They proved they were that caliber of player and experience helped them achieve that success again in the playoffs by overcoming all the hardest match-ups in every series and still scoring points and making a difference. They were also healthy again for the first time in a long time, they missed a lot of time over the years before they came back to win Cups back to back.
- Unholy_Goalie

So you're assuming that Matthew's can't prove that he can do that battle through tough match ups and out score the opposition because why? He never did it in his first two years in the league?. Crosby missed the playoffs in his first year, got eliminated in the first round the second year lost in the finals in the 3rd and won his first cup in the 4th. But Matthew's will never be good enough because he hasn't been yet.

But not the best at their position which means the rest of the team (specifically defense) needs to be better to succeed like all the other examples of Cup winners that everybody seems to ignore when talking about the "Pittsburgh way".
- Unholy_Goalie

Not the best at they’re position but so (frank)ing close to it they can smell Crosby and malkin taint.. you think it’s that black and white? It’s not

So you're assuming that Matthew's can't prove that he can do that battle through tough match ups and out score the opposition because why? He never did it in his first two years in the league?. Crosby missed the playoffs in his first year, got eliminated in the first round the second year lost in the finals in the 3rd and won his first cup in the 4th. But Matthew's will never be good enough because he hasn't been yet.
- HealthyScratch6

Semantics.. Mathews will never be as good at any particular time .. it’s unpossible

Not the best at they’re position but so (frank)ing close to it they can smell Crosby and malkin taint.. you think it’s that black and white? It’s not
- Puck-us-all

Crosby was not the best in the world at his position in 2016. He was at best 2nd which is probably what Matthew's is right now. Malkin was top 5 and tavares probably top 10.

So you're assuming that Matthew's can't prove that he can do that battle through tough match ups and out score the opposition because why? He never did it in his first two years in the league?. Crosby missed the playoffs in his first year, got eliminated in the first round the second year lost in the finals in the 3rd and won his first cup in the 4th. But Matthew's will never be good enough because he hasn't been yet.
- HealthyScratch6

Thus far, he hasn't in the playoffs and in the regular season he hasn't proven he's a league MVP or Art Ross winner like Crosby did. I'm not saying he can't ever do it, I'm saying he hasn't. So no, they aren't on the same level thus far. That's why McDavid would be a better comparable to Crosby because he actually has done it.

There have been teams that won the Cup with sub-par goalies like Osgood or Niemi. That doesn't mean because it happened once that the plan should be to get a poop goalie because the majority of the time, it was a very good or great goalie who won the Cup. It's the same with the Leafs. They don't have a Crosby, so stop trying to compare the two teams because they aren't the same. The Leafs have very good, young, offensively powerful players and a very good goalie but that formula has failed before. Look at Washington for 10 years. Led the league in scoring, President's Trophy and 1st round exits. I'm saying, the Leafs need to avoid that formula and focus more on defense to improve their chances.

Crosby was not the best in the world at his position in 2016. He was at best 2nd which is probably what Matthew's is right now. Malkin was top 5 and tavares probably top 10.
- HealthyScratch6

Which has been my point this entire time.. two of the top ten centers in the league on one team with Kadri riding 3 spot Reilly playing letang and Anderson being elite is a bad comparison to the pen cup team because .. I don’t know, I still don’t see it as a bad comparison

Thus far, he hasn't in the playoffs and in the regular season he hasn't proven he's a league MVP or Art Ross winner like Crosby did. I'm not saying he can't ever do it, I'm saying he hasn't. So no, they aren't on the same level thus far. That's why McDavid would be a better comparable to Crosby because he actually has done it.

There have been teams that won the Cup with sub-par goalies like Osgood or Niemi. That doesn't mean because it happened once that the plan should be to get a poop goalie because the majority of the time, it was a very good or great goalie who won the Cup. It's the same with the Leafs. They don't have a Crosby, so stop trying to compare the two teams because they aren't the same. The Leafs have very good, young, offensively powerful players and a very good goalie but that formula has failed before. Look at Washington for 10 years. Led the league in scoring, President's Trophy and 1st round exits. I'm saying, the Leafs need to avoid that formula and focus more on defense to improve their chances.
- Unholy_Goalie

Eliminated by Pittsburgh who was the same kind of team.

Thus far, he hasn't in the playoffs and in the regular season he hasn't proven he's a league MVP or Art Ross winner like Crosby did. I'm not saying he can't ever do it, I'm saying he hasn't. So no, they aren't on the same level thus far. That's why McDavid would be a better comparable to Crosby because he actually has done it.

There have been teams that won the Cup with sub-par goalies like Osgood or Niemi. That doesn't mean because it happened once that the plan should be to get a poop goalie because the majority of the time, it was a very good or great goalie who won the Cup. It's the same with the Leafs. They don't have a Crosby, so stop trying to compare the two teams because they aren't the same. The Leafs have very good, young, offensively powerful players and a very good goalie but that formula has failed before. Look at Washington for 10 years. Led the league in scoring, President's Trophy and 1st round exits. I'm saying, the Leafs need to avoid that formula and focus more on defense to improve their chances.
- Unholy_Goalie

Didn’t they get bounced constantly by the pens? The same team the leafs are emulating? 🧐

Which has been my point this entire time.. two of the top ten centers in the league on one team with Kadri riding 3 spot Reilly playing letang and Anderson being elite is a bad comparison to the pen cup team because .. I don’t know, I still don’t see it as a bad comparison
- Puck-us-all

Because Crosby won the hart in 2013

Eliminated by Pittsburgh who was the same kind of team.
- HealthyScratch6

Ha.. ditto

Crosby was not the best in the world at his position in 2016. He was at best 2nd which is probably what Matthew's is right now. Malkin was top 5 and tavares probably top 10.
- HealthyScratch6

#1 in scoring for centers in 2016, won the Conn Smythe.

Matthews is the #2 center in the NHL right now? That's certainly debatable.

Eliminated by Pittsburgh who was the same kind of team.
- HealthyScratch6

Not exclusively Pittsburgh, also eliminated by Montreal (with Halak in net) and the Rangers, Tampa Bay and the Flyers.

And again, the Capitals had the #1 goal scorer but they didn't have a Malkin which was usually the tie breaker, until last year when Kuznetsov kind of showed flashes of being that type of game breaker along with a team that was much bigger, more physical and defensively responsible. But for 10 years prior, it was offensive, defensively sloppy and rely on the goalie too much (like the Leafs today).

Because Crosby won the hart in 2013
- HealthyScratch6

Ah yes..

#1 in scoring for centers in 2016, won the Conn Smythe.

Matthews is the #2 center in the NHL right now? That's certainly debatable.
- Unholy_Goalie

#1 in pts per game for centers in 2018.

Not exclusively Pittsburgh, also eliminated by Montreal (with Halak in net) and the Rangers, Tampa Bay and the Flyers.
- Unholy_Goalie

Well as long as it wasn’t exclusively right?

All those teams set up somewhat similarly..

Well as long as it wasn’t exclusively right?

All those teams set up somewhat similarly..
- Puck-us-all

Not even close. Montreal bunkered defensively and Halak stole them the series. The Rangers played defensively. The Flyers were the Flyers.

Not exclusively Pittsburgh, also eliminated by Montreal (with Halak in net) and the Rangers, Tampa Bay and the Flyers.

And again, the Capitals had the #1 goal scorer but they didn't have a Malkin which was usually the tie breaker, until last year when Kuznetsov kind of showed flashes of being that type of game breaker along with a team that was much bigger, more physical and defensively responsible. But for 10 years prior, it was offensive, defensively sloppy and rely on the goalie too much (like the Leafs today).
- Unholy_Goalie

So the leafs have Mathews who’s possible to be the #1 goal scorer and Tavares who’s maybe showed flashes of being a game breaker along with a team the is much faster and defensively responsible (6th in goals against) .. oh there’s this Marner guy too, not too shabby that fella.. also Reilly heard he’s a possible Norris candidate.. this new kid that just scored huge goals skates with them too I think.. kapisomething or other? Kadri has scored 30 a couple times that’s neat.. they might even get a dynamic dude named nylander I hear.. but a digress.. leafs are poop blow it up.. top tens in stats and second in the league don’t mean poop unless you have mvp players Norris winners and Stanley cup rings jammed in your ears

Not even close. Montreal bunkered defensively and Halak stole them the series. The Rangers played defensively. The Flyers were the Flyers.
- Unholy_Goalie

Ya, set up similar.. not exact..

#1 in pts per game for centers in 2018.
- HealthyScratch6

But what did he do in 2012? Not a thing .. bust

So the leafs have Mathews who’s possible to be the #1 goal scorer and Tavares who’s maybe showed flashes of being a game breaker along with a team the is much faster and defensively responsible (6th in goals against)
- Puck-us-all

Not because of the defense; because of Andersen.

oh there’s this Marner guy too, not too shabby that fella.. also Reilly heard he’s a possible Norris candidate..

For points, not for defense.

this new kid that just scored huge goals skates with them too I think.. kapisomething or other? Kadri has scored 30 a couple times that’s neat.. they might even get a dynamic dude named nylander I hear.. but a digress.. leafs are poop blow it up.. top tens in stats and second in the league don’t mean poop unless you have mvp players Norris winners and Stanley cup rings jammed in your ears

Listing all the Leafs players might impress you in your head but it does nothing for your argument. Just repeating their names won't make them better than they are.

Ya, set up similar.. not exact..
- Puck-us-all

Not even close to similar to the Penguins.

Not even close to similar to the Penguins.
- Unholy_Goalie

Prove it

Not because of the defense; because of Andersen.



For points, not for defense.



Listing all the Leafs players might impress you in your head but it does nothing for your argument. Just repeating their names won't make them better than they are.
- Unholy_Goalie

Prove it

#1 in pts per game for centers in 2018.
- HealthyScratch6

The more games he plays, the more likely that is to lower. It's like his shooting percentage. You think it's going to stay at 28%? Probably not.

None of this is to say Matthews is a poop player. He's a great player. But he's not McDavid and he's not Crosby and the Leafs do not have a Crosby and Malkin duo. That doesn't mean they can't win a Cup, it just means they can't win it the "Pittsburgh way". They'll need better defenders and better defense because that's how most teams win Cups. They have a lot of great pieces but there's no guarantee that just because they can score goals that they can win a Cup doing only that. History has shown that method doesn't work out more often than not.

[quote=Unholy_Goalie]Not because of the defense; because of Andersen.



For points, not for defense.


Hmmmm kinda your boy karlsson?
You’re so contradictory it’s hilarious