 3C? Whatever YOUR opinion is, neither of us is more correct than the other.

It seems as though you are itching for a fight. I am here to just talk about our opinions on offseason hockey moves. If you're not interested in my opinion, then don't respond.
- T-Train

I'm not itching for a fight and I think it's fun to discuss trade proposals even if they're a bit far-fetched, but I get irked when people think they know what's going on or that their OPINION makes the decision final.

My personal opinion is that the Pens shouldn't make any major moves RIGHT NOW. They are in a very comfortable position. The pressure is off them right now and can afford to be a little patient despite being in a WIN NOW direction.

I don't think they should trade any potential top-six forwards unless it's part of a deal for a YOUNG 3C who's locked up for a decent amount of term.

I think the Pens should go for low-hanging fruit like the players I mentioned and see how it pans out. If it doesn't pan out? Explore a move. Someone like Hagelin will be easier to move at the deadline because he'll have less term and lower cap-hit and same with Maatta.

I think the Pens should wait out seeing if either Sprong or ZAR can step up making other players moveable.

I just don't think the Pens should be aggressive right now.

I'm not itching for a fight and I think it's fun to discuss trade proposals even if they're a bit far-fetched, but I get irked when people think they know what's going on or that their OPINION makes the decision final.

My personal opinion is that the Pens shouldn't make any major moves RIGHT NOW. They are in a very comfortable position. The pressure is off them right now and can afford to be a little patient despite being in a WIN NOW direction.

I don't think they should trade any potential top-six forwards unless it's part of a deal for a YOUNG 3C who's locked up for a decent amount of term.

I think the Pens should go for low-hanging fruit like the players I mentioned and see how it pans out. If it doesn't pan out? Explore a move. Someone like Hagelin will be easier to move at the deadline because he'll have less term and lower cap-hit and same with Maatta.

I think the Pens should wait out seeing if either Sprong or ZAR can step up making other players moveable.

I just don't think the Pens should be aggressive right now.
- Rinosaur

Idk haha our bottom line centers are ROUGH/non existent. What if sid or Geno get injured in training camp/beginning of the year. I know it's not ideal but even knowing Cullen is gonna play would help lol

Idk haha our bottom line centers are ROUGH/non existent. What if sid or Geno get injured in training camp/beginning of the year. I know it's not ideal but even knowing Cullen is gonna play would help lol
- 668710

Playing the game of what if's doesn't help. What if Geno and Letang don't get hurt and both put up 100 and 80 points?

I was under the impression Simon was a LW?
- Victoro311

That's where he played anytime I peaked at a WBS lineup.

Yea interesting it had to be Sundqvist especially after the Blues acquired Schenn. Who knows maybe our development guys didn't see that fight in Sundy and said to move him
- 668710

Apparently that's who the Blues insisted on. I think the Pens soured on his ability to be a 3C, but thought he could still be a solid 4C. Nothing special, but I did lime him in that role and wish we still had him.

Playing the game of what if's doesn't help. What if Geno and Letang don't get hurt and both put up 100 and 80 points?
- j.boyd919

Yea you're right, but we still need a center I'm not saying rush and get crap cause that can make the situation even worse. I'd still like Cullen here for the 4th line this season regadless

Yea you're right, but we still need a center I'm not saying rush and get crap cause that can make the situation even worse. I'd still like Cullen here for the 4th line this season regadless
- 668710

Yeah I'm hoping Cullen suits up for one more too.

People simply don't like it when people point out you have to give to get. If Hornqvist didn't have a skill set that was legitimately valued, we wouldn't be floating around the idea of using him to acquire a 3C. We are deep at RW. Hornqvist has value, burn isn't a star like Kessel or cost controlled like Sheary and Guentzel. Therefor Hornqvist is our most expendable assett of value at our greatest position of strength. But people would rather trade from a position of weakness and trade Maatta and role with Top 4 D Man Hunwick or just sit on our hands and do nothing at all and roll with 3C Rowney. Its perplexing.
- Victoro311

I don't get that impression at all. A team that would want Hornqvist would be on win now mode. How many of those have a spare 3C sitting around? I don't see the return on Hornqvist being worth ot, but I hope I'm wrong. Agree he is expendable, but we don't have anyone who replaces his net front game.

I don't get that impression at all. A team that would want Hornqvist would be on win now mode. How many of those have a spare 3C sitting around? I don't see the return on Hornqvist being worth ot, but I hope I'm wrong. Agree he is expendable, but we don't have anyone who replaces his net front game.
- Tojo.

Off the top of my head, teams that are in win now mode who have gold center depth with the targetable center(s) in parentheses:

Anaheim (Cogliano)
St. Lewis (Berglund, Sobatka)
Minnesota (Staal, Koivu, Coyle)
Toronto (Bozak)
Florida (Bjugstad)
Calgary (Backlund, Bennett)
Lightning (Point)

Out of those, I think the Minnesota ones are the most unlikely (especially Coyle), and I don't think the cap would work for Tampa. But those are some pretty realistic targets just off the top of the old noggin. I'm not claiming that any of those guys would be Hornqvist for X player straight up, but I think there could be deals there with either them or us adding.

Also, keep in mind that Rutherford said that if he really wanted to he could pull the trigger right now and that the trades he's looking at involve moving roster players. Our three moveable roster players with value enough to be the center of a 3C trade are Hornqvist, Hagelin, and Maatta. Hornqvist and Hagelin are win now pieces, so unless Ruth is talking about Olli, which is, granted, posable, it looks like there's matches out there.

Off the top of my head, teams that are in win now mode who have gold center depth with the targetable center(s) in parentheses:

Anaheim (Cogliano)
St. Lewis (Berglund, Sobatka)
Minnesota (Staal, Koivu, Coyle)
Toronto (Bozak)
Florida (Bjugstad)
Calgary (Backlund, Bennett)
Lightning (Point)

Out of those, I think the Minnesota ones are the most unlikely (especially Coyle), and I don't think the cap would work for Tampa. But those are some pretty realistic targets just off the top of the old noggin. I'm not claiming that any of those guys would be Hornqvist for X player straight up, but I think there could be deals there with either them or us adding.

Also, keep in mind that Rutherford said that if he really wanted to he could pull the trigger right now and that the trades he's looking at involve moving roster players. Our three moveable roster players with value enough to be the center of a 3C trade are Hornqvist, Hagelin, and Maatta. Hornqvist and Hagelin are win now pieces, so unless Ruth is talking about Olli, which is, granted, posable, it looks like there's matches out there.
- Victoro311

- Feds91Stammer

None of those guys besides the Minni guys and Point are unrealistic. Cogliano, Backlund, and Bozak only have one year of term just like Hornqvist, and the Blues are loaded at middle six C. And Bjugstad is not great.