The guy with 1 goal in 22 games is going to play with courage and call underachievers out?

How bout they ice a team that's actually competitive on paper and then we can see what the leadership is like here. Nobody's leading a bunch of mediocre/overpaid vets anywhere other than a buyout.
- Sabresfan-365

I’m genuinely curious which players on the ice for us last night you place in the category of mediocre/overpaid vet.

Are there 3? 4? 5?

Sincerely.

I’m genuinely curious which players on the ice for us last night you place in the mediocre/overpaid vet.

Are there 3? 4? 5?

Sincerely.
- Der Kaiser

specifically last night? Pommer, Okposo, Gorges, Lehner. Press box Moulson/Bogosian. The rest can be attributed to not having a complete core.

Im not a Scandella fan but I recognize that his play would probably look a lot better if he was the #4 instead of playing risto like minutes.

specifically last night? Pommer, Okposo, Gorges, Lehner. Press box Moulson/Bogosian. The rest can be attributed to not having a complete core.

Im not a Scandella fan but I recognize that his play would probably look a lot better if he was the #4 instead of playing risto like minutes.
- Sabresfan-365

Even accepting your premise on the guys you identify - which is open for argument - 4 guys out of 20 being mediocre is NOT why we dropped that turd last night, or most other nights.

I don’t know what it is, but it wasn’t those guys. It was all across the board mediocrity last night.

Even accepting your premise on the guys you identify - which is open for argument - 4 guys out of 20 being mediocre is NOT why we dropped that turd last night, or most other nights.

I don’t know what it is, but it wasn’t those guys. It was all across the board mediocrity last night.
- Der Kaiser

between those four is almost 20 mil in cap space. Their combined value to the team right now is maybe 1/3 of that. If you're getting even 2/3 value out of that money spent the team probably isnt this bad.

The rest like I said can be attributed to having an unfinished core, which results in complimentary players playing above what they are capable of.

between those four is almost 20 mil in cap space. Their combined value to the team right now is maybe 1/3 of that. If you're getting even 2/3 value out of that money spent the team probably isnt this bad.

The rest like I said can be attributed to having an unfinished core, which results in complimentary players playing above what they are capable of.
- Sabresfan-365

I’m in complete agreement with the incomplete core - but there were a lot of people not getting the job done last night.

Frankly, I thought Gorges and Lehner had two of the stronger performances in last night’s game. It’s a real condemnation that Okposo is playing in a 4th line role, but he contributed more last night than any other winger (except Kane maybe).

I’m in complete agreement with the incomplete core - but there were a lot of people not getting the job done last night.

Frankly, I thought Gorges and Lehner had two of the stronger performances in last night’s game. It’s a real condemnation that Okposo is playing in a 4th line role, but he contributed more last night than any other winger (except Kane maybe).
- Der Kaiser

If we're zeroing in on last night specifically they kinda gave up once they lost momentum. They opened that game pretty strong then the goal came and they tailed off.

Same with the second, they had a decent push right up until montreal's goal and then nothing.

I mean even with the right leadership this sort of losing eventually takes a toll on everyone.

At some point, the top players on this team need to do what top players do: win games even when the rest of the team isn't playing well. The fact that Evander Kane has been this team's best player is exactly why they are in the hole they are in right now.

between those four is almost 20 mil in cap space. Their combined value to the team right now is maybe 1/3 of that. If you're getting even 2/3 value out of that money spent the team probably isnt this bad.

The rest like I said can be attributed to having an unfinished core, which results in complimentary players playing above what they are capable of.
- Sabresfan-365

Yep
And that will only be fixed (for the most part) by young guys like Mittelstadt, Nylander, Guhle, etc. coming up & performing well enough to knock these guys down into their appropriate roles

We can also do that by trade or UFA signing, but that’s easier said than done

Yep
And that will only be fixed (for the most part) by young guys like Mittelstadt, Nylander, Guhle, etc. coming up & performing well enough to knock these guys down into their appropriate roles

We can also do that by trade or UFA signing, but that’s easier said than done
- jdfitz77

Between Nylander, Guhle, Reinhart, Mittelstadt and the 2018 first rounder, they should be able to turn this into the remaining let's say 2 core pieces either through development or via trade.

But if it's through development (most likely) gotta know that not all player growth is the same. it's possible they all develop at a similar rate but it's very possible you see plenty of ups and downs before they really become high impact NHLers

At some point, the top players on this team need to do what top players do: win games even when the rest of the team isn't playing well. The fact that Evander Kane has been this team's best player is exactly why they are in the hole they are in right now.
- buffalofan19

The core of this team cannot take over a game because it's incomplete.

So trade deadline: what are we getting in return:

Kane : ?
Gorges - 3rd?
Josephson?
Poliiutt?
Chad ?

All expiring contracts

At some point, the top players on this team need to do what top players do: win games even when the rest of the team isn't playing well. The fact that Evander Kane has been this team's best player is exactly why they are in the hole they are in right now.
- buffalofan19

Their top players are looking for someone to lead them out of this poop.

This team is so (frank)ed, especially next year...
-$17.5m tied up in GMJE and ROR
-Kane at $7m or gone, betting on gone...and gone are our 5v5 goals
-Reinhart at $5M or gone, betting on gone...how’s that #1 line look now
-$7m Okposo on 3rd or 4th line, that’s about $6m too much
Top 6 is looking great!
Better hope Nylander and Mittlestat mature very quickly, or Bailey Baptiste surprise them and both play up to top 6 standards. I’m not holding my breath.

-Lehner gone...not a huge loss, but no banking on whom?

-D? Who the hell knows, but hopefully this is where JBotts invests from value received from assumed Reinhart and Kane trades. If those two are retained, how does he expect to fortify a.terrible D Corps?

Between Nylander, Guhle, Reinhart, Mittelstadt and the 2018 first rounder, they should be able to turn this into the remaining let's say 2 core pieces either through development or via trade.

But if it's through development (most likely) gotta know that not all player growth is the same. it's possible they all develop at a similar rate but it's very possible you see plenty of ups and downs before they really become high impact NHLers
- Sabresfan-365

For sure
It’s not like Nylander is gonna step into the lineup & score 30goals next year

I do think we have a bunch of “good” forward talent ready to make the leap

Nylander, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching, Rodrigues, Cj Smith...
but who of those guys will hit their ceiling?
And how soon can they start consistently contributing?

So trade deadline: what are we getting in return:

Kane : ?
Gorges - 3rd?
Josephson?
Poliiutt?
Chad ?

All expiring contracts
- Boss34

Kane: 1st and okay prospect or good prospect and okay pick

Gorges- 4th maybe

Josefson- 6th

Benoit balls- 3rd...maybe second if he gets hot at the right time

Chad- waivers for ullmark

For sure
It’s not like Nylander is gonna step into the lineup & score 30goals next year

I do think we have a bunch of “good” forward talent ready to make the leap

Nylander, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching, Rodrigues, Cj Smith...
but who of those guys will hit their ceiling?
And how soon can they start consistently contributing?
- jdfitz77

agreed

Kane: 1st and okay prospect or good prospect and okay pick

Gorges- 4th maybe

Josefson- 6th

Benoit balls- 3rd...maybe second if he gets hot at the right time

Chad- waivers for ullmark
- Sabresfan-365

I’d rather get the good prospect & lower pick for Kane
Closer to getting a potentially good player in the lineup

Agree with the rest...
although teams overpay for Defensemen,
so we could do better with Gorges

I’d rather get the good prospect & lower pick for Kane
Closer to getting a potentially good player in the lineup

Agree with the rest...
although teams overpay for Defensemen,
so we could do better with Gorges
- jdfitz77

Can we acquire more by offering to retain 50% salary for 2018-19 on:
Pommer
Bogo
Okposo
Do we also need to add a prospect back on Okposo? Say like Baptist or Bailey.
That would be a ton of cap space cleared in deadweight.

Can we acquire more by offering to retain 50% salary for 2018-19 on:
Pommer
Bogo
Okposo
Do we also need to add a prospect back on Okposo? Say like Baptist or Bailey.
That would be a ton of cap space cleared in deadweight.
- IonSabres

Isn't it against the CBA or some poop to hold salary on more than 2 players? idk...

Isn't it against the CBA or some poop to hold salary on more than 2 players? idk...
- jochfr

I read up to 3 at any one time, and no more than 15% of Cap Ceiling...so at assumed $75m ceiling, then around $10.5M +/-

I read up to 3 at any one time, and no more than 15% of Cap Ceiling...so at assumed $75m ceiling, then around $10.5M +/-
- IonSabres

Good job!

I never read.

Hold
2.75 on Pommer
2.6 on Bogo
3.75 on Okposo, add to it as necessary given longer term contract.

We save about $9 - 9.5m

Get 2nds / 3rds for each idk, whatever to get rid of those contracts.

Hold
2.75 on Pommer
2.6 on Bogo
3.75 on Okposo, add to it as necessary given longer term contract.

We save about $9 - 9.5m

Get 2nds / 3rds for each idk, whatever to get rid of those contracts.
- IonSabres

Holding huge chunks of contract on so many players is a dumb idea.

Holding huge chunks of contract on so many players is a dumb idea.
- Larsson_fan

Is Cam Talbot starting tonight? Daily faceoff says yes but it says he's day to day in my league

Holding huge chunks of contract on so many players is a dumb idea.
- Larsson_fan

especially since you can only do it on 2 guys


Edit: i guess it's 3

Hold
2.75 on Pommer
2.6 on Bogo
3.75 on Okposo, add to it as necessary given longer term contract.

We save about $9 - 9.5m

Get 2nds / 3rds for each idk, whatever to get rid of those contracts.
- IonSabres

i wouldn't hold salary on the longer term deals. tends to hurt you long term like a buyout would.

Could do it for bogo and pommer cause of the term, likely get some value for it.