Why?
Effective elination of a problem is disturbing?
How so?
- IonSabres

It's not really, you can't cover everywhere at once. We had a kid try and kill another with a hockey stick, thankfully it was just a light aluminum shaft but he hit the kid 4 or 5 times in the head right in the middle of class, and the cops were nowhere near the gym. If the kid had a gun he could've had an entire gym class dead, they had nowhere to go, the doors that led outside were always locked.

They're not there to eliminate problems, they're there somewhat for a psychological deterrent, but someone who's motivated wouldn't care about being shot, at least at first, especially if they were planning on killing themselves, and taking a day or 2 to observe their rounds and you could maximize your carnage.

I'm not saying we shouldn't have armed police in schools. I'm saying we're foolish if we think they're going to stop anything from happening. They're there solely for when the poop hits the fan.

Fitz, sorry...I am 100% on that side.
Rather than let’s Eli irate guns...how about we address the issue head on, find a reasonable solution to protection through inspection.
It isn’t selfish, it is completely reasonable.
The weapon isn’t the issue, it is the crazies.
Address the crazies.
- IonSabres

But no one (other than the wackos u apparent talk to) is trying to ELIMINATE ALL GUNS

THATS NOT REALITY
Yet it’s all u keep focusing on

So then it happens at the football game on a Friday night instead
Come on man
- jdfitz77

Nope, police on the perimeter and metal detectors at entrances and exits...come on man.

How did I make a zombie apocalypse reference? The idea that a government would have to fight and kill (and not reanimate corpses) people that it is trying to put under its thumb as well as casualties on its own side essentially wiping out a population isn't zombie theory. It's set to detract the government from doing this because it will have no one to govern if every one is gone. Put down CoD, your the only one talking zombies.
- SDSabre

Bc in the real world...
a zombie apocalypse isn’t gonna happen
Just like a Gov’t takeover isn’t gonna happen

Seriously dude...

Bc in the real world...
a zombie apocalypse isn’t gonna happen
Just like a Gov’t takeover isn’t gonna happen

Seriously dude...
- jdfitz77

They're... uh... already in power?

Nope, police on the perimeter and metal detectors at entrances and exits...come on man.
- RhinoFan

It’s not the Bills stadium dude
Most high school football stadiums are just bleachers next to the field

There’s not a wall around the place to protect it from Grizzly Bear attacks

Why do people in the U.S. talk about the government like it's some sort of separate entity? You are responsible for your own government. You ARE the only strength the government has.
- BINGO!

Nah, bro, it's all about the Bilderbergs and Rothschilds, the UN and the New World Order, Skull and Bones, Hologram Moon, hollow Earth. Black helicopters too.

An AR-15 is not an automatic weapon. So if you're asking why I need a semi automatic weapon to defend myself, the reasons are abundant. I think what you mean is, "why do you need a fully automatic weapon" which I don't and I don't own any. Those are illegal and have been for many years.
- RhinoFan

Ok, I’ll rephrase...

Why do u need a gun that can be modified to kill a large amount of ppl in seconds?

That's not entirely true. It's real expensive to buy them, but they are far from illegal. Especially antique/relic guns. The first M-16s from Vietnam are now part of that. I think it's 50 years from date of manufacture. You need a special license and a poopload of money, but they're not totally illegal.

But I digress.

As far as the metal detectors and other deterrents. Money, mainly. That poop costs money, and you have to constantly calibrate metal detectors, and you have to pay someone to operate it which is more money that most districts don't have. And bullet resistant glass wouldn't work everywhere, it would have to be pretty damn thick to stop, let's say a .30-06 which would be the most powerful round that you'd really have to concern yourself with, and even that's a step up. .308 would be the most likely higher than .223 that would be used, they wouldn't be able to open, as that would defeat the purpose, and not every school has A/C which would make for absolutely miserable classes.
- Wetbandit1

So, let me get this then...is the confiscation of 300,000,000 known guns, and maybe what 3,000,000 illegal guns assumed to be free?
Ya, I don’t think so either.

Let’s stop beating around the bush.

If the intent is to protect our citizens at high risk, then let’s do so through a multipoint solution.
If the intent is to disarm America...(frank) you and everyone who thinks like that.

Let’s get real.
A)If a gun owned by you is used in a crime of any manner, then you get the death penalty. Lock you damn guns up, and lock up your ammo too. It is your responsibility to which there is no excuse.
B)Let’s protect our schools...hey, legalize dope and tax the (frank) out of it...use the taxes to pay for the modifications to include
-Metal detectors
-bullet proof glass
-Armed guards to enable fast response to reduce casualties
-doors with appropriate locks
-safe zones inside rooms , like an oversized, concrete block area
C) Aggressive background checks
D) Mental evaluations and counseling for high risk individuals

Time to stop f’ing around...let’s get real.

You take away my rights...(frank) you, discussion over.

They're... uh... already in power?
- BINGO!

Exactly
And the 1% already has what it wants...
ALL THE WEALTH

They don’t care about your sh!tty house
They have million dollar mansions

It’s not the Bills stadium dude
Most high school football stadiums are just bleachers next to the field

There’s not a wall around the place to protect it from Grizzly Bear attacks
- jdfitz77

Everyone I've been to has a fence. We would certainly be beefing up security in all areas if I was dictator for a day.

I understand that it's easiest to place the blame on the firearms, but it really is nonsense. There is absolutely no difference between an AR-15 and most semi-auto hunting rifles other than aesthetics. It's another ploy by the phonies running our government to give you a false sense of security and make you believe they are trying to take action on gun violence.

An AR-15 is not an automatic weapon. So if you're asking why I need a semi automatic weapon to defend myself, the reasons are abundant. I think what you mean is, "why do you need a fully automatic weapon" which I don't and I don't own any. Those are illegal and have been for many years.
- RhinoFan

I'm not against them, let's get that out of the way.


If you think a rifle is a good self defense weapon. Then you don't really care about over-penetration and plain missing your target. Unless you're using frangibles that breakup on impact, that shot that goes through the bad guy is also going to go through your wall into your neighbor's house as well. And if you miss(you will) it'll go that much farther.

I already said it once, automatic weapons are not illegal. They're just hard to acquire.

damn, sorry I tried to encourage him to finish something and get a degree
- homiedclown

So, let me get this then...is the confiscation of 300,000,000 known guns, and maybe what 3,000,000 illegal guns assumed to be free?
Ya, I don’t think so either.

Let’s stop beating around the bush.

If the intent is to protect our citizens at high risk, then let’s do so through a multipoint solution.
If the intent is to disarm America...(frank) you and everyone who thinks like that.

Let’s get real.
A)If a gun owned by you is used in a crime of any manner, then you get the death penalty. Lock you damn guns up, and lock up your ammo too. It is your responsibility to which there is no excuse.
B)Let’s protect our schools...hey, legalize dope and tax the (frank) out of it...use the taxes to pay for the modifications to include
-Metal detectors
-bullet proof glass
-Armed guards to enable fast response to reduce casualties
-doors with appropriate locks
-safe zones inside rooms , like an oversized, concrete block area
C) Aggressive background checks
D) Mental evaluations and counseling for high risk individuals

Time to stop f’ing around...let’s get real.

You take away my rights...(frank) you, discussion over.
- IonSabres

Pretty sure you quoted the wrong post.

It's not really, you can't cover everywhere at once. We had a kid try and kill another with a hockey stick, thankfully it was just a light aluminum shaft but he hit the kid 4 or 5 times in the head right in the middle of class, and the cops were nowhere near the gym. If the kid had a gun he could've had an entire gym class dead, they had nowhere to go, the doors that led outside were always locked.

They're not there to eliminate problems, they're there somewhat for a psychological deterrent, but someone who's motivated wouldn't care about being shot, at least at first, especially if they were planning on killing themselves, and taking a day or 2 to observe their rounds and you could maximize your carnage.

I'm not saying we shouldn't have armed police in schools. I'm saying we're foolish if we think they're going to stop anything from happening. They're there solely for when the poop hits the fan.
- Wetbandit1

They are there to r3duce the response time from 20-30 minutes to 5...thereby reducing the number of victims.
No, we can’t eliminate...we can however reduce.

Oh, aluminum hockey’s sticks and baseball bats should be regulated.
(Obviously meant for dramatic purposes)

But no one (other than the wackos u apparent talk to) is trying to ELIMINATE ALL GUNS

THATS NOT REALITY
Yet it’s all u keep focusing on
- jdfitz77

I suggest you get out and find these social media sights ... it is rappant, not limited

They are there to r3duce the response time from 20-30 minutes to 5...thereby reducing the number of victims.
No, we can’t eliminate...we can however reduce.

Oh, aluminum hockey’s sticks and baseball bats should be regulated.
(Obviously meant for dramatic purposes)
- IonSabres

That's exactly what I said. They're there for when the poop hits the fan.

So, let me get this then...is the confiscation of 300,000,000 known guns, and maybe what 3,000,000 illegal guns assumed to be free?
Ya, I don’t think so either.

Let’s stop beating around the bush.

If the intent is to protect our citizens at high risk, then let’s do so through a multipoint solution.
If the intent is to disarm America...(frank) you and everyone who thinks like that.

Let’s get real.
A)If a gun owned by you is used in a crime of any manner, then you get the death penalty. Lock you damn guns up, and lock up your ammo too. It is your responsibility to which there is no excuse.
B)Let’s protect our schools...hey, legalize dope and tax the (frank) out of it...use the taxes to pay for the modifications to include
-Metal detectors
-bullet proof glass
-Armed guards to enable fast response to reduce casualties
-doors with appropriate locks
-safe zones inside rooms , like an oversized, concrete block area
C) Aggressive background checks
D) Mental evaluations and counseling for high risk individuals

Time to stop f’ing around...let’s get real.

You take away my rights...(frank) you, discussion over.
- IonSabres

A,B,C,D... all good ideas

But in addition...
why is it a bad idea to get rid of weapons that can be modified to kill dozens of ppl in seconds?
Not get rid of ALL guns
Just the ones that are being used (or can be used) to commit these kinds of mass shootings


No one is trying to takeaway your pump action shotgun
Or the typical hand gun

Everyone I've been to has a fence. We would certainly be beefing up security in all areas if I was dictator for a day.

I understand that it's easiest to place the blame on the firearms, but it really is nonsense. There is absolutely no difference between an AR-15 and most semi-auto hunting rifles other than aesthetics. It's another ploy by the phonies running our government to give you a false sense of security and make you believe they are trying to take action on gun violence.
- RhinoFan

And why can’t we make hunting rifles that u can’t modify that turns into a weapon that can kill dozens of ppl in seconds?

Still waiting for this answer
Which I’ve posed many times

Bc in the real world...
a zombie apocalypse isn’t gonna happen
Just like a Gov’t takeover isn’t gonna happen

Seriously dude...
- jdfitz77

Because the amount of history in so many other countries in the past is staggering with government takeovers.. And I don't know of one actual zombie. So a lot of things that have happened in the past versus something that has never happened.

A,B,C,D... all good ideas

But in addition...
why is it a bad idea to get rid of weapons that can be modified to kill dozens of ppl in seconds?
Not get rid of ALL guns
Just the ones that are being used (or can be used) to commit these kinds of mass shootings


No one is trying to takeaway your pump action shotgun
Or the typical hand gun
- jdfitz77

I'm in favor of holding people responsible for irresponsible ownership, but... the death penalty? That one shouldn't exist at all.

I suggest you get out and find these social media sights ... it is rappant, not limited
- IonSabres

Again...
basing it off the crazies on either side just isn’t reality
They’re just making noise

I’m not for eliminating all guns

If u wanna continue to act like that’s the kind of reform we are talking about,
then you’re literally just ignoring what we all are saying

Because the amount of history in so many other countries in the past is staggering with government takeovers.. And I don't know of one actual zombie. So a lot of things that have happened in the past versus something that has never happened.
- SDSabre

Well u already admitted there’s nothing u can do to stop a govt takeover other than “make a dent”
So this whole line of thought is just nonsense either way

Again...
the 1% (govt) already has all the wealth
What exactly do u think they’re gonna take over?

I'm in favor of holding people responsible for irresponsible ownership, but... the death penalty? That one shouldn't exist at all.
- BINGO!

I just didn’t want to argue the fine points of his statement
It was mostly reasonable & things that should be done for sure

Thanks for the discussion gents.
You are all good folks with different views.
I wish our country could have an honest discourse on this and other matters...as I think many opinions are valid and would lead us to a solution.

Also, I would like for our country to also recognize the opioid epidemic and address it as well...so sad what is going on there.

I am stopping my participation going forth as I sense I hav3 reached the end of a reasonable discussion

Now, should we trade ROR or not?