Is it? You need 2 2nd pairing D-Men, and that's ~$4M each, so you've got ~$8M of your windfall taken up, Dahlin, let's be conservative and say ~$5.5M on a bridge, Mittelstadt ~$4M on a bridge, you're going to have to pay a goalie ~$4M unless UPL is ready, and all the kids you have in the lineup will probably at least double their money. You can't have that top-heavy of a roster for long, especially when the guys at the bottom are all 2 years from getting, if not "big" deals, much more than they're currently making. And all the other guys you want to bring in are all totally unproven.
You can't have your top 6 forwards making 54% of the cap. The Caps won last year with their top 6(including the best scorer this generation) making ~46% and also the criminally underpaid Carlson. The Pens won with their top 6 making 52%, but they also have the best player of the generation and maybe the third best player of the generation, plus a top 5-7 scorer in Kessel. It's just not feasible to tie that much money at the top of the roster without having someone being way underpaid, or having the best players in a generation taking up said chunk. - Wetbandit1
It makes no sense. He knows it. Everyone knows it. He kept two players he loves, added another he loves and pretends it works and makes sense. It's ill-conceived this year, next year, and every year after. It's really a GMTM plan, damn the future and take your shot now....as if this defense/goaltending can contend for a cup.
Is it? You need 2 2nd pairing D-Men, and that's ~$4M each, so you've got ~$8M of your windfall taken up, Dahlin, let's be conservative and say ~$5.5M on a bridge, Mittelstadt ~$4M on a bridge, you're going to have to pay a goalie ~$4M unless UPL is ready, and all the kids you have in the lineup will probably at least double their money. You can't have that top-heavy of a roster for long, especially when the guys at the bottom are all 2 years from getting, if not "big" deals, much more than they're currently making. And all the other guys you want to bring in are all totally unproven.
You can't have your top 6 forwards making 54% of the cap. The Caps won last year with their top 6(including the best scorer this generation) making ~46% and also the criminally underpaid Carlson. The Pens won with their top 6 making 52%, but they also have the best player of the generation and maybe the third best player of the generation, plus a top 5-7 scorer in Kessel. It's just not feasible to tie that much money at the top of the roster without having someone being way underpaid, or having the best players in a generation taking up said chunk. - Wetbandit1
Fine... I’ll do anothe Cap Friendly lineup for a few year
But just quickly
Guhle & Pilut won’t be making 4mil each,
more like 4mil total
McCabe’s contract won’t ever go up much,
bc he doesn’t score
6 & 7 defensemen of Borgen & Nelson also won’t ever cost much
Neither will our goalies
Hutton if re-signed, Ullmark on 2nd contract, UPL on his ELC
It's not going to nearly counteract what we'd hope would be new deals for the kids. Even if it goes up $5M each year for the next 2(Seattle will add a nice bump). If Dahlin is as advertised he's going to get at least $8M. You don't (frank) around on a bridge for that kind of player, just ask Montreal. Mittelstadt, let's just say $6.5M on a longterm deal. That's already -$4.5M. I used lesser deals as bridge deals, but you don't want to do that with players who prove themselves. You're just going to end up trying to get rid of ROR and Kane so that the kids can step up, and you're not going to get more for ROR in 2 years, and not many teams can take on 5 years of $7M for a winger who scores 25 goals a year and provides no assists other than by accident(I like Kane but he's overpaid). - Wetbandit1
I’ll do it based on your numbers,
which seem reasonable to me
Fine... I’ll do anothe Cap Friendly lineup for a few year
But just quickly Guhle & Pilut won’t be making 4mil each,
more like 4mil total
McCabe’s contract won’t ever go up much,
bc he doesn’t score
6 & 7 defensemen of Borgen & Nelson also won’t ever cost much
Neither will our goalies
Hutton if re-signed, Ullmark on 2nd contract, UPL on his ELC - jdfitz77
You're seriously calling BOTH of them 2nd pairing? And if they're true 2nd pairing guys, then yes, they will make money. That's how it works. You can't just say they're good enough to be 2nd pairing defensemen and then say they'll make less than half what an actual 2nd pairing defenseman makes.
You're seriously calling BOTH of them 2nd pairing? And if they're true 2nd pairing guys, then yes, they will make money. That's how it works. You can't just say they're good enough to be 2nd pairing defensemen and then say they'll make less than half what an actual 2nd pairing defenseman makes. - Wetbandit1
Eventually they will,
but not on their next contract
And 1 of them would be on the 2nd pair in
‘21-22 (when Dahlin needs his new deal)
McCabe-Dahlin
Pilut-Ristolainen
Guhle-Borgen
Nelson
Yes, very young, i know
But we add a Vet at the deadline if needed
You're seriously calling BOTH of them 2nd pairing? And if they're true 2nd pairing guys, then yes, they will make money. That's how it works. You can't just say they're good enough to be 2nd pairing defensemen and then say they'll make less than half what an actual 2nd pairing defenseman makes. - Wetbandit1
Using your numbers, for the ‘21-22 season
(and beyond)
Leaves us 10mil to figure out goalies,
and have room to add a Vet at the deadline
We lose either Sheary or Sam
Nylander & Olofsson on line3 with Mitts,
still on nice contracts
Might end up losing one of them on their next deals... depends how they do
Pilut & Guhle will both eventually make more, but the Cap will be going up
Maybe one is traded & we plug in Samuelsson on the 3rd pair?
It’s a reasonable option
None of our defensemen besides Dahlin & Risto will make big $$$ bc they aren’t point getters
So that’s a big plus for us moving forward
Goalie is still a big question mark
But that’s the case no matter what we do/don’t do up front & on defense
Thank you Cabie for bringing some sanity to the room.
I must object to the posters position that Sam doesn't make players around him better? His hockey IQ and passing is excellent.
Watch him in the corners using his frame to shield defenders. To suggest that he is "Losing" on the Bet on himself 8 games into the season? - MEBSabresFAN
He makes good players better. He can't elevate "meh" players.
Location: I said that months ago, keep up!, FL Joined: 03.10.2013
Oct 23 @ 8:54 AM ET
That's being optimistic about a compliance buyout, yeah you gain $10M by losing Bogo and Scandella, but you still have to replace the ones you lose, and 2nd pairing defensemen don't make $1M, at least not for long unless you can keep cycling out ELCs on defense and the bottom 6 you're going to be in trouble. You run out of road real quick, just ask Chicago.
Sure, you don't NEED Stone, but you need a 1W and they cost money. In the neighborhood of $6M+.
Edit: One injury at a key position and you're (frank)ed. - Wetbandit1
Is 9 Playoff seasons and winning the Stanley Cup 3 times in that span running out of road real quick?
If so, sign md up, real quick.
You puucked the wrong team to make that point, lol.
And again...
playing on line3 to spread out scoring is
WAY DIFFERENT
from being dropped to line4 bc you’re playing poorly offensively
Comparing Berglund’s situation just doesn’t hold up - jdfitz77
I see two very disingenuous arguments being made here. No one ever said that ROR was worse of a player then Berglund, in fact most you are arguing with have given the opposite side. As for Kane, like the player but he never toped 40 points here (may have once, can't remember, to lazy to look) and was injured quite frequently. You also seem to leave out the number of picks coming back, especially in the early rounds from these trades.
Second disingenuous is Berglund playing the fourth line. While this is true, he was coming off a minor injury. I would assume that the players played well in practice together in the top 9 in practice or in the later half of the SJS game. You possibly don't shake up what's working just to put an average 3rd liner back on that line. Especially when he can fit in the fourth line just fine. I'd also like to point out that with close games, he's been the one on the ice late. If you want to critique his contract in the later years, like I've said before that's all well and dandy. But in your dream scenario of giving Okposo a compliance buy out, why couldn't we buy out Berglund? ROR and Kane got us from last to 8th last back to last(Admit not all on them, but as "leaders" or "young vets" that GMTM brought in, they didn't exactly elevate everyones play around them). A change was needed, regardless of the talent level.
18-10-5 <--- Buffalo's opponent's record in Losses 15-22-3 <--- Buffalo's opponent's record in Wins
Still early... but we have enough sample size.
Rangers, Kings, and Coyotes have all started slow at, 2-5-1, 2-5-1, 2-5 respectively.
Not trying to be pessimistic but realistic. There are going to be peaks and valleys. - Sabre_Tooth
The wins are similar.
I think it would be more interesting to see what the teams' records are when you take the games against the Sabres out, because that's sort of double dipping.
Without the sabres results, the records would be
14-10-5 - teams weve lost against
15-17-3 - teams weve won against (6 more games played)
1 game under real .500, and 5 games under real .500
Location: We are in 30th place. It's 2017 , NY Joined: 02.12.2012
Oct 23 @ 11:39 AM ET
I see two very disingenuous arguments being made here. No one ever said that ROR was worse of a player then Berglund, in fact most you are arguing with have given the opposite side. As for Kane, like the player but he never toped 40 points here (may have once, can't remember, to lazy to look) and was injured quite frequently. You also seem to leave out the number of picks coming back, especially in the early rounds from these trades.
Second disingenuous is Berglund playing the fourth line. While this is true, he was coming off a minor injury. I would assume that the players played well in practice together in the top 9 in practice or in the later half of the SJS game. You possibly don't shake up what's working just to put an average 3rd liner back on that line. Especially when he can fit in the fourth line just fine. I'd also like to point out that with close games, he's been the one on the ice late. If you want to critique his contract in the later years, like I've said before that's all well and dandy. But in your dream scenario of giving Okposo a compliance buy out, why couldn't we buy out Berglund? ROR and Kane got us from last to 8th last back to last(Admit not all on them, but as "leaders" or "young vets" that GMTM brought in, they didn't exactly elevate everyones play around them). A change was needed, regardless of the talent level. - SDSabre
A change was desperately needed. And it was made, and we are better for it
Location: Matt FRICKIN ELLIS, IN Joined: 01.17.2007
Oct 23 @ 11:40 AM ET
18-10-5 <--- Buffalo's opponent's record in Losses
15-22-3 <--- Buffalo's opponent's record in Wins
Still early... but we have enough sample size.
Rangers, Kings, and Coyotes have all started slow at, 2-5-1, 2-5-1, 2-5 respectively.
Not trying to be pessimistic but realistic. There are going to be peaks and valleys. - Sabre_Tooth
the come back win against anahiem is a big + for this team. They didn't just pack it in when they went down. i don't think that has ever happened in the past 5 years
the come back win against anahiem is a big + for this team. They didn't just pack it in when they went down. i don't think that has ever happened in the past 5 years - IndianaSabresFan
I do remember one game against the sharks at home where we came back in the third down 4-1 and won 5-4. Feb 7th of 2017.
