But what is the "legal" retirement? Is there a loophole that satates "only if a player signs retirement paper"? Bettman is not that smart! We all know it.
- powerenforcer

Yeah there's paperwork to be filled out with the league and NHLPA in order to officially retire and collect a pension (if you're entitled to one. Must play at least 400 games.)

Not true - NAshville had exclusive rights to sign him, since he did not sign retirement papers. That is my point, he didn't retire!
- powerenforcer

Yeah he didn't retire... and Nashville only had "exclusive rights" in the sense that it was the only team he wanted to play for.

Dude was a UFA. Technically could have signed with anyone because he technically didn't retire.

I think for Sikura - Tavares and others Florida is looking a viable option

A good young team that is getting better
- no pressure-
- no state tax
- good young coach
-solid owner with $$$$
-solid GM
- Colbyboy

That is a situation where it has to be cut off. I want teams to retain rights but in baseball players get drafted sometimes two or three times. Why not make teams have to draft a player who has not signed. And give the original draft choice spot back to his team who originally drafted him. Of course in a later draft year....so Penguins redraft him...they also are penalized for grabbing a player another team cannot resign because maybe every player prefers dominantly the same teams each year after year. So penguins would give back a 6th round if signed before draft or a 6th 2019 if after draft he signs.

All this to penalize players and teams from grabbing most of the players someone originally drafted.

That is a situation where it has to be cut off. I want teams to retain rights but in baseball players get drafted sometimes two or three times. Why not make teams have to draft a player who has not signed. And give the original draft choice spot back to his team who originally drafted him. Of course in a later draft year....so Penguins redraft him...they also are penalized for grabbing a player another team cannot resign because maybe every pplayer prefers dominantly the same teams each year after year. So penguins would give back a 6th round if signed before draft or a 6th 2019 if after drsft he signs.

All this to penalize players and teams from grabbing most of the players someone originally drafted.
- jhawk59

This sounds way more complicated than it needs to be.

Just get rid of the Draft.

Hossa's contract was legit under the CBA in which it was signed but the league didn't have an issue punishing the Hawks (and other teams) when the new CBA was signed. LTIR is evaluated on an annual basis, the league could easily go back on their word again and not allow the Hawks to place Hossa on LTIR.
- DarthKane

Neither did the NHLPA.

Being part of the league structure, Rocky and McD apparently had no problem with it either.

But what is the "legal" retirement? Is there a loophole that satates "only if a player signs retirement paper"? Bettman is not that smart! We all know it.
- powerenforcer

Seems to me - if a player doesn't sign retirement papers - he's still an active player - and his full cap hit counts toward the cap.

Of course, they could put him on waivers and assign him to Rockford - but that only saves them $900,000, or something like that.

When I reflect on last night's game, if CC was in net we win. 2 5 hole goals should of been stopped. 1st PP goal Toews did a poor job of blocking. The young forwards like Jurco chasing the puck instead of being aware of where Pietro was last night to tie the game. Amazing how the little things are now costing the Hawks games instead of winning them.
- BetweenTheDots

If CC was in and the games meant something, guys like Jurco would not be dressed and we probably would have won that game.

Hossa's contract was legit under the CBA in which it was signed but the league didn't have an issue punishing the Hawks (and other teams) when the new CBA was signed. LTIR is evaluated on an annual basis, the league could easily go back on their word again and not allow the Hawks to place Hossa on LTIR.
- DarthKane

Hossa could then potentially be forced back because of his loyalty to the team, get sick, and sue the NHL too.

No kidding on that last comment.... Tony Granato would make a lot of sense!

rutta, gustafsson, and oesterle are already in the "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" age bracket. they are as good as they ever will be defensively and that is definitely not good enough to play regular minutes above a third pairing. especially on a cup contending team. forsling still young, but i have players on my girls u-14 soccer team who are tougher than he is. no matter what they do with this guy he will always be pushed around in front of his own net. keith has declined from an elite #1 dman to a good/very good (if he has a real partner) #1 dman. they do not have a #2, #3, or #4 dman. seabrook was a warrior, but is deteriorating before our eyes. murphy can't skate well enough to be a top 4 dman, which makes him a player who is grossly overpaid and over extended on a contract for a third pairing guy. none of these college or juniors guys are going to be "250 game" guys for at least four years.

the best option for this team is to trade kane, toews, crawford and keith and start over. by the time the defense on this team is of a quality to compete on a cup contending team level those guys will be on the downslide as seabrook is now.

they are in nhl hell. just good enough to make the playoffs with crawford
and then to be bounced in the first round. not bad enough to get a draft pick where a toews, kane, or keith is available. and a gm who wasn't able to add to the core that talon as director of player development, assistant gm, and gm left in his lap. oduya is the only top four dman bowman has added in almost nine years at the helm. the only two stellar offensive players he has acquired, panarin and terraveinen, he wasn't able to keep because of the horrid contracts he has given to bickell, anisimov, kruger, panik, and seabrook.

it is time for the next version of the blackhawks. out with bowman and quenneville and in with a new vision. and it is also time for that quack mc donough to move over to director of sales, not president of the operation. they need a hockey guy at the top running things. let's see what a genius mc donough is if this slide continues. any idiot can sell seats to a wonderfully exciting team like the hawks have been. it won't be so easy with the current product. the aftermarket has collapsed. season ticket holders are getting killed on the tickets they can't use.

I think for Sikura - Tavares and others Florida is looking a viable option

A good young team that is getting better
- no pressure-
- no state tax
- good young coach
-solid owner with $$$$
-solid GM
- Colbyboy

I'd laugh if Uncle Dale swooped in and did that! Panthers are going to be on the come, now that ownership straightened out the front office .this idiot here is slowly turning this back to the Mike Smith era.

I think for Sikura - Tavares and others Florida is looking a viable option

A good young team that is getting better
- no pressure-
- no state tax
- good young coach
-solid owner with $$$$
-solid GM
- Colbyboy

For about the tenth time the FL state tax is minimal at best. its a delta of 5% on less than 50% of his income. So on 2.8M its roughly 70,000.

Neither did the NHLPA.

Being part of the league structure, Rocky and McD apparently had no problem with it either.
- StLBravesFan

Just wondering, is this fact? You are making it sound like all teams were in agreement with this? Could it be that they were against it, but were just out-voted?

For about the tenth time the FL state tax is minimal at best. its a delta of 5% on less than 50% of his income. So on 2.8M its roughly 70,000.
- riozzo

70K is actually a nice wage for many. .... outside of that, in Fla you'd be paying higher sales tax...so when Rich Sportsguy buys his yacht or Lamborghini look out. If it was all about the local taxes then no one would ever want to play in Canada. When you're THAT rich it really makes no difference, you just want to live somewhere nice. Local taxes are just something some like to complain about until they need a first responder, someone to patch a pothole, or a teacher.

Just wondering, is this fact? You are making it sound like all teams were in agreement with this? Could it be that they were against it, but were just out-voted?
- powerenforcer

https://en.wikipedia.org/...tive_Bargaining_Agreement

The NHL team owners (Rocky included) agreed to it in 2010. I don't know if it was by simple majority or a unanimous decision but, it was agreed to. I'm not sure what more facts you want?

Just wondering, is this fact? You are making it sound like all teams were in agreement with this? Could it be that they were against it, but were just out-voted?
- powerenforcer

Certainly speculating more than absolute knowledge - I just don't remember any comments by either of the top Hawk management team about an issue that directly and adversely affecting their franchise. I should have made that clear - my error in not doing so.

But it seems to me that had had one of the major faces of the league objected enough, the provision would never have been included in the CBA.

Again - just speculation.

Hossa's contract was legit under the CBA in which it was signed but the league didn't have an issue punishing the Hawks (and other teams) when the new CBA was signed. LTIR is evaluated on an annual basis, the league could easily go back on their word again and not allow the Hawks to place Hossa on LTIR.
- DarthKane

No they really can't especially since he's on LTIR already, besides doctors word is final, cough cough Pronger

If you guys don't want Oesterle, we can take him back. In a heartbeat.

70K is actually a nice wage for many. .... outside of that, in Fla you'd be paying higher sales tax...so when Rich Sportsguy buys his yacht or Lamborghini look out. If it was all about the local taxes then no one would ever want to play in Canada. When you're THAT rich it really makes no difference, you just want to live somewhere nice. Local taxes are just something some like to complain about until they need a first responder, someone to patch a pothole, or a teacher.
- kwolf68

That "Use" tax will kill you down there

Hossa's contract was legit under the CBA in which it was signed but the league didn't have an issue punishing the Hawks (and other teams) when the new CBA was signed. LTIR is evaluated on an annual basis, the league could easily go back on their word again and not allow the Hawks to place Hossa on LTIR.
- DarthKane

Simply can’t happen. Hossa was qualified he will remain qualified. There is no doubt that the LTIR terms are cumbersome and there may be changes at some point but you don’t retroactively apply new legal terms. Additionally, Hossa qualified medically - this does not seem like an attackable area.

There is a reason there is a CBA. Who cares what the GMs may talk about? The GMs can discuss whatever they want. The GMs could discuss Max Term too of 7 and 8 - so what, they can’t unilaterally do anything about it.

If you guys don't want Oesterle, we can take him back. In a heartbeat.
- EdmHockeyMan

Take him, he's yours.

Certainly speculating more than absolute knowledge - I just don't remember any comments by either of the top Hawk management team about an issue that directly and adversely affecting their franchise. I should have made that clear - my error in not doing so.

But it seems to me that had had one of the major faces of the league objected enough, the provision would never have been included in the CBA.

Again - just speculation.
- StLBravesFan

Doubtful. We're talking about a room full of old rich guys. They're not typically ones for deferring based on who's team is doing better at that moment.

Take him, he's yours.
- DarthKane

Air fare is 372 on west jet, put me down for 20 to ship him out.

Air fare is 372 on west jet, put me down for 20 to ship him out.
- riozzo

West Jet is too expensive, we can fly him via Swoop outta here!

If you guys don't want Oesterle, we can take him back. In a heartbeat.
- EdmHockeyMan

Have you seen him play as a Hawk?