Somebody should catch Bettman or anyone in the NHL office in an interview. Better yet of video feed. Corner them, be relentless then put it on the internet. Publicize the heck out of it. Imagine if someone with dollars aplenty could get the major Canadien daily newspapers to print a full page ad. It Wouldn't cost nearly as much as even only a few years ago since the newspapers and radio has been going down the drain with internet the reason why. Accountability, pressure. It could happen. Although truly more wishful thinking than reality
- jhawk59

Good god snowflake...........ask the players who r actually in the room including 88.

what does it mean and why is it necessary to "stand up for your team mate" after he is the recipient of a good clean hit which is part of the game?

3 guys jump hartman with cogliano (fresh off a suspension) coming in high with a stick to the face while the other two are attempting assault and hartman (correctly) refused to engage...

i know you and i will never agree...but the league would be better off to do away with staged fights...get it out of the game completely...the refs actually enforcing the rules...and throwing guys out..calling 5 min majors .. and heavy suspensions... in addition to having teams pay a price

in addition call the malicious cross checks to the head and back and reckless slashes, sticks are to be on the ice to get and have the puck not to be used as weapons...

none of this will ever happen because the nhl is run by a bunch of phony player safety neanderthals
- bogiedoc

This in a nutshell is what most likely ails Toews.

Who would watch that league? The nhl use to be close to basketball as the third sport in the US what are they now 5th? Mma and golf probably passing them buy.
I to think what cogliano did was cheap going in stick high but that's what you get when you don't have guys to control the game. Guys use there sticks way to much now a days. Manson and Kesler had the right approach with dropping the gloves who cares they ran into each other. If I got cheap shotted or laid out I wish I had tm to stand up for me.
And you say let the refs handle it and just fine everybody. That's what's wrong with today everybody wants someone else to do something and everything micromamaged. I agree with Mark Howe the games better when players police the game. If someone does a bertuzzi or mcsorley type incident then the league lays the hammer down.
- vandymeer23

we have some common ground here. so someone lays you out with a legitimate with in the rules clean check...you want your team mates to assault that player?

disagree.. its not micromangagement for the refs to call the game according to the stated rules...

someone flagrant fouls in an NBA game...well lets all pair off and let the two guys have had it for 30 seconds...ya know to bring energy to the game...

i don't know of one person who watches or enjoys the nhl game because of cheap shots and fights...i know many who can't stand to watch and will never be a fan because of stated cheap shots and fighting....maybe you hang with a different crows than I...

and if its such needed and required part of the game why not teach it and encouragement from mite and pee wee hockey all the way up...

And what staged fights do you speak of? There is no such thing but I'm sure you just assume it's when two guys go off the face off when that's not true.
Reason why players fight
1. Retribution for themselves or teammate
2. Energy To wake the team up get a spark going.
3. To keep there place. If your a new player trying to make a impression a guy trying to earn your stripes or keep your spot in the show.
- vandymeer23

how about a couple of weeks ago the in the ducks/kings game...3 post face off "fights" immediately at the start of the game...

they probably texted each other before the game...hey lets go..WWF on skates...nothing accomplished, didn't change a damn thing...had nothing to do with actual playing the game...wow so happy we got that out of our system; retribution, energized the crowd and we showed them...pure nonsense...

want to energize the crowd or your team mates...how about making a play, great saves, a good clean hit...

how about a couple of weeks ago the in the ducks/kings game...3 post face off "fights" immediately at the start of the game...

they probably texted each other before the game...hey lets go..WWF on skates...nothing accomplished, didn't change a damn thing...had nothing to do with actual playing the game...wow so happy we got that out of our system; retribution, energized the crowd and we showed them...pure nonsense...

want to energize the crowd or your team mates...how about making a play, great saves, a good clean hit...
- bogiedoc

I'll take a goal...maybe more than one or two...please.

we have some common ground here. so someone lays you out with a legitimate with in the rules clean check...you want your team mates to assault that player?

disagree.. its not micromangagement for the refs to call the game according to the stated rules...

someone flagrant fouls in an NBA game...well lets all pair off and let the two guys have had it for 30 seconds...ya know to bring energy to the game...

i don't know of one person who watches or enjoys the nhl game because of cheap shots and fights...i know many who can't stand to watch and will never be a fan because of stated cheap shots and fighting....maybe you hang with a different crows than I...

and if its such needed and required part of the game why not teach it and encouragement from mite and pee wee hockey all the way up...
- bogiedoc

To me, that's what's so maddening about NHL officiating. Hartman's hit was clean, 3 guys jumped him and he too ends up going to the box, for what exactly? At the very least, the Hawks should have had a 4 minute power play out of that, or more appropriately, a 5 on 3 for a full 2 minutes. By calling Manson for 4 and Hartman for 2, the refs are saying what Anaheim did the other night was the equivalent of the love taps around the hands that are now considered "slashing" and "hooking." SMH

This in a nutshell is what most likely ails Toews.
- eagle50

I have been suspicious of this sort of injury, past concussions or just something bodily related that has taken its toll on our captain. That he would shy away from physical contact can only mean there is an issue he has with physical contact. And I do not buy anything along the lines that someone - maybe his girlfriend or a reference by a professional health trained person - is totally why he choose to get faster and lighter instead of keeping his bulk strength. Sure, he has motivation to earn the big dollars fir which he has worked and suffered for over ten years. But his pride will overwhem him if following next season he can tell in his own mind that he is no where the player he once was. Then after collecting on some of that big contract, should a compliance buyout offer come he might just be willing.

Seabrook I think it is more to do with skating ability and not in best of shape/slowed down after many years of play and he was never more than average to below average skater anyway. His stride is not good, never was although he moves around ok for a big guy

To me, that's what's so maddening about NHL officiating. Hartman's hit was clean, 3 guys jumped him and he too ends up going to the box, for what exactly? At the very least, the Hawks should have had a 4 minute power play out of that, or more appropriately, a 5 on 3 for a full 2 minutes. By calling Manson for 4 and Hartman for 2, the refs are saying what Anaheim did the other night was the equivalent of the love taps around the hands that are now considered "slashing" and "hooking." SMH
- Davewn

Agree with what you say, but I am going to take it one step further, I said it before and I may sound like a Neanderthal, get rid of the instigator rule, let these guys police the game, several years ago what it was that way all the players would’ve looked at that hit is a good clean hockey hit and skate on, just like they would during the current playoffs, the referees need to call the games during the regular season like they do the playoffs, I love Dave Manson when he played and I like Josh , Wish she was a hawk, he is exactly what we need, and I think it’s terrible that when a player throws a good clean hit he has to fight, let the game be the game the way it was, and let the players police to game, I guarantee you a lot of that cheap stuff would stop, if they know they would have to answer the bell for the over-the-top crap. That is just my opinion.

There were reasons that Panarin was traded that went beyond his play on the ice. In the same way TT was not dedicated to the Hawks and hockey, Panarin acted similarly. I posted about this while Panarin was still with the team. When the Hawks got beat out in the First Round, in both seasons that Panarin was here, he couldn’t get back to Russia fast enough to play for Russia at the WCs. What was appalling is Panarin would be complaining about being tired after a long NHL season but would play lights out, high energy as soon as he got on the ice for Russia. After being eliminated by the Blues Panarin partied on the ice with Tarasenko as if he played for the Blues. Other Hawks’ player knew players on the Blues and nobody else acted this way. Being eliminated is supposed to sting - a lot.

Why do AA, Ovie and other European players speak English well? They care about it and take steps to learn English. Panarin could not have cared less. While some players take intensive courses to learn Panarin did nothing.

For those who are saying the Panarin/Saad trade is one of the worst Hawks’ trades of all time - get some objectivity. Hawks still win the trade in spite of Saad and the Hawks fighting it this year. Regarding Kane’s down play this year, it is not a question of not having Panarin, it is a question of Q refusing to give Kane a proper LW replacement. DeBrincat seems prototypically fit as a sniping Right-Handed LW and Q has refused to play him there. Has also refused to play Sharp there or Saad, for any length of time. Q has now decided Bouma should be Kane’s LW - Bouma - wonderful.

I don’t see Bouma being assigned as Crosby’s LW if Bouma was a Penguin.

Justin said: With all of this in mind, I'm hearing the Hawks are having a lot of closed-door meetings lately to figure out their next move. I'm sure there will be some screaming and some tense moments, but in the end, let's just hope that there are some smart decisions made to turn give this team the best chance to succeed moving forward.

I ask: Do you know who all is involved in those meetings?

Is it just Stan and his scouts and assistants?

Is / are Q and his staff involved with the GM group?

To ask the dangerous question, is McDonough involved?

I certainly hope it’s the middle grouping, not the first or the last.
- StLBravesFan

Not only is McD involved, but he is leading them and has the final vote before making a decision.

thats a fair point...but then the refs should be fired for officiating personalities instead of conduct...
- bogiedoc

Correct. Hartman's past has absolutely nothing to do with that horrendous on ice officiating.

Hartman's hit was 100% legal in everybody's opinion. Manson, Kesler and Cogliano took exception to it. That's their choice and YES, I wish we had a team that would take exception to that as well and stick up for their team mates no matter what the penalties are. It shows team togetherness and toughness. We have very little of both under Q's regimes. The fact that the Ducks got away with it just proves that point. Team, Team mate, Self !! Ever heard that before ?? (Navy Seals)

The NHL officiating is at its all time worst . Do we even know if the Blackhawks requested an explanation of that ridiculous call ??? It was a game changer, but regardless, not the point. The point being to make the right call, hence, creating the right atmosphere for future decisions on these incidents. What if Hartman was severely injured ?
Would the call have changed ????

The correct call should have been...
Manson - 2 minutes for instigating and 5 for fighting. Kesler - 2 minutes for 3rd man in and a game misconduct for such. Cogliano - 2 minutes for a 4th man in and a game misconduct for such.
Hartman - NO PENALTY !! Perfectly
legal hit.

AGAIN.....this was a game changing terrible call, or lack of it. This game had no significance and the refs blew an opportunity to make a statement for the GAME of hockey.

In my opinion, all 4 refs saw what happened and blew the call and they all should be repremanded accordingly !!
NEVER happen in the NHL.

A Total Disgrace !!

There were reasons that Panarin was traded that went beyond his play on the ice. In the same way TT was not dedicated to the Hawks and hockey, Panarin acted similarly. I posted about this while Panarin was still with the team. When the Hawks got beat out in the First Round, in both seasons that Panarin was here, he couldn’t get back to Russia fast enough to play for Russia at the WCs. What was appalling is Panarin would be complaining about being tired after a long NHL season but would play lights out, high energy as soon as he got on the ice for Russia. After being eliminated by the Blues Panarin partied on the ice with Tarasenko as if he played for the Blues. Other Hawks’ player knew players on the Blues and nobody else acted this way. Being eliminated is supposed to sting - a lot.

Why do AA, Ovie and other European players speak English well? They care about it and take steps to learn English. Panarin could not have cared less. While some players take intensive courses to learn Panarin did nothing.

For those who are saying the Panarin/Saad trade is one of the worst Hawks’ trades of all time - get some objectivity. Hawks still win the trade in spite of Saad and the Hawks fighting it this year. Regarding Kane’s down play this year, it is not a question of not having Panarin, it is a question of Q refusing to give Kane a proper LW replacement. DeBrincat seems prototypically fit as a sniping Right-Handed LW and Q has refused to play him there. Has also refused to play Sharp there or Saad, for any length of time. Q has now decided Bouma should be Kane’s LW - Bouma - wonderful.

I don’t see Bouma being assigned as Crosby’s LW if Bouma was a Penguin.
- Z3Hawk

Good insight here.

Other: r u still still headstrong about Samuelson and not seeing it is a lot to do with the players if they can execute. I wrote in response to your rift on Samuelson coaching, namely, the type of play he wants to see from the defensemen. I then invited you to rank the guys y ok like, or dislike the least as future third pair and depth dmen for next season. I pointed out that I was not going to respond to your ranking; in fact I might even agree with your ranking. Being keenly on top of the players, I thought you would be up to rank by them

Correct. Hartman's past has absolutely nothing to do with that horrendous on ice officiating.

Hartman's hit was 100% legal in everybody's opinion. Manson, Kesler and Cogliano took exception to it. That's their choice and YES, I wish we had a team that would take exception to that as well and stick up for their team mates no matter what the penalties are. It shows team togetherness and toughness. We have very little of both under Q's regimes. The fact that the Ducks got away with it just proves that point. Team, Team mate, Self !! Ever heard that before ?? (Navy Seals)

The NHL officiating is at its all time worst . Do we even know if the Blackhawks requested an explanation of that ridiculous call ??? It was a game changer, but regardless, not the point. The point being to make the right call, hence, creating the right atmosphere for future decisions on these incidents. What if Hartman was severely injured ?
Would the call have changed ????

The correct call should have been...
Manson - 2 minutes for instigating and 5 for fighting. Kesler - 2 minutes for 3rd man in and a game misconduct for such. Cogliano - 2 minutes for a 4th man in and a game misconduct for such.
Hartman - NO PENALTY !! Perfectly
legal hit.

AGAIN.....this was a game changing terrible call, or lack of it. This game had no significance and the refs blew an opportunity to make a statement for the GAME of hockey.

In my opinion, all 4 refs saw what happened and blew the call and they all should be repremanded accordingly !!
NEVER happen in the NHL.

A Total Disgrace !!
- Hawkytalk

But the good news is that it helped lead to a loss/no points--so closer to a higher draft pick

Not only is McD involved, but he is leading them and has the final vote before making a decision.
- ElkgroveMcD

Conjecture on your part - or sourced?

Just askin’

Correct. Hartman's past has absolutely nothing to do with that horrendous on ice officiating.

Hartman's hit was 100% legal in everybody's opinion. Manson, Kesler and Cogliano took exception to it. That's their choice and YES, I wish we had a team that would take exception to that as well and stick up for their team mates no matter what the penalties are. It shows team togetherness and toughness. We have very little of both under Q's regimes. The fact that the Ducks got away with it just proves that point. Team, Team mate, Self !! Ever heard that before ?? (Navy Seals)

The NHL officiating is at its all time worst . Do we even know if the Blackhawks requested an explanation of that ridiculous call ??? It was a game changer, but regardless, not the point. The point being to make the right call, hence, creating the right atmosphere for future decisions on these incidents. What if Hartman was severely injured ?
Would the call have changed ????

The correct call should have been...
Manson - 2 minutes for instigating and 5 for fighting. Kesler - 2 minutes for 3rd man in and a game misconduct for such. Cogliano - 2 minutes for a 4th man in and a game misconduct for such.
Hartman - NO PENALTY !! Perfectly
legal hit.

AGAIN.....this was a game changing terrible call, or lack of it. This game had no significance and the refs blew an opportunity to make a statement for the GAME of hockey.

In my opinion, all 4 refs saw what happened and blew the call and they all should be repremanded accordingly !!
NEVER happen in the NHL.

A Total Disgrace !!
- Hawkytalk

I was waiting for Q and his staff to jump all over those calls/ non-calls but they have become just as laid back as the lineup they put on the ice.
If you are going to field a soft team, at least stand up for your players when they are being unjustly treated by the officials.

I was waiting for Q and his staff to jump all over those calls/ non-calls but they have become just as laid back as the lineup they put on the ice.
If you are going to field a soft team, at least stand up for your players when they are being unjustly treated by the officials.
- 67hawks

The Old Q would have been screaming and yelling at the refs. The new Q is just waiting for the Saturday in April when it all ends.

He's having a down year. But he's proven to be good without the almighty panarin. What has Panarin ever done without Kane? Not even in top 30 in scoring.
- PatShart

Panarin is 47th with 46 points.

Not only is McD involved, but he is leading them and has the final vote before making a decision.
- ElkgroveMcD

Just curious how you know this to be true.

I was waiting for Q and his staff to jump all over those calls/ non-calls but they have become just as laid back as the lineup they put on the ice.
If you are going to field a soft team, at least stand up for your players when they are being unjustly treated by the officials.
- 67hawks

There has been a very disconcerting passivity, lack of urgency, and general resignation to the suck that this season has become from every level of leadership within the organization, from the front office, to the coaching staff, to the veteran core. Going into next season without significant changes is a recipe for more of the same moving forward. While this team has well documented on ice deficiencies, it also seems to be a really complacent one.

Not only is McD involved, but he is leading them and has the final vote before making a decision.
- ElkgroveMcD

This is true.

I can back up Elkgrove here.

McD runs the show and makes the final call. He does rely on his inner circle obviously a lot in hockey decisions but he's always looking at it from his side (business/marketing) which can be a problem.

This is also why the Hawks aren't able to move quickly on decisions as it has to go all the way up to McD and he vets it wkth the hockey people... the turnaround can be slow at times.

There were reasons that Panarin was traded that went beyond his play on the ice. In the same way TT was not dedicated to the Hawks and hockey, Panarin acted similarly. I posted about this while Panarin was still with the team. When the Hawks got beat out in the First Round, in both seasons that Panarin was here, he couldn’t get back to Russia fast enough to play for Russia at the WCs. What was appalling is Panarin would be complaining about being tired after a long NHL season but would play lights out, high energy as soon as he got on the ice for Russia. After being eliminated by the Blues Panarin partied on the ice with Tarasenko as if he played for the Blues. Other Hawks’ player knew players on the Blues and nobody else acted this way. Being eliminated is supposed to sting - a lot.

Why do AA, Ovie and other European players speak English well? They care about it and take steps to learn English. Panarin could not have cared less. While some players take intensive courses to learn Panarin did nothing.

For those who are saying the Panarin/Saad trade is one of the worst Hawks’ trades of all time - get some objectivity. Hawks still win the trade in spite of Saad and the Hawks fighting it this year. Regarding Kane’s down play this year, it is not a question of not having Panarin, it is a question of Q refusing to give Kane a proper LW replacement. DeBrincat seems prototypically fit as a sniping Right-Handed LW and Q has refused to play him there. Has also refused to play Sharp there or Saad, for any length of time. Q has now decided Bouma should be Kane’s LW - Bouma - wonderful.

I don’t see Bouma being assigned as Crosby’s LW if Bouma was a Penguin.
- Z3Hawk

Debrincat with Kane would be the nuclear option and won't happen until the Hawks are dowm 3 games to 1 in the playoffs as Q must be Q.

This is true.

I can back up Elkgrove here.

McD runs the show and makes the final call. He does rely on his inner circle obviously a lot in hockey decisions but he's always looking at it from his side (business/marketing) which can be a problem.

This is also why the Hawks aren't able to move quickly on decisions as it has to go all the way up to McD and he vets it wkth the hockey people... the turnaround can be slow at times.
- Justin Lowe

Stan, breathless: "Chevy's offering Scheifele, Trouba and a first for Jonny but we have to do it NOW!"

McD: "Whoa there chief, have you seen how many 19 jerseys we've been selling? What about the Chevrolet commercials? Sorry kid, cool your jets, can't do it without talking to my marketing people..."

The Old Q would have been screaming and yelling at the refs. The new Q is just waiting for the Saturday in April when it all ends.
- TJYTJY

Screaming and yelling at the refs should have been the on-ice occurrence yes....but an incident like this is so darn flagrant that blackhawks management should have raised holy hell for the sake of the future of the GAME. Absolutely No reason for HoHum complacency from our organizational leadership group.

Maybe they did though, who knows.
It would be nice to know though that somebody up there gives a darn.

this capitals team is very beatable 3-2-2 last 7 and have given up a lot of goals; but the hawks never seem to rise up and beat them in regular season...they never win DC...every 3 years eke out a win @ home.

Hawks cant score nor defend a lead; they beat themselves with unforced and I believe lead the league in odd mans against.

keep this up vs the caps = happy 9th loss in a row...

this capitals team is very beatable 3-2-2 last 7 and have given up a lot of goals; but the hawks never seem to rise up and beat them in regular season...they never win DC...every 3 years eke out a win @ home.

Hawks cant score nor defend a lead; they beat themselves with unforced and I believe lead the league in odd mans against.

keep this up vs the caps = happy 9th loss in a row...
- bogiedoc

#TankingStateOfMind