I really wanna know why Tennyson is still on this roster...

EDIT: ...and guhle sits in Roch
- feetontheair22

Because Botterill has gone on record to say that he's keeping the guys in Rochester except in the case of injuries. He wants to do what they did in Pittsburgh, which is all fine and well, except Pittsburgh actually had, you know, depth.

Hello Ivan welcome to the board.

How close to the ice do you sit at the arena?
Are you a leftist commie?
Do you understand Greek and algebra?
Does your father pay your insanely high organic grocery bills?
- Der Kaiser

Made the list ..

toews is not a PPG player.. only once has he met that over the course of a season
- IndianaSabresFan

Panarin was last year, but forgot he's a goner

"ROR...he's still considered one of the top two-way centermen in the league"

Really? By whom? Homer Sabres media?
- BernardShakey

"Tier 2 – Think elite players, among the best at their position."

ROR is in tier 2.

It's not the greatest chart, it didn't take time missed because of injury in it, Jamie Benn is too low, but he missed a bunch of time, so he gets dinged. Stuff like that.

http://www.thehockeynews....es-it-take-to-win-the-cup

What makes us special though? Lots of teams fail. Most teams fail. Chicago has won 3 Cups, Pittsburgh 3, LA 2. Boston is the only 1 time winner in the past 9 Cups.

Everyone female doges about how terrible Murray was the whole time he was here but then are pissed we're not Cup contenders. It makes no sense.
- Wetbandit1

This isn't true though.

People are pissed at Murray because he sped up this process and got 0 results from it 3 years later. If he would have been patient, the discussion is entirely different.

If he would have stood pat, let the prospects develope, we'd be sitting with oodles of cap room, a loaded prospect pool, and Jack Eichel, Ristolainen, Reinhart, maybe someone like Matthews/Laine/JP/Tkachuk etc. Enough to start a core, and see how everything else shapes out.

Seriously, look at this roster, We have Bogosian, Gorges, and Moulson taking up almost 20% of our cap, contributing literally nothing. Rebuilding teams don't have those problems

I have taken to calling him Captain Half-Wall. Even Vanek made his living where the big boys play.
- IvanIrwin

Ivan, nice to see an opinion from another season ticket holder. You do see the game differently, especially from the 100's. You have more of a vested interest. Having season tickets is almost like being a small business owner. It isn't only discouraging as fan of the sabres, but also difficult and time consuming finding ticket partners ect. It's like the stock market, and it's hitting an all time low.

Jack is a bit soft and doesn't go in the gritty areas, but he is clearly the least of the sabres problems. He could really have another 10 assists this season, if we had some finishers.

Most of board regulars can't or do not want to hear negative opinions. Good for you to call it as you see it. When your at the games, what are your thoughts on Samson?

As much as I like kyle personally, he is the biggest problem moving forward. We owe him alot of money for a long time. Most of the other players are cost controlled or at least sorta producing.
His health, style of play and production will be tough to move. The nhl is a fast man's game.

I found a picture of Beady's Car.


- Der Kaiser

I'm going back to Rookies tonight for MNF. Hoping that bartender will be there again.


- Der Kaiser

following

This isn't true though.

People are pissed at Murray because he sped up this process and got 0 results from it 3 years later. If he would have been patient, the discussion is entirely different.

If he would have stood pat, let the prospects develope, we'd be sitting with oodles of cap room, a loaded prospect pool, and Jack Eichel, Ristolainen, Reinhart, maybe someone like Matthews/Laine/JP/Tkachuk etc. Enough to start a core, and see how everything else shapes out.

Seriously, look at this roster, We have Bogosian, Gorges, and Moulson taking up almost 20% of our cap, contributing literally nothing. Rebuilding teams don't have those problems
- sbroads24

It absolutely is. He made bad moves, he wasn't patient.

Everyone female dogged, and still do, about every move he made. How he was a drunk, how bad he was. And yet at the same time are pissed that we're somehow not Cup contenders now.

The cognitive dissonance is truly a thing to behold.

"Tier 2 – Think elite players, among the best at their position."

ROR is in tier 2.

It's not the greatest chart, it didn't take time missed because of injury in it, Jamie Benn is too low, but he missed a bunch of time, so he gets dinged. Stuff like that.

http://www.thehockeynews....es-it-take-to-win-the-cup
- Wetbandit1

Ror is definitely a tier II guy. Not really sure if he's the problem, his effort is never in question. He looks great every time he slips on the Canadian national jersey. Are there really more than 10 teams with a better second line center?

It absolutely is. He made bad moves, he wasn't patient.

Everyone female dogged, and still do, about every move he made. How he was a drunk, how bad he was. And yet at the same time are pissed that we're somehow not Cup contenders now.

The cognitive dissonance is truly a thing to behold.
- Wetbandit1

It is, but I'm seeing it from a different end.

A. I don't think a single person expected us to be a contender this year, the problem is we arent even close to a playoff contender.

B. If he was patient, then the expectations would be 100% different.

I don't get the confusion? He did what he did to compete immediately. He's on record saying he didnt think it had to be a 5 year rebuild. He's on record saying he wanted to compete for the playoffs in Eichel's rookie year.

He was all words

Patch - you hit a freakin' home run with this blog!!!
Love the discourse...and am surprised how many folks have come out of the woodwork to discuss...and mores surprised by the number who are significantly disappointment with the players on this roster.

Core Players
Eichel - As a projected 1st line Center and our best player, I give him a "B" rating, he needs to improve to become what we fully expected of a generational talent...needs to dominate and fully takeover games...not there yet but young
ROR - as a #2 Center - B+, solid all the way around, good defensively, good offensively, great compete
Okposo - B last year, D this year. Is this what the illness did to him, or will he comeback stronger, the jury is out. if he doesn't we have our next Molson on our hands
Kane - B+, plays physical, strong game, competes 100%. Not the highest IQ to be sure which lowers his rating. Come playoff time I sense a gamer.
Risto B, Not a number 1 Dman, decent 2, very good 3.
Scandella B+, as he plays a very solid D game and does have some O potential.

The Inner-Circle
Pommer B+, started strong, likely to wilt due to age wear and tear...would be a very solid 3rd liner
Reinhart C+, (B- as 3rd liner, C as a 2nd). for a 2nd overall, wanted much more than getting, especially away from Jack where he looks more like a mid-1st round selection
Bogo C, goes on long stretches of scratch-your-head play, occasionally puts a couple of games together, has the skill set, low hockey IQ
McCabe - C, expected much more, especially with Housely, needs to get his head out of his a$$
Lehner C, system change has exposed him...can he climb back to a B player?

Outside looking in
Girgenson, C/C+, expected more of a mid-round 1st, but doesn't kill you and plays with energy...solid 4th line player, again disappointment if that is where he ends up
Larson - B+ for a 4th liner
Bailey and Baptiste - C_ so far, expected more, maybe we'll see something from 1 of them but time is begining to get away from them
Beaulieau D, let's hope his injury knocked some hocky IQ into him else we have another Bogo on our hands
Antipin ?, seems to be putting it together slowly...will it continue or fade away

Get them out of here as fast as you can
Moulson
Gorges
Poulblahblahblah (Ok maybe he is starting to redeem himself)
Tennyson
.
.
.

It is, but I'm seeing it from a different end.

A. I don't think a single person expected us to be a contender this year, the problem is we arent even close to a playoff contender.

B. If he was patient, then the expectations would be 100% different.

I don't get the confusion? He did what he did to compete immediately. He's on record saying he didnt think it had to be a 5 year rebuild. He's on record saying he wanted to compete for the playoffs in Eichel's rookie year.

He was all words
- sbroads24

My point is how do you expect this team to be a Cup contender when the guy tasked with building it was so bad? It doesn't really make sense to female dog if the guy was so horrible. The team should be bad if he was as bad as people say he was. So female dogging about how bad a team that should be bad is is just female dogging to female dog.

Ror is definitely a tier II guy. Not really sure if he's the problem, his effort is never in question. He looks great every time he slips on the Canadian national jersey. Are there really more than 10 teams with a better second line center?
- Boss34

He's not, people just need to female dog about something.

My point is how do you expect this team to be a Cup contender when the guy tasked with building it was so bad? It doesn't really make sense to female dog if the guy was so horrible. The team should be bad if he was as bad as people say he was. So female dogging about how bad a team that should be bad is is just female dogging to female dog.
- Wetbandit1

Thats why i haven't female doged about it. Adjust expectations accordingly. he crippled this team. Jbotts gunna need some time to fix it

It is, but I'm seeing it from a different end.

A. I don't think a single person expected us to be a contender this year, the problem is we arent even close to a playoff contender.

B. If he was patient, then the expectations would be 100% different.

I don't get the confusion? He did what he did to compete immediately. He's on record saying he didnt think it had to be a 5 year rebuild. He's on record saying he wanted to compete for the playoffs in Eichel's rookie year.

He was all words
- sbroads24

Give him his due - he wasn’t all words.

He went for it big time, and was as active a GM as any other in the league.

It turns out his action was ineffective, but he wasn’t all talk.

Patch - you hit a freakin' home run with this blog!!!
Love the discourse...and am surprised how many folks have come out of the woodwork to discuss...and mores surprised by the number who are significantly disappointment with the players on this roster.

Core Players
Eichel - As a projected 1st line Center and our best player, I give him a "B" rating, he needs to improve to become what we fully expected of a generational talent...needs to dominate and fully takeover games...not there yet but young
ROR - as a #2 Center - B+, solid all the way around, good defensively, good offensively, great compete
Okposo - B last year, D this year. Is this what the illness did to him, or will he comeback stronger, the jury is out. if he doesn't we have our next Molson on our hands
Kane - B+, plays physical, strong game, competes 100%. Not the highest IQ to be sure which lowers his rating. Come playoff time I sense a gamer.
Risto B, Not a number 1 Dman, decent 2, very good 3.
Scandella B+, as he plays a very solid D game and does have some O potential.

The Inner-Circle
Pommer B+, started strong, likely to wilt due to age wear and tear...would be a very solid 3rd liner
Reinhart C+, (B- as 3rd liner, C as a 2nd). for a 2nd overall, wanted much more than getting, especially away from Jack where he looks more like a mid-1st round selection
Bogo C, goes on long stretches of scratch-your-head play, occasionally puts a couple of games together, has the skill set, low hockey IQ
McCabe - C, expected much more, especially with Housely, needs to get his head out of his a$$
Lehner C, system change has exposed him...can he climb back to a B player?

Outside looking in
Girgenson, C/C+, expected more of a mid-round 1st, but doesn't kill you and plays with energy...solid 4th line player, again disappointment if that is where he ends up
Larson - B+ for a 4th liner
Bailey and Baptiste - C_ so far, expected more, maybe we'll see something from 1 of them but time is begining to get away from them
Beaulieau D, let's hope his injury knocked some hocky IQ into him else we have another Bogo on our hands
Antipin ?, seems to be putting it together slowly...will it continue or fade away

Get them out of here as fast as you can
Moulson
Gorges
Poulblahblahblah (Ok maybe he is starting to redeem himself)
Tennyson
.
.
.









- IonSabres

again with that list we should not be in the bottom 5

Thank you!

100 level.

No.

Yes to both although my Greek vocabulary is shrinking.
25 years dead but my garden is organic. I would give you some but I don't grow the kool-aid you are fond of.
- IvanIrwin

I drink Ginger Ale and sometimes Gerolsteiner.

Keep up.

My point is how do you expect this team to be a Cup contender when the guy tasked with building it was so bad? It doesn't really make sense to female dog if the guy was so horrible. The team should be bad if he was as bad as people say he was. So female dogging about how bad a team that should be bad is is just female dogging to female dog.
- Wetbandit1

I think I was close to alone on the "Murray sucks" train two years ago.

In all honesty though, who is mad we aren't contending for the cup right now?

Even in a normal rebuild, I would expect us just now to be pushing for the playoffs

I think I was close to alone on the "Murray sucks" train two years ago.


- sbroads24

Give him his due - he wasn’t all words.

He went for it big time, and was as active a GM as any other in the league.

It turns out his action was ineffective, but he wasn’t all talk.
- Der Kaiser

You're right

Even in a normal rebuild, I would expect us just now to be pushing for the playoffs
- sbroads24

this is accurate

Ivan, nice to see an opinion from another season ticket holder. You do see the game differently, especially from the 100's. You have more of a vested interest. Having season tickets is almost like being a small business owner. It isn't only discouraging as fan of the sabres, but also difficult and time consuming finding ticket partners ect. It's like the stock market, and it's hitting an all time low.

Jack is a bit soft and doesn't go in the gritty areas, but he is clearly the least of the sabres problems. He could really have another 10 assists this season, if we had some finishers.

Most of board regulars can't or do not want to hear negative opinions. Good for you to call it as you see it. When your at the games, what are your thoughts on Samson?

As much as I like kyle personally, he is the biggest problem moving forward. We owe him alot of money for a long time. Most of the other players are cost controlled or at least sorta producing.
His health, style of play and production will be tough to move. The nhl is a fast man's game.
- Boss34

Until we put him in perspective people will place him in the McDavid ,Crosby, Kane, Matthews category and he's not.

Samson can't skate. I feel the same way about hockey IQ as I do about college QBs who have all the attributes except accuracy: run away fast!!
What the coach is trying to do will take time and we don't want that. Think January before they get a clue. I see a terribly confused team with a boatload of dead weight, Tennyson anyone. When I watch him play I think of the charge of the light brigade and we know how that turned out.

Patch - you hit a freakin' home run with this blog!!!
Love the discourse...and am surprised how many folks have come out of the woodwork to discuss...and mores surprised by the number who are significantly disappointment with the players on this roster.

Core Players
Eichel - As a projected 1st line Center and our best player, I give him a "B" rating, he needs to improve to become what we fully expected of a generational talent...needs to dominate and fully takeover games...not there yet but young
ROR - as a #2 Center - B+, solid all the way around, good defensively, good offensively, great compete
Okposo - B last year, D this year. Is this what the illness did to him, or will he comeback stronger, the jury is out. if he doesn't we have our next Molson on our hands
Kane - B+, plays physical, strong game, competes 100%. Not the highest IQ to be sure which lowers his rating. Come playoff time I sense a gamer.
Risto B, Not a number 1 Dman, decent 2, very good 3.
Scandella B+, as he plays a very solid D game and does have some O potential.

The Inner-Circle
Pommer B+, started strong, likely to wilt due to age wear and tear...would be a very solid 3rd liner
Reinhart C+, (B- as 3rd liner, C as a 2nd). for a 2nd overall, wanted much more than getting, especially away from Jack where he looks more like a mid-1st round selection
Bogo C, goes on long stretches of scratch-your-head play, occasionally puts a couple of games together, has the skill set, low hockey IQ
McCabe - C, expected much more, especially with Housely, needs to get his head out of his a$$
Lehner C, system change has exposed him...can he climb back to a B player?

Outside looking in
Girgenson, C/C+, expected more of a mid-round 1st, but doesn't kill you and plays with energy...solid 4th line player, again disappointment if that is where he ends up
Larson - B+ for a 4th liner
Bailey and Baptiste - C_ so far, expected more, maybe we'll see something from 1 of them but time is begining to get away from them
Beaulieau D, let's hope his injury knocked some hocky IQ into him else we have another Bogo on our hands
Antipin ?, seems to be putting it together slowly...will it continue or fade away

Get them out of here as fast as you can
Moulson
Gorges
Poulblahblahblah (Ok maybe he is starting to redeem himself)
Tennyson
.
.
.





Love the breakdown, but our record is a "F". Is that on the coaches, the system or are we over-rating the team we all grew up watching?

Scandella seams a but high with a B+. I would a think B+ is all star material. Not -3 with 3 assists. Zero goals. C = average at best

Larson a "B+" for a 4th liner? I have always liked him, but I'm not seeing anything positive from him. Too bad, he seemed like a good prospect with some grit and defensive abilities.

I really think our "core" isn't a ""B"" average. Wouldn't we be in a playoff spot?

Wish you were my teacher in college, pretty generous







- IonSabres

Patch - you hit a freakin' home run with this blog!!!
Love the discourse...and am surprised how many folks have come out of the woodwork to discuss...and mores surprised by the number who are significantly disappointment with the players on this roster.

Core Players
Eichel - As a projected 1st line Center and our best player, I give him a "B" rating, he needs to improve to become what we fully expected of a generational talent...needs to dominate and fully takeover games...not there yet but young
ROR - as a #2 Center - B+, solid all the way around, good defensively, good offensively, great compete
Okposo - B last year, D this year. Is this what the illness did to him, or will he comeback stronger, the jury is out. if he doesn't we have our next Molson on our hands
Kane - B+, plays physical, strong game, competes 100%. Not the highest IQ to be sure which lowers his rating. Come playoff time I sense a gamer.
Risto B, Not a number 1 Dman, decent 2, very good 3.
Scandella B+, as he plays a very solid D game and does have some O potential.

The Inner-Circle
Pommer B+, started strong, likely to wilt due to age wear and tear...would be a very solid 3rd liner
Reinhart C+, (B- as 3rd liner, C as a 2nd). for a 2nd overall, wanted much more than getting, especially away from Jack where he looks more like a mid-1st round selection
Bogo C, goes on long stretches of scratch-your-head play, occasionally puts a couple of games together, has the skill set, low hockey IQ
McCabe - C, expected much more, especially with Housely, needs to get his head out of his a$$
Lehner C, system change has exposed him...can he climb back to a B player?

Outside looking in
Girgenson, C/C+, expected more of a mid-round 1st, but doesn't kill you and plays with energy...solid 4th line player, again disappointment if that is where he ends up
Larson - B+ for a 4th liner
Bailey and Baptiste - C_ so far, expected more, maybe we'll see something from 1 of them but time is begining to get away from them
Beaulieau D, let's hope his injury knocked some hocky IQ into him else we have another Bogo on our hands
Antipin ?, seems to be putting it together slowly...will it continue or fade away

Get them out of here as fast as you can
Moulson
Gorges
Poulblahblahblah (Ok maybe he is starting to redeem himself)
Tennyson
.
.
.

- IonSabres

Reasonable grades
I’d adjust a few, but I don’t think you’re far off on any particular assessment