The 4th line did this yr then that plan was abandoned by Q. Obviously the offseason plan of getting some size, grit and push back in the bottom 6 was agreed upon cuz StanBowPops&McD went out and got Bauma and Wingels to play with Hayden and Q played them. Then, that plan sees all but Wingels, the least physical of all of them, nowhere to be found.

Garbutt acquired, not played. Weise acquired, not played, Bouma acquired, not played. But conversely Mashinter plays, Scott plays. ... As soon as anyone figures Q out share with me.

Q is always gonna lean speed skill no matter their size or what line. He may agree of the need for some push back guys but that never lasts long with him.
- Mr Ricochet

I'm a Q defender but you gotta shake your head at some of these personnel decisions. Except for the Vancouver game, the defence group had played reasonably well last few starts, not great but OK. So he decides last night to insert Rutta who was atrocious and play Murphy on his offside, sending Kempny to the pressbox so he could eat peanuts with Ryan Hartman who clearly had irritated Q with minor penalties in the last 2 games. But to insert Bouma in his place - how was that going to help?

I can't help but to notice how the precipitous decline of Mike Richards has uncanny parallels to that of our own Johnny Toews.
- Bjm84

A guy can take only so many crosscheck's

You brought Saad back to play with Toews....so play him with Toews. Saad, Toews, DuClair, DeBrincat, Kane and Schmaltz need to be on the top two lines....in whatever combo is best. Put Hartman and Vinny on AA's wings. Kampf with Sikura and another winger on line four. Those are not bad forward lines.

The defense is where we really are screwed. Murphy and Oesterle could be your third pairing. Keith and hopefully Jokiharju can be a first dman pairing. I still have faith that Forsling can be a solid 2L Defenseman. But we need a really good 2R Defenseman to team with him. I have seen enough of Seabs, Ruuta and Kempny to know they are not the answer.
- onehundredlevel

I’m sticking to my theory that it’s the forwards that are the problem more so than the D. Forwards are frequently out of position, late to the D zone leaving the Dmen no good options for quick exit passes. It seems to me, just by the eye test that there’s been an inordinate amount of forward turnovers in the D zone this year.

Yeah Rutta, Forsling etc.... making some rookie mistakes but that’s to be expected. The biggest problem is Seabrook’s play and contract albatross.

The Hawks are a defensive disaster. However, it is of their own creation. Dirty Ulf’s system is ludicrous. His system calls for constant penetration of the offensive zone. This is not limited to times when the forwards possess the puck down low. This is not limited to when the team is behind. Against Vancouver the Hawks were up 1-0 on the road. Needless offensive penetration creates an easy 2 on 1 the other way which Oesterle totally misplays and suddenly it is 1 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to an eventual loss. Against Calgary the Hawks were up 2-0 on the road. Complete weirdness as the puck is not deep but Gustafson is playing high up the ice. The play is right in front of him but he makes no effort to fall back. Seebs is also high. Stajan who can’t score to save his life gets an easy breakaway and suddenly it is 2 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to another eventual loss.

If the team doesn’t play careful defence first hockey with 1 to 0 and 2 to 1 leads in key games on the road when is it played?

The Hawks have NEVER played this way. D-Men activated when it could be done safely and when it made sense. Seebs who still is doing fine from a +/- standpoint was refusing to stupidly take these offensive chances. His reward for not towing the line was to be sat out. First game back there was Seebs deep in the offensive zone constantly.

No team should give up a constant stream of odd-man breaks including breakaways and 2 on 1s. What kind of system is this that allows that happen? An insane system.

Another huge weakness is the complete refusal under this system for the D-Men to just relieve pressure by getting the puck out of the zone. NEVER is the puck lifted out. NEVER is the puck shot hard along the boards to get the puck out or make it hard to play. Instead the puck is played softly along the boards and easily intercepted. This, of course, leads to goals as it did last night.

This system is awful.

Are their any Hawks D prospects in Rockford worthy of a look-see before the year is out?

Dahlstrom maybe?
- z1990z

I think you see Dalhstrom get a sniff to see how he looks. They really like Snuggarud as well who's working on a lot in Rfd right now.

Toews got mad once, so there is that. This is the product of Bowman investing too much in core players who simply were no longer worth the cost. In Bowman's defense he could not have known 19 would become such an ordinary player at 29 and Seabrook's decline has been just as bad, though his contract was highly questionable when signed. The money given to those guys ideally would have been less and they could have put even better players around them. NOT good enough to carry a team like this, but are paid like it.
- kwolf68

Bowman gets paid to make the right decisions. He is paid to be the expert and if he's not then he's useless to the team. Everybody knew what the economy was after 2007-2008 and no informed thinking person could reasonably expect massive raises in the salary cap to bail him out of ridiculously long overpaid contracts. Bowman is making all of us pay the price of that stupidity and now he needs to pay the price.

Don't know if I'm reading it correctly but it looks like Hawks with the lead going into the 3rd period have won 83.3% of those games the worst year was in 2011 at 82.5%, otherwise the other years at 86% to 90% or better, 2015 100% wow.
- BetweenTheDots

at one point from 2014 into 2016...they were something like 80-0-4 with 3rd period leads; that string broke with 2 strt home losses blowing leads...

The Hawks are a defensive disaster. However, it is of their own creation. Dirty Ulf’s system is ludicrous. His system calls for constant penetration of the offensive zone. This is not limited to times when the forwards possess the puck down low. This is not limited to when the team is behind. Against Vancouver the Hawks were up 1-0 on the road. Needless offensive penetration creates an easy 2 on 1 the other way which Oesterle totally misplays and suddenly it is 1 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to an eventual loss. Against Calgary the Hawks were up 2-0 on the road. Complete weirdness as the puck is not deep but Gustafson is playing high up the ice. The play is right in front of him but he makes no effort to fall back. Seebs is also high. Stajan who can’t score to save his life gets an easy breakaway and suddenly it is 2 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to another eventual loss.

If the team doesn’t play careful defence first hockey with 1 to 0 and 2 to 1 leads in key games on the road when is it played?

The Hawks have NEVER played this way. D-Men activated when it could be done safely and when it made sense. Seebs who still is doing fine from a +/- standpoint was refusing to stupidly take these offensive chances. His reward for not towing the line was to be sat out. First game back there was Seebs deep in the offensive zone constantly.

No team should give up a constant stream of odd-man breaks including breakaways and 2 on 1s. What kind of system is this that allows that happen? An insane system.

Another huge weakness is the complete refusal under this system for the D-Men to just relieve pressure by getting the puck out of the zone. NEVER is the puck lifted out. NEVER is the puck shot hard along the boards to get the puck out or make it hard to play. Instead the puck is played softly along the boards and easily intercepted. This, of course, leads to goals as it did last night.

This system is awful.
- Z3Hawk

Look we get it, you don’t like Samuelsson but your “Dirty Ulf” schtick is getting old. You’re hate for the coach blinds your ability to make objective assessments.

Those who odd man rushes are often a result of having three forwards caught down low, not realizing who’s supposed to be in the F1, F2, or F3 position. We frequently end up two in the F1 and one in the F2 none in the F3. Worse yet too many times we end up with all three forwards caught in the F1 position.

The Hawks are a defensive disaster. However, it is of their own creation. Dirty Ulf’s system is ludicrous. His system calls for constant penetration of the offensive zone. This is not limited to times when the forwards possess the puck down low. This is not limited to when the team is behind. Against Vancouver the Hawks were up 1-0 on the road. Needless offensive penetration creates an easy 2 on 1 the other way which Oesterle totally misplays and suddenly it is 1 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to an eventual loss. Against Calgary the Hawks were up 2-0 on the road. Complete weirdness as the puck is not deep but Gustafson is playing high up the ice. The play is right in front of him but he makes no effort to fall back. Seebs is also high. Stajan who can’t score to save his life gets an easy breakaway and suddenly it is 2 to 1. Momentum is gone leading to another eventual loss.

If the team doesn’t play careful defence first hockey with 1 to 0 and 2 to 0 leads in key games on the road when is it played?

The Hawks have NEVER played this way. D-Men activated when it could be done safely and when it made sense. Seebs who still is doing fine from a +/- standpoint was refusing to stupidly take these offensive chances. His reward for not towing the line was to be sat out. First game back there was Seebs deep in the offensive zone constantly.

No team should give up a constant stream of odd-man breaks including breakaways and 2 on 1s. What kind of system is this that allows that to happen? An insane system.

Another huge weakness is the complete refusal under this system for the D-Men to just relieve pressure by getting the puck out of the zone. NEVER is the puck lifted out. NEVER is the puck shot hard along the boards to get the puck out or make it hard to play. Instead the puck is played softly along the boards and easily intercepted. This, of course, leads to goals as it did last night.

This system is awful.
- Z3Hawk

Pissing and moaning about the high dollar long term contracts is big now and understandable. I was involved with the game for many years and am now just a couch potato watching on tv. And the reason I chose to do so in one word is money. It's more about money than hockey for the last 25 years or so. Which of course is about when Bettman was hired. What you have now is a glorified mens league with huge ticket prices for a game. Touch a guys stick with your stick and it's a penalty, but crosscheck the poop out of a guy and that's ok. Great. And a working class fan can't take a family of four to a game anymore, which I think is really sad.

So after a lockout the NHL get's it's salary cap. And I have to give credit where credit is due. Bettman called it, he said GM's will regret the long term contracts. He warned them again and again. he said "don't do it". Annd he is the one who before Toews, Kane, and Seabrook got their contracts said that the cap was going up right before the cap went down. Call me powerenforcer junior, but it wouldn't surprise me a bit if that was an intentional misleading by Bettman. All things considered I'll take the couch.
- 6628

agree i have mentioned this before...handling your stick like a weapon parallel to the ice and than smashing into a players back has to be eliminated and called; crosschecking no penalty zone in front of the net is out of control...some wicked whiplashes as well as back injurys are the result and those whiplashes can cause concussions...the NHL is not a safety first league.

the season has been reduced to the following:

1. will keith score a goal this year
2. will the pp score when keith is on the ice
3. will toews make it to 20 goals and 50 pts
4. will saad make it to 20 goals and 40 pts
5. will smaltz and adb make it to 20 goals each
6. will sharp, bouma, wingels, kempny survive the TDL

Look we get it, you don’t like Samuelsson but your “Dirty Ulf” stick is getting old. You’re hate for the coach blinds your ability to make objective assessments.

Those who odd man rushes are often a result of having three forwards caught down low, not realizing who’s supposed to be in the F1, F2, or F3 position. We frequently end up two in the F1 and one in the F2 none in the F3. Worse yet too many times we end up with all three forwards caught in the F1 position.
- walleyeb1

Uhhh - SCHTICK, not stick.

Jeez....

I have previously asked how Bouma plays in front of anyone. I don’t enjoy criticizing players but Bouma is not an NHL player. For someone who must play physical hockey to bring something to the table he doesn’t even do that. It is also apparent that Bouma is simply not going to chip in offensively.

Wingels is another player with a limited skill package. I didn’t understand why Bowman signed either of them, in the off-season - it simply took opportunities away from others. Bowman also signed Sharp. Sharp has become a bit of a goat for the coaches. Whatever has ailed or ails the team it certainly wasn’t Sharp’s fault as his role has been relatively small. What sets Sharp apart from other options is he still possesses a scoring touch. Also must Hartman always be put in the doghouse. Q do you really think this is working? At least Hartman cares and attempts to play aggressively. You liked that so much about Shaw. Also if taking unnecessary, undisciplined penalties is your argument why hasn’t Toews been sat out?

Personnel decisions have been ridiculous. Rutta is not an NHL D-Man. He may not be an AHL D-Man. Oesterle falls into the same category. Neither have any idea what they should be doing in their own zone. Although Dirty Ulf obviously disagrees being able to play defence is still the priority for a D-Man. Also for heaven’s sake let’s try to play the D-Men on their proper sides.

Also for the rest of the season let Dirty Ulf help with UC Maintenance. I was going to say Security but Dirty Ulf is cowardly weak and can be easily knocked out - right Domi?

I’m sticking to my theory that it’s the forwards that are the problem more so than the D. Forwards are frequently out of position, late to the D zone leaving the Dmen no good options for quick exit passes. It seems to me, just by the eye test that there’s been an inordinate amount of forward turnovers in the D zone this year.

Yeah Rutta, Forsling etc.... making some rookie mistakes but that’s to be expected. The biggest problem is Seabrook’s play and contract albatross.
- walleyeb1

Yes

Uhhh - SCHTICK, not stick.

Jeez....
- StLBravesFan

I call Ulf “Dirty Ulf” reflecting his placement in many polls that call him the most dirty or one of the most dirty players in NHL history. A player who other players said would try to end careers. Why the Hawks hired this classless person is beyond me.

Walleye1 breakaways and 2 on 1s that are easily created by easy open passes because a D-Man or both D-Man are too high up-ice are not blameable on the forwards. Whether I call him Ulf or Dirty Ulf doesn’t change the fact that the Hawks are a nightmare defensively because Samuelson is an awful coach. I guarantee you that there is dissension in the room and that Samuelson is despised by the players and Q and Dineen.

Bowman gets paid to make the right decisions. He is paid to be the expert and if he's not then he's useless to the team. Everybody knew what the economy was after 2007-2008 and no informed thinking person could reasonably expect massive raises in the salary cap to bail him out of ridiculously long overpaid contracts. Bowman is making all of us pay the price of that stupidity and now he needs to pay the price.
- Savoy

Since the inception of the salary cap Bowman is the only gm to have 3 rings? Correct me if I'm wrong? For the same team. What short memories we have, this instant gratification is unbelievable. I give Bowman till the new collective bargaining agreement to put us back on course, you know when most people lose money, when they panic, rush into things or let their emotions get in their way of making a rational decision.

Yes
- jhawk59

No

No
- Z3Hawk

2 on 1, Murphy's turn over is what lost the game last night, defenseman caught to deep, forwards are part of the problem, but not the entire problem

I'm a Q defender but you gotta shake your head at some of these personnel decisions. Except for the Vancouver game, the defence group had played reasonably well last few starts, not great but OK. So he decides last night to insert Rutta who was atrocious and play Murphy on his offside, sending Kempny to the pressbox so he could eat peanuts with Ryan Hartman who clearly had irritated Q with minor penalties in the last 2 games. But to insert Bouma in his place - how was that going to help?
- RickJ

On the 3rd line no less!! I'm not a Bouma detractor as much as most are here but given a role, coached to it the guy is willing and will carry out orders. But to spot start him in roles he's not capable of is akin to putting a 300lb man in centerfield then scratching a hole in your head when he can't get to balls in the gap.

And nice catch on Murphy. You healthy scratch him apparently cuz he ain't getting it then down the line play him on his offside.

What is the organIzational plan? Push back guys in the bottom 6 then 86 that 35 games in. Retool on the fly then you sit Forsberg for an ECHLer and healthy scratch a Murphy? ... These are valuable evaluation opportunities and some are wasted. NHL games are prime real estate not to be wasted. Can Forsberg handle being a #1 on the ice and off, between the ears? Don't know cuz a clearly can't handle the speed of this level ECHL guy is given his starts.

I wonder if management and Q even know the right questions to ask as far as a rebuild/retool is concerned while valuable NHL proving ground games are wasted.

I call Ulf “Dirty Ulf” reflecting his placement in many polls that call him the most dirty or one of the most dirty players in NHL history. A player who other players said would try to end careers. Why the Hawks hired this classless person is beyond me.

Walleye1 breakaways and 2 on 1s that are easily created by easy open passes because a D-Man or both D-Man are too high up-ice are not blameable on the forwards. Whether I call him Ulf or Dirty Ulf doesn’t change the fact that the Hawks are a nightmare defensively because Samuelson is an awful coach. I guarantee you that there is dissension in the room and that Samuelson is despised by the players and Q and Dineen.
- Z3Hawk

Fair enough, the system is set up to be aggressive understanding it will lead to odd man breaks. With Crow that ain't the worst system assuming you score. But when did Q change and throw out defense first? I watch the Gus', Forslings' and Rutta's look like forwards and think they make Daley look like a stay at home guy, a guy Q couldn't dog house enough, run out of town where he leaves and wins a cup the very same yr!!

What is the organIzational plan? Or are there two, Q's and StanBowPops&McD's?

I have previously asked how Bouma plays in front of anyone. I don’t enjoy criticizing players but Bouma is not an NHL player. For someone who must play physical hockey to bring something to the table he doesn’t even do that. It is also apparent that Bouma is simply not going to chip in offensively.

Wingels is another player with a limited skill package. I didn’t understand why Bowman signed either of them, in the off-season - it simply took opportunities away from others. Bowman also signed Sharp. Sharp has become a bit of a goat for the coaches. Whatever has ailed or ails the team it certainly wasn’t Sharp’s fault as his role has been relatively small. What sets Sharp apart from other options is he still possesses a scoring touch. Also must Hartman always be put in the doghouse. Q do you really think this is working? At least Hartman cares and attempts to play aggressively. You liked that so much about Shaw. Also if taking unnecessary, undisciplined penalties is your argument why hasn’t Toews been sat out?

Personnel decisions have been ridiculous. Rutta is not an NHL D-Man. He may not be an AHL D-Man. Oesterle falls into the same category. Neither have any idea what they should be doing in their own zone. Although Dirty Ulf obviously disagrees being able to play defence is still the priority for a D-Man. Also for heaven’s sake let’s try to play the D-Men on their proper sides.

Also for the rest of the season let Dirty Ulf help with UC Maintenance. I was going to say Security but Dirty Ulf is cowardly weak and can be easily knocked out - right Domi?
- Z3Hawk

I can live with Wingels because he does have some skill and versatility. However I see no purpose in playing Bouma. He came advertised as abrasive and as a good skater. To me he just flounders out there and displays no visible assets that benefit this team. One would think that as a former long time Flame, he would have been somewhat motivated last night. I hope we have now seen the last of him
Offer him up for a 7th round pick. If no one offers that send him down and give someone like Highmore a chance.

Uhhh - SCHTICK, not stick.

Jeez....
- StLBravesFan

Ok fine fixed it!

A guy can take only so many crosscheck's
- riozzo

You think Mark Messier gave a crap about that??

So three years into Toews' eight year deal he's done??

This has all the signs of someone who is more than happy to take his current contract as payment for services already rendered. The problem now is that the "we mean business going forward" schtick no longer has any credibility, and the Hawk PR machine seems to lack any alternative messaging for its fan base. Not coming up with a new narrative will sour people even more than just publicly admitting the team needs to be rebuilt.

The suggestion that we have a new "core" in the making with Schmaltz, Duclair, ADB and rest of the younger guys is a joke. They might be nice pieces to complement a core group of players, but any new core group has to have all star pedigree. Ain't no all stars in this recent group.

As long as our current core is either washed up, uninspired, upset, or some combination of the above, not only will we see more of the same, but the worse they play the even LESS likely they can be moved. No one is taking 7 or 19.

Honestly, if I were 88 or 50 I'd be begging for a trade.

Personally, I can't wait for the strike and the Seattle expansion. New rules with softer cap and buyouts? Then in a few years we may have something again.

The only thing that can be done now is to tank big time and get a high draft pick to kick the rebuild off with.

No
- Z3Hawk

Yes:

And it’s been going on all year: