It’s Morons are governing America

Personally I would point to the post-WW2 era from the early 50s to mid 70s. Probably not the greatest statistically, but the country underwent a pretty significant transformation during his period.
- Spec41971

Here's a couple more MAGA definitions

Mueller Ain't Got Anything

Michael Avenattii Got Arrested.

No they weren’t. I occasionally hear the story from my mom about how when she was a kid they used to get “sugar bread” as a treat. It was just a piece of simple white bread with some sugar sprinkled on it - the family couldn’t afford candy back then. The kids I know today would have a cow if we gave them that.
- Spec41971

Both my parents had the families split up during the depression. They told me of their dates taking the streetcar for 5 cents to go to the Hawks game and sitting in the second balcony for like a quarter a seat.

My apologies, Fair point. I would still point out that it is easy to romanticize the past, as relatively speaking, the cost to live and survive were better back then.

Sadly, the income tax burden is carried by the wealthy. The more it goes that way, the worse it is for everyone (ironically) because eventually, just like many of the state governments in the north are slowly learning, eventually there is no one left to foot the bill. I am speaking income tax wise. I realize that payroll, sales and property taxes represent a larger percentage of disposable income for the average middle class person, which is part of your larger point.

In my humble opinion, the Federal Reserve, (not an actual federal agency by the way) is the biggest enemy of the people. As it is the perpetual relief valve that pays all bad bets. What in effect happens, is that that banks that own the Fed, actually print more money to inflate the system, to keep it working for the average person. The crime is that the same funds inflate their ownership and their wealth grows the same in good times and bad.
- TrueGrit

During the 08 financial crisis the fed loaned the banks $1.2 trillion as a bailout. The fed loaned the US taxpayer $0.

Do you mean no incentive like Japan, Germany, China, Canada, France, Sweden .....???
- paulr

Not sure I follow...

My point is look at Illinios, New York, New Jersey etc...

Just like Cuba..

You never see anyone on boats or trucks of people headed in that direction. Always the other way.

If you are going to take a risk, you do not do it in one of those states. Google Gov Cuomo in New York's speech on his progressive tax system and the wealthy leaving his state.

Again, more irony.

Do you mean no incentive like Japan, Germany, China, Canada, France, Sweden .....???
- paulr

Well Canada benefits nicely from being America's neighbor. Aside from Canada, Sweden is the only country that doesn't have major economical issues. And I list Sweden only because I don't know much about it.

Not sure I follow...

My point is look at Illinios, New York, New Jersey etc...

Just like Cuba..

You never see anyone on boats or trucks of people headed in that direction. Always the other way.

If you are going to take a risk, you do not do it in one of those states. Google Gov Cuomo in New York's speech on his progressive tax system and the wealthy leaving his state.

Again, more irony.
- TrueGrit

Germany, Japan, China are all socialist and they seem to have incentive.

Not sure I follow...

My point is look at Illinios, New York, New Jersey etc...

Just like Cuba..

You never see anyone on boats or trucks of people headed in that direction. Always the other way.

If you are going to take a risk, you do not do it in one of those states. Google Gov Cuomo in New York's speech on his progressive tax system and the wealthy leaving his state.

Again, more irony.
- TrueGrit

Or big bad Amazon with the tax break that would of brought 25,000 direct jobs (forget about the ancilliary ones like restaurants, cleaners, etc.) and the collection in sales and local taxes. And the tumble in housing prices as a result of being chased away.

During the 08 financial crisis the fed loaned the banks $1.2 trillion as a bailout. The fed loaned the US taxpayer $0.
- LAHawk

Yep, and jackasses like Lloyd Blankfien and Jamie Dimon and the Federal Reserve Chair The Ben Bernank, were lauded as heros, doing the lords work.

Failure (banks) at that time would have been healthy for the whole system and would have been far better for the average person, as a period of deflation would have benefited the average working person.

This crisis was not because of Capitalism, it was because there was no capitalisim. Capitalism carries risk. There was no risk in anything the banks did, which by the way, was blessed in advance by congress, as banks would never be allowed to fail.

Google BB&T's CEO letter about the crisis. He did not allow his bank to participate in the insanity and was still penalized. Most people do not know that all small banks, who did not participate in the insanity, were forced to pay fees to help correct the system.

Well Canada benefits nicely from being America's neighbor. Aside from Canada, Sweden is the only country that doesn't have major economical issues. And I list Sweden only because I don't know much about it.
- bhawks2241

Canada does benefit from the U.S even though it runs a trade deficit.

Germany, Japan, China are all socialist and they seem to have incentive.
- paulr

Capitalism is defined as an ECONOMIC system where the means of production are privately owned, where a distinction exists between owners who live off profit ("capitalists") and the mass of the population who work for wages or salaries ("workers"). Socialism, by contrast, is defined as an ECONOMIC system where the means of production are collectively owned, either by the state or collectively so there are no "capitalists" (all the workers are collective owners of industries). Germany and Japan are purely capitalist economy, but has stronger social welfare policies and social benefits for its population than the United States affords its citizens, which Americans tend to confuse with socialism. Social welfare is an entirely different thing from the technical definition of socialism.

Capitalism is defined as an ECONOMIC system where the means of production are privately owned, where a distinction exists between owners who live off profit ("capitalists") and the mass of the population who work for wages or salaries ("workers"). Socialism, by contrast, is defined as an ECONOMIC system where the means of production are collectively owned, either by the state or collectively so there are no "capitalists" (all the workers are collective owners of industries). Germany and Japan are purely capitalist economy, but has stronger social welfare policies and social benefits for its population than the United States affords its citizens, which Americans tend to confuse with socialism. Social welfare is an entirely different thing from the technical definition of socialism.
- LAHawk

I agree 100%. Yet some classify them as socialist contries even though the real term should be something like Capitalist with regulation.

Germany, Japan, China are all socialist and they seem to have incentive.
- paulr

Japan is a stagnant economy with a culture of educated people, which helps keep them stable. But there has been no growth there in decades.

Germany and other European nations are like States relative to the US. Not an apples to apples comparison. Most European countries are struggling economically. They have wierd demographic issues as well.

China, like all of them I will argue, are far more limited in social mobility opportunities. I have been there, China is like Chicago, you have to grease the palm of everyone to make something happen. It is not efficient.

In the end, Paul, this is why I love sports. There is a competition and winners and losers. In china and many places, the establishment/wealthy hold the cards, as you know. It is like watching a hockey game where you own both teams. You can't lose. Once the players know this, there is no pursuit of excellence, as it does not matter.

That culture is why most countries can not compete with US innovation wise. They remove incentive for individuals to pursue excellence.

Thank you all for the friendly exchange(your patience) of non hockey issues. It is my birthday today and have to run some errands.

Japan is a stagnant economy with a culture of educated people, which helps keep them stable. But there has been no growth there in decades.

Germany and other European nations are like States relative to the US. Not an apples to apples comparison. Most European countries are struggling economically. They have wierd demographic issues as well.

China, like all of them I will argue, are far more limited in social mobility opportunities. I have been there, China is like Chicago, you have to grease the palm of everyone to make something happen. It is not efficient.

In the end, Paul, this is why I love sports. There is a competition and winners and losers. In china and many places, the establishment/wealthy hold the cards, as you know. It is like watching a hockey game where you own both teams. You can't lose. Once the players know this, there is no pursuit of excellence, as it does not matter.

That culture is why most countries can not compete with US innovation wise. They remove incentive for individuals to pursue excellence.

Thank you all for the friendly exchange(your patience) of non hockey issues. It is my birthday today and have to run some errands.
- TrueGrit

Happy Birthday!!!'

Japan is a stagnant economy with a culture of educated people, which helps keep them stable. But there has been no growth there in decades.

Germany and other European nations are like States relative to the US. Not an apples to apples comparison. Most European countries are struggling economically. They have wierd demographic issues as well.

China, like all of them I will argue, are far more limited in social mobility opportunities. I have been there, China is like Chicago, you have to grease the palm of everyone to make something happen. It is not efficient.

In the end, Paul, this is why I love sports. There is a competition and winners and losers. In china and many places, the establishment/wealthy hold the cards, as you know. It is like watching a hockey game where you own both teams. You can't lose. Once the players know this, there is no pursuit of excellence, as it does not matter.

That culture is why most countries can not compete with US innovation wise. They remove incentive for individuals to pursue excellence.

Thank you all for the friendly exchange(your patience) of non hockey issues. It is my birthday today and have to run some errands.
- TrueGrit

We were discussing incentive not the current economy. Many countries that may be classifies as socialist have as much or more incentive as anyone. No?

Or big bad Amazon with the tax break that would of brought 25,000 direct jobs (forget about the ancilliary ones like restaurants, cleaners, etc.) and the collection in sales and local taxes. And the tumble in housing prices as a result of being chased away.
- LAHawk

Love it.

I need to leave, but was going to point this out earlier.

Amazon is what is wrong with crony capitalism. Sweetheart deals with Post office, state Sales tax etc....

And you can't find anyone, except me, who refuses to buy anything from them, as they are destroying retail and competition. Everyone loves the prices, but soon, when they are all that is standing, the prices will rise and we all will be stuck. Meanwhile, the kill the economic viability of thousands of small businesses and PAY NO TAXES!!!!

Tonight's projected lineup posted on Second City Hockey. They didn't list DeBrincat but listed Sikura twice so I assume DeBrincat is 1st line and Sikura is 3rd. And they actually left off the Keith-Gustafsson pair. SCH apparently doesn't have an editor over there.

DeBrincat - Toews - Kane
Perlini - Strome - Kahun
Saad - Anisimov - Sikura
Kunitz - Kampf - Kruger

Keith - Gustafsson
Forsling - Seabrook
Koekkoek - Murphy

Crawford

First game in Arizona for Strome and Perlini since the trade. It's also Strome's 100th NHL game and Murphy's birthday today.

Love it.

I need to leave, but was going to point this out earlier.

Amazon is what is wrong with crony capitalism. Sweetheart deals with Post office, state Sales tax etc....

And you can't find anyone, except me, who refuses to buy anything from them, as they are destroying retail and competition. Everyone loves the prices, but soon, when they are all that is standing, the prices will rise and we all will be stuck. Meanwhile, the kill the economic viability of thousands of small businesses and PAY NO TAXES!!!!
- TrueGrit

So how do you fix it?

I agree 100%. Yet some classify them as socialist contries even though the real term should be something like Capitalist with regulation.
- paulr

How about democratic capitalism? A lot of good points have been made in the last two pages, and the consensus seems to be that wealth and power has been consolidated into a few hands, to the detriment of the rest of us. You could even argue the same thing about unions, the power is from the top down, not the bottom up.

So how do you fix it?
- paulr

Fix Chicago? I practice real estate law there. Not sure it can be fixed....

Tonight's projected lineup posted on Second City Hockey. They didn't list DeBrincat but listed Sikura twice so I assume DeBrincat is 1st line and Sikura is 3rd. And they actually left off the Keith-Gustafsson pair. SCH apparently doesn't have an editor over there.

DeBrincat - Toews - Kane
Perlini - Strome - Kahun
Saad - Anisimov - Sikura
Kunitz - Kampf - Kruger

Keith - Gustafsson
Forsling - Seabrook
Koekkoek - Murphy

Crawford

First game in Arizona for Strome and Perlini since the trade. It's also Strome's 100th NHL game and Murphy's birthday today.
- AEL_Fox

What made you think that this was a hockey board? The season's over, we were just starting to talk about stuff that actually affects us.

Not as transformative as from 1860-1890 here the US went from an agricultural society to the largest industrialized county in the world.
- LAHawk

The history of this country is such that you have many periods to choose from, each with their good and bad. I had one ancestor living in a sod house somewhere in the Plains during that period and another establishing life somewhere else following his experiences in the Civil War.

How about democratic capitalism? A lot of good points have been made in the last two pages, and the consensus seems to be that wealth and power has been consolidated into a few hands, to the detriment of the rest of us. You could even argue the same thing about unions, the power is from the top down, not the bottom up.
- Dieselhead

The 1% of the 1% and the craziest thing is they make more money on their money in day then I will make in my lifetime.

It is hard to even comprehend that concept.

Same with not for profit colleges. I went to Marquette for undergrad. Since I graduated in '09, 5 new buildings have gone up (surprise so has tuition). I am all for the private college system but something has to change. People at the top making millions while the school amasses tons of assets. Not sure how that really benefits the average student.

Here's a couple more MAGA definitions

Mueller Ain't Got Anything

Michael Avenattii Got Arrested.
- boilermaker100

Avenatti sure put himself in a bad hole.

What made you think that this was a hockey board? The season's over, we were just starting to talk about stuff that actually affects us.
- Dieselhead

I saw "capitalist" and thought people were talking about the Capitals. My bad.

Both my parents had the families split up during the depression. They told me of their dates taking the streetcar for 5 cents to go to the Hawks game and sitting in the second balcony for like a quarter a seat.
- LAHawk

It was a completely different world back then