ahhh..no. I don't want Reeves on my team. Or Prost. The team needs to get quicker and more skilled.
Weise hasn't lived up to expectations, but those expectations weren't Reeves-like. I think Weise was brought in here for gritty bottom 6 minutes, with the thought of chipping in some more offense than your average bottom 6 player. He did that on the Habs. Unfortunately not here, and because of this isn't living up to a 4 year contract. The 2.5 mil is fine with me, the length is not.
To your other point, another poster in here mentioned trying Colin Mac with the big club. It's an interesting thought *shrugs* With that said, like I wrote above they need to get quicker and more skilled. I don't think Colin Mac does either of this. I think Lehtera and Weise are more skilled - Giroux_Is_God
As I understand it, Weise was brought in to replace Ryan White who did fill that kind of role with the Flyers. I am not impressed with Weise at all and I am not sure what he adds to the team. I do not believe he is better than McDonald who is a pretty decent goal scorer in the AHL, i s much more physical, and I think plays much harder. Regarding Reves and Prout, there are at least least 2GMs who would disagree with you.
It's not in hindsight, As I was watching the game in the first period I thought the Ducks were controlling play even while the Flyers had a 1 goal lead. The top line was playing well and that was about it. The turning point was the opening drop of the puck. The Flyers were flat, sloppy, and didn't match the energy of the Ducks from the get go. - MJL
I know the Flyers proved to be flat the whole game but while the game was ongoing, there was no way of knowing the Flyers wouldn't get things going and the chances of that happening vanished when one of their centers was knocked out of the game. That meant line juggling to go along with your new jumbled D pairings.
I hear what you're saying, but I'll say 2 things.
After the 1st period I thought to myself "holy christ this is gonna be 5-1". I wasn't far off. No way for me to prove that because I didn't post it or anything, but I promise I thought those exact words in my head. Just to shed some light on how bad I thought they were really playing. Which leads me to my second point. I think they get blown out regardless of Patrick getting his head stapled. The Ducks curbstomped them - Giroux_Is_God
They got Broad Street Bullied in their own building. They got knocked down in the fight, knocked out on a play on the boards, hacked and broken sticked (with no call) out of scoring chances and outplayed in every other regard. But I've seen too many crazy things happen in hockey to write a game off so long as things don't look too bad on the scoreboard.
White didn't fill that role either. White was a 4th line player. Hextall signed Weise to a 4 year deal for 2+M a year, and it was not to play on the 4th line. It was to play a top 9 role, provide some physical play on the forecheck and chip in some offense.
I wanted all 3 rookie defenseman in the lineup from the get go. I don't think they have a glaring need for size and toughness. It's a skating, passing, quick puck moving game now. - MJL
You are right - the game has changed a lot and i am glad the Flyers have made a concerted effort to increase their skill and increase their speed. It was long overdue. But it is still a physical game and I think it is difficult to win with a very small team. You have to have some size. The team that won the Cup the last two years traded for Reeves. The Devils, who have a better record than the Flyers, have Prout. The Flyers themselves recognize their size issues and have drafted Allison, Ratcliffe, and Strome over the last two years. Like you, I think Morin should have been in the line-up from the get go. But, I disagree - they do have a glaring need for size and toughness.
They got Broad Street Bullied in their own building. They got knocked down in the fight, knocked out on a play on the boards, hacked and broken sticked (with no call) out of scoring chances and outplayed in every other regard. But I've seen too many crazy things happen in hockey to write a game off so long as things don't look too bad on the scoreboard. - fls13
I guess you're just more optimistic than I am. I wouldn't expect the Flyers to even contend in a game where they played the first period like that...we saw that plenty of times last year.
I know the Flyers proved to be flat the whole game but while the game was ongoing, there was no way of knowing the Flyers wouldn't get things going and the chances of that happening vanished when one of their centers was knocked out of the game. That meant line juggling to go along with your new jumbled D pairings.
- fls13
I'm dealing with what was happening and what did happen. Not what might have or could've happened. Flyers never controlled the game at any point in reality.
You are right - the game has changed a lot and i am glad the Flyers have made a concerted effort to increase their skill and increase their speed. It was long overdue. But it is still a physical game and I think it is difficult to win with a very small team. You have to have some size. The team that won the Cup the last two years traded for Reeves. The Devils, who have a better record than the Flyers, have Prout. The Flyers themselves recognize their size issues and have drafted Allison, Ratcliffe, and Strome over the last two years. Like you, I think Morin should have been in the line-up from the get go. But, I disagree - they do have a glaring need for size and toughness. - Bergey
Chasing other teams and trying to follow other teams blueprints is not the way to go, and has gotten the Flyers in trouble in the past. Good is good, that simple. I think Morin's size and physical ability can be an asset but I don't think they have a glaring need for size and toughness. Jordan Weal for example plays tough with his won't quit drive on the puck. I'll take that and his skill over Reeves and Prout.
I'm dealing with what was happening and what did happen. Not what might have or could've happened. Flyers never controlled the game at any point in reality. - MJL
Controlling the game isn't how you win the game. You win the game by scoring more goals than the opponent. What certainly did not happen was Hakstol telling the team between the 1st and the 2nd, "We're tied now but playing badly so go out and lose this one completely in the 2nd."
I guess you're just more optimistic than I am. I wouldn't expect the Flyers to even contend in a game where they played the first period like that...we saw that plenty of times last year. - Giroux_Is_God
Good teams have to steal points sometimes. That didn't come close to happening last night unfortunately.
Chasing other teams and trying to follow other teams blueprints is not the way to go, and has gotten the Flyers in trouble in the past. Good is good, that simple. I think Morin's size and physical ability can be an asset but I don't think they have a glaring need for size and toughness. Jordan Weal for example plays tough with his won't quit drive on the puck. I'll take that and his skill over Reeves and Prout. - MJL
It is helpful in any profession, in any vocation, and in any sport to look at what your competition is doing and whether it is working. You would be a fool to do otherwise. On Morin, if the Flyers already had three other 6'3" - 6"5 stay at home defensemen on their roster who played a similar game to him, would you still want him on the roster? I wouldn't and I would be arguing that they need more mobile, faster defensemen.
Controlling the game isn't how you win the game. You win the game by scoring more goals than the opponent. What certainly did not happen was Hakstol telling the team between the 1st and the 2nd, "We're tied now but playing badly so go out and lose this one completely in the 2nd."
- fls13
Clearly the Ducks control of the game led to scoring more goals than the opposition. That was not an accident. The Hakstol comment doesn't make sense. I can guarantee that Hakstol wasn't happy with the Flyers performance in puck battles and with puck management at the first intermission.
It is helpful in any profession, in any vocation, and in any sport to look at what your competition is doing and whether it is working. You would be a fool to do otherwise. On Morin, if the Flyers already had three other 6'3" - 6"5 stay at home defensemen on their roster who played a similar game to him, would you still want him on the roster? I wouldn't and I would be arguing that they need more mobile, faster defensemen. - Bergey
This is pro hockey, and not any other profession. Flyers need to stay the course and not overreact to one game.
This is pro hockey, and not any other profession. Flyers need to stay the course and not overreact to one game. - MJL
Don't agree. You can always learn from your competition. It is short sighted to think otherwise. It is really not an overreaction to one game. Irrespective of the Duck's game, most people have been calling for Morin to be in the line-up from the beginning of training camp. The call has gotten louder since Andrew McDonald's injury but it is nothing new. Most Flyers' fan I know have seriously questioned Dale Weise's contribution to the team and effort and wonder and even last year questioned why he is the line-up most games.
Clearly the Ducks control of the game led to scoring more goals than the opposition. That was not an accident. The Hakstol comment doesn't make sense. I can guarantee that Hakstol wasn't happy with the Flyers performance in puck battles and with puck management at the first intermission. - MJL
Yes but over time. The game didn't start 6-2. The Flyers were down no more than one goal through the first half of the game. The Flyers did nothing to pick up their play as it was happening over the course of the game and Patrick going down in game most certainly did not help.
Chasing other teams and trying to follow other teams blueprints is not the way to go, and has gotten the Flyers in trouble in the past. Good is good, that simple. I think Morin's size and physical ability can be an asset but I don't think they have a glaring need for size and toughness. Jordan Weal for example plays tough with his won't quit drive on the puck. I'll take that and his skill over Reeves and Prout. - MJL
MJL - Interesting that you think the Flyers have tried to follow other teams' blueprints. Curious - what blueprint of other teams' did the Flyers try to follow? I always thought of the Flyers as more of a maverick team - pretty much ignoring what other teams were doing.
Don't agree. You can always learn from your competition. It is short sighted to think otherwise. It is really not an overreaction to one game. Irrespective of the Duck's game, most people have been calling for Morin to be in the line-up from the beginning of training camp. The call has gotten louder since Andrew McDonald's injury but it is nothing new. Most Flyers' fan I know have seriously questioned Dale Weise's contribution to the team and effort and wonder and even last year questioned why he is the line-up most games. - Bergey
People have been calling for Morin to be in the lineup because they think he might be better than Manning, which might be true, and they want the Flyers future to proceed. Not because they have this glaring need for size and toughness. Copycatting other teams is not the correct approach. Do what's best for your team.
MJL - Interesting that you think the Flyers have tried to follow other teams' blueprints. Curious - what blueprint of other teams' did the Flyers try to follow? I always thought of the Flyers as more of a maverick team - pretty much ignoring what other teams were doing. - Bergey
In the past the Flyers have absolutely tried to emulate and have reacted to trends in the league to try and follow the success and blueprint that other teams have had.
Yes but over time. The game didn't start 6-2. The Flyers were down no more than one goal through the first half of the game. The Flyers did nothing to pick up their play as it was happening over the course of the game and Patrick going down in game most certainly did not help. - fls13
That doesn't make any sense. How could a game possibly start 6-2. Every game is a process over time. Ducks controlled play and were the better team from the opening puck drop. The results of the game were not a surprise from the way the game was from the outset.
That doesn't make any sense. How could a game possibly start 6-2. Every game is a process over time. Ducks controlled play and were the better team from the opening puck drop. The results of the game were not a surprise from the way the game was from the outset. - MJL
That doesn't make any sense. How could a game possibly start 6-2. Every game is a process over time. Ducks controlled play and were the better team from the opening puck drop. The results of the game were not a surprise from the way the game was from the outset. - MJL
I envy your ability to know how a game will turn out based on the first few shifts. Hopefully, they play a lot better tomorrow.
In the past the Flyers have absolutely tried to emulate and have reacted to trends in the league to try and follow the success and blueprint that other teams have had. - MJL
I disagree. I have been watching the Flyers for a long time and believe it's actually the opposite.
People have been calling for Morin to be in the lineup because they think he might be better than Manning, which might be true, and they want the Flyers future to proceed. Not because they have this glaring need for size and toughness. Copycatting other teams is not the correct approach. Do what's best for your team. - MJL
So, the fact that people think he's better than Manning has nothing to do with his size and toughness? Those two qualities are completely irrelevant to any assessment to a player's skill level and his effectiveness on the ice - is that what you are saying? When people assess Shea Weber's game, I guess they never take into account his size and toughness. When people assess Zdeno Chara's game, his size and toughness are a non-factor? Is that what you're saying?
I envy your ability to know how a game will turn out based on the first few shifts. Hopefully, they play a lot better tomorrow. - fls13
Hyperbole. I can tell when a team is being outplayed by every measure. One defensive breakdown early by the team controlling play doesn't change that. I have no idea what you're getting at. It doesn't seem as though you're dealing with what actually happened in the game, and instead are dealing with what might of or could've happened.
So, the fact that people think he's better than Manning has nothing to do with his size and toughness? Those two qualities are completely irrelevant to any assessment to a player's skill level and his effectiveness on the ice - is that what you are saying? When people assess Shea Weber's game, I guess they never take into account his size and toughness. When people assess Zdeno Chara's game, his size and toughness are a non-factor? Is that what you're saying? - Bergey
Let's be clear here. I stated in an earlier post that Morin's size and toughness could be an asset for the Flyers. I have no idea why you would think what you're insinuating here. What I object to in your opinion is that the Flyers have a glaring need for size and toughness and they need Morin in the lineup and for Weise to goon it up because other teams have Reeves and Prout. The Flyers simply need to get better as a team.
I disagree. I have been watching the Flyers for a long time and believe it's actually the opposite. - Bergey
You can but history does not favor that opinion. The Flyers were often accused of modeling past seasons Cup champions and following trends in the league rather than setting them. Many accuse the Flyers of being slow to adopt the draft and develop method in a cap environment in favor of continuing to build through the use of trades and free agency. Hextall has taken the team in a new direction.
