Me too, but I think that we fans tend to overrate our players. Think about what we've read on here. We have ardent supporters of Murphy and Gus, and a lot of posts about how we should resign Dahlstrom and Koekkoek, and now Forsling is solid. Plus we have Joki coming in, and the other 3 high draft picks.
We're all in agreement we need a top 4 dman this off season, but we already have 8 dmen when you add in 2 and 7. We have one of the worst defenses in the league, but all of our dmen have support on this board. It really doesn't make sense.
- tvetter

I agree T, just because we like what a player brings doesn't mean that they are the best or are going to flourish in the role they are being used in.

I wouldn't go as far as to say support on this board. There are players that get crapped on. I will do that too from time to time. Sometimes our guys baffle me with the poop they do, but I'm trying to be less negative.

As long as we end on this positive trend, players keep progressing, bounce backs aren't a one time deal, good signings (euro or otherwise) that don't screw us, and youngins develop 19/20 season is something to look forward to.

These are the what if's that interest me....

Forsling went down right in the crease on a point plank shot .Ya hope he continues to progress think he will be a good one
- oldduffman

Ohhh okay. Don't remember that, but good to hear, thanks Duffy.

My other thought is that I love the idea of taking on a salary for next year in order to get a high pick/prospect and a serviceable player, but if we're taking Horton (or Callahan), I'd like more than just Kadri.
- tvetter

I doubt Toronto would have too much problem unloading Horton now that it's down to 1 year remaining. Probably a number of teams with cap space to handle it to be able to pick off a player from Toronto. I'm not sure the trade I proposed would even be good enough from Toronto's perspective - hence the comment that additional trade details TBD.

Me too, but I think that we fans tend to overrate our players. Think about what we've read on here. We have ardent supporters of Murphy and Gus, and a lot of posts about how we should resign Dahlstrom and Koekkoek, and now Forsling is solid. Plus we have Joki coming in, and the other 3 high draft picks.
We're all in agreement we need a top 4 dman this off season, but we already have 8 dmen when you add in 2 and 7. We have one of the worst defenses in the league, but all of our dmen have support on this board. It really doesn't make sense.
- tvetter

Hear ya. Place me in the camp that says ulcer bills can be expensive. Some show signs of improvement, but does anyone stand out that appears able to make the next jump up? Keep looking every day.

My other thought is that I love the idea of taking on a salary for next year in order to get a high pick/prospect and a serviceable player, but if we're taking Horton (or Callahan), I'd like more than just Kadri.
- tvetter

I don't like Kadri ,and would not trade for him under any circumstances .AA looks to me to be a well respected player on this team ,and a bit of a mentor to different players . I would think long and hard before moving him .
Gus also the piling on seems like over kill ,the guy works hard blocks shots ,and his offense is outstanding ,hang onto him see what happens next year ..
Biggest game of the year tomorrow night ,well till the next one ..

I doubt Toronto would have too much problem unloading Horton now that it's down to 1 year remaining. Probably a number of teams with cap space to handle it to be able to pick off a player from Toronto. I'm not sure the trade I proposed would even be good enough from Toronto's perspective - hence the comment that additional trade details TBD.
- EbonyRaptor

Toronto doesn't care or need to move Horton. He just goes on LTIR the first day of every season. What they do need is a couple of good NHL defenceman that are better than Zaitsev, Holl, Marincin and the other Russian kid.

I don't like Kadri ,and would not trade for him under any circumstances .AA looks to me to be a well respected player on this team ,and a bit of a mentor to different players . I would think long and hard before moving him .
Gus also the piling on seems like over kill ,the guy works hard blocks shots ,and his offense is outstanding ,hang onto him see what happens next year ..
Biggest game of the year tomorrow night ,well till the next one ..
- oldduffman

That's a real good point about AA being a mentor. He definitely played a roll in Perlini's recent good play, and I would imagine he helped Panarin his first year.

I agree T, just because we like what a player brings doesn't mean that they are the best or are going to flourish in the role they are being used in.

I wouldn't go as far as to say support on this board. There are players that get crapped on. I will do that too from time to time. Sometimes our guys baffle me with the poop they do, but I'm trying to be less negative.

As long as we end on this positive trend, players keep progressing, bounce backs aren't a one time deal, good signings (euro or otherwise) that don't screw us, and youngins develop 19/20 season is something to look forward to.

These are the what if's that interest me....
- I Am The Breadman

Agree with you that crapping on guys serves no good purpose, other than momentary catharsis. That said, "GOOD GOD, WE NEED D-HELP!!!" Lol.

Toronto doesn't care or need to move Horton. He just goes on LTIR the first day of every season. What they do need is a couple of good NHL defenceman that are better than Zaitsev, Holl, Marincin and the other Russian kid.
- RickJ

Depending on what Marner and Kapanen sign for, they may need to get rid of his contract to be compliant on day 1. They have about 9 to 10 million to spend, and they only have 16 players signed. Marner and Kap will easily get more than that, so they'll be over the limit with only 18 players.
Vegas may be the best team to poach from. They are over 82 million with 17 players!

I don't like Kadri ,and would not trade for him under any circumstances .AA looks to me to be a well respected player on this team ,and a bit of a mentor to different players . I would think long and hard before moving him .
Gus also the piling on seems like over kill ,the guy works hard blocks shots ,and his offense is outstanding ,hang onto him see what happens next year ..
Biggest game of the year tomorrow night ,well till the next one ..
- oldduffman

Would also be inclined to hang on to Gus for another year.

Agree with you that crapping on guys serves no good purpose, other than momentary catharsis. That said, "GOOD GOD, WE NEED D-HELP!!!" Lol.
- gabriel

Hahahaha!!

The latest, this morning, from The Athletic in the Western WC race:

DAL 91 Pts.; 88% playoff probability
ARI 88...53%
MIN 86...29%
CHI 85...20%
COL 83...10%
EDM 82...3%

Depending on what Marner and Kapanen sign for, they may need to get rid of his contract to be compliant on day 1. They have about 9 to 10 million to spend, and they only have 16 players signed. Marner and Kap will easily get more than that, so they'll be over the limit with only 18 players.
Vegas may be the best team to poach from. They are over 82 million with 17 players!
- tvetter

I would love to have McNabb from LVK

OK ... back to my theme of the day - Anisimov.

What if the Hawks could acquire a player that would play a solid 3C, be younger, faster and more dynamic than Anisimov, be better than 50% on faceoffs, and not cost more than Anisimov?

As you will recall, I have already spent oodles of keystrokes lately scheming a way to use Toronto's pending cap crunch to wrestle a player away from them. It usually involved some trade package where the Hawks would get Kapanen and take on the last year of Horton's contract. So, how about a similar trade but instead of Kapanen we target Kadri? Something along the lines we send Anisimov to Toronto for Kadri and Horton's contract. Kadri has an extra year remaining on his contract than Anisimov does (3 years vs 2 years) but the AAV are about the same ($4.5M vs $4.55M). Essentially the Hawks would get the better player in the swap for taking on Horton's contract which helps Toronto with their cap situation. Other minor details could be added to make the trade work.

Thoughts?
- EbonyRaptor

We traded assets to get rid of Hossa's cap hit just a year ago. I can't understand the rationale for reversing that to pick up Horton's dead cap hit. We would be better off to use this new cap space that we have on this summers' free agents with no restrictions on our Cap heading into the new season..

I would love to have McNabb from LVK
- LAHawk

Lazy Sunday, so I was playing around on capfriendly. I came up with this lineup:

Saad-Toews-Kane
ADB-Strome-Perlini
Sikura-Dzingle-Kahun
Caggiula-Kampf-Johnson/Hayden

Keith-Joki
Miller-Murphy
Koekkoek-Seabrook
Dahlstrom

Crow
Delia

I traded AA to Carolina for their lower of their 2 second round picks in 2019.
I traded Gus and a second for Collin Miller, David Clarkston (LTIR with 1 year left) and a 2020 first.
I signed Dzingle for 3.5 (double his current salary)
I signed our RFAs to moderate raises.

This left us with $7 million in cap space if the cap goes up to 82.5

Me too, but I think that we fans tend to overrate our players. Think about what we've read on here. We have ardent supporters of Murphy and Gus, and a lot of posts about how we should resign Dahlstrom and Koekkoek, and now Forsling is solid. Plus we have Joki coming in, and the other 3 high draft picks.
We're all in agreement we need a top 4 dman this off season, but we already have 8 dmen when you add in 2 and 7. We have one of the worst defenses in the league, but all of our dmen have support on this board. It really doesn't make sense.
- tvetter

Yes, and they are the players we see the most. We also overvalue them after a good game and undervalue them after a bad game.

Just yesterday, I was thinking Gustafsson was having a good game. And I truly dislike Gus for his defensive liabilities. And just as I thought he was playing well defensively, he made a stupid neutral zone play that led to a 2 on 1 against. And that one play changed my thinking about his entire game.

We traded assets to get rid of Hossa's cap hit just a year ago. I can't understand the rationale for reversing that to pick up Horton's dead cap hit. We would be better off to use this new cap space that we have on this summers' free agents with no restrictions on our Cap heading into the new season..
- 67hawks

Horton's hit comes of the books after next year, so before ADB and Strome's new contracts are on the books. If it gets us an asset, why not take it?

OK ... back to my theme of the day - Anisimov.

What if the Hawks could acquire a player that would play a solid 3C, be younger, faster and more dynamic than Anisimov, be better than 50% on faceoffs, and not cost more than Anisimov?

As you will recall, I have already spent oodles of keystrokes lately scheming a way to use Toronto's pending cap crunch to wrestle a player away from them. It usually involved some trade package where the Hawks would get Kapanen and take on the last year of Horton's contract. So, how about a similar trade but instead of Kapanen we target Kadri? Something along the lines we send Anisimov to Toronto for Kadri and Horton's contract. Kadri has an extra year remaining on his contract than Anisimov does (3 years vs 2 years) but the AAV are about the same ($4.5M vs $4.55M). Essentially the Hawks would get the better player in the swap for taking on Horton's contract which helps Toronto with their cap situation. Other minor details could be added to make the trade work.

Thoughts?
- EbonyRaptor

Don't think Toronto will want to take back that much salary given the cap crunch they will be in.
Include a draft choice and/or a player on an ELC instead? If a Kadri type is obtained, then can trade AA for another usable part.

OK ... back to my theme of the day - Anisimov.

What if the Hawks could acquire a player that would play a solid 3C, be younger, faster and more dynamic than Anisimov, be better than 50% on faceoffs, and not cost more than Anisimov?

As you will recall, I have already spent oodles of keystrokes lately scheming a way to use Toronto's pending cap crunch to wrestle a player away from them. It usually involved some trade package where the Hawks would get Kapanen and take on the last year of Horton's contract. So, how about a similar trade but instead of Kapanen we target Kadri? Something along the lines we send Anisimov to Toronto for Kadri and Horton's contract. Kadri has an extra year remaining on his contract than Anisimov does (3 years vs 2 years) but the AAV are about the same ($4.5M vs $4.55M). Essentially the Hawks would get the better player in the swap for taking on Horton's contract which helps Toronto with their cap situation. Other minor details could be added to make the trade work.

Thoughts?
- EbonyRaptor

Depends on what the plan is for this summer is my first thought. The contract could be put on LTIR but that comes with it's own set of issues. Or what the Hawks plan on doing in the FA market. Kadri was the first name that came to mind when you first mentioned moving on from AA.

Does it do enough to help the Leaf cap situation? They could use LTIR for Horton themselves and keep the better player. Personally not interested in giving additional assets. Especially to the Leafs.

I would love to have McNabb from LVK
- LAHawk

Or Miller, or Eakin.

Lazy Sunday, so I was playing around on capfriendly. I came up with this lineup:

Saad-Toews-Kane
ADB-Strome-Perlini
Sikura-Dzingle-Kahun
Caggiula-Kampf-Johnson/Hayden

Keith-Joki
Miller-Murphy
Koekkoek-Seabrook
Dahlstrom

Crow
Delia

I traded AA to Carolina for their lower of their 2 second round picks in 2019.
I traded Gus and a second for Collin Miller, David Clarkston (LTIR with 1 year left) and a 2020 first.
I signed Dzingle for 3.5 (double his current salary)
I signed our RFAs to moderate raises.

This left us with $7 million in cap space if the cap goes up to 82.5
- tvetter

Dahlstrom is better than PooPoo, imo. Dzingel is going to get more than 3.5. He is looking for 6M.

Lazy Sunday, so I was playing around on capfriendly. I came up with this lineup:

Saad-Toews-Kane
ADB-Strome-Perlini
Sikura-Dzingle-Kahun
Caggiula-Kampf-Johnson/Hayden

Keith-Joki
Miller-Murphy
Koekkoek-Seabrook
Dahlstrom

Crow
Delia

I traded AA to Carolina for their lower of their 2 second round picks in 2019.
I traded Gus and a second for Collin Miller, David Clarkston (LTIR with 1 year left) and a 2020 first.
I signed Dzingle for 3.5 (double his current salary)
I signed our RFAs to moderate raises.

This left us with $7 million in cap space if the cap goes up to 82.5
- tvetter

Dzingle plays mostly wing so that wouldn't work and why would you trade a lefty dman for another righty when we have an abundance of righties already and out best d prospects are righties too?

Yes, and they are the players we see the most. We also overvalue them after a good game and undervalue them after a bad game.

Just yesterday, I was thinking Gustafsson was having a good game. And I truly dislike Gus for his defensive liabilities. And just as I thought he was playing well defensively, he made a stupid neutral zone play that led to a 2 on 1 against. And that one play changed my thinking about his entire game.
- scottak

Guilty of the very same thing. Nice hearing someone who admits it.

Or Miller, or Eakin.
- boilermaker100

Not at all a big metrics guy but do look at them for some info. Eakin has a CorRel% of -6.5. That is bad. Like far below replacement level bad. kinda surprising to me.

Toronto doesn't care or need to move Horton. He just goes on LTIR the first day of every season. What they do need is a couple of good NHL defenceman that are better than Zaitsev, Holl, Marincin and the other Russian kid.
- RickJ

Right - which means they have to be cap compliant with Horton counting against the cap until after the season starts, at which point he can b moved to LTIR and all or part of his $5.3M cap hit can be used in-season depending on stuff. But the point is that $5.3M can't be used before the season starts to re-sign their RFA's or moves to construct their 2019/20 roster.

Correct? If yes, than trading him is worth something to them so they have that $5.3M to used in their cap compliant roster on day-1 of the season.