The idea of keeping him and using him on the 3rd pair is bizarre to me. If you think that's best for the team, I don't see how you don't deal him.

Agree that he doesn't fit on the same team as Montour.
- Lunaion

It’s worst case scenario. Well second worst case. Worst case is another idiot coach playing him like he’s Ryan Suter.

If only Tim Murray was a patient putz...

I think Risto would be a fine #4 and I don’t think he’s overpaid by much at $5.4M but he needs the right usage and the right partner (Pilut) that is strong at zone exits and puck possession. If Risto can bring in the right player he’s definitely movable but we shouldn’t be moving him for the sake of moving him.
- Pegullaville

40 plus point nhl defenseman 24 years old

5.4m is not overpaid

40 plus point nhl defenseman 24 years old

5.4m is not overpaid
- Boss34

I’m w you Boss

I’m w you Boss
- Der Kaiser

Nobody cares

It’s worst case scenario. Well second worst case. Worst case is another idiot coach playing him like he’s Ryan Suter.
- sbroads24

Brent burns was played as a forward and then eventually traded by the Wild in 2010-2011 at the age of 27. Brent Burns didn’t even become the player we know today till he was 30. Risto has some obvious flaws but unless we are getting a long term 2C I’d keep him.

Brent burns was played as a forward and then eventually traded by the Wild in 2010-2011 at the age of 27. Brent Burns didn’t even become the player we know today till he was 30. Risto has some obvious flaws but unless we are getting a long term 2C I’d keep him.
- Pegullaville

We should keep him because in 4-5 years he might turn it around on another team?

I’m not following what you’re point is.

It isn’t working here, and he’s now 3rd on this depth chart at the most.

I can agree that he can look better in a different role. But he isn’t going to be Brent Burns here.

Over the last 3 seasons he’s 22nd in the league in O zone starts for D men.

He’s 9th in PP time during that span.

The only thing that will happen with “using him properly” will be his point total and reputation going downward
- sbroads24

What about his D-Zone starts?

But what relevance does that have?

Start him at 60% in the O-zone but cut his minutes and that at the very best keeps his production exactly the same?

Unless he’s paired with Dahlin he isn’t going to be the primary D man out with the Eichel line like he was up until January of this year
- sbroads24

How is that hard to understand? It keeps him out of the D-Zone. That's the whole point.

The actual number of O-Zone starts stays about the same but his D-Zone starts fall off the table.

What about his D-Zone starts?
- Wetbandit1

Again I agree it’s too much. Way too much.

But I fail to see how admitting he’s bad defensively “ups his value”

Either a team is going to say we can make him a top pairing D man and he’s just been in a bad situation or he’s going to turn into a 5 mil #4 D man ala Tyler Myers

How is that hard to understand? It keeps him out of the D-Zone. That's the whole point.
- Wetbandit1

Yes, keeping a d man out of the d zone because he can’t play d, while more than likely watching his point totals decrease with less minutes will have teams knocking down the door for him

Again I agree it’s too much. Way too much.

But I fail to see how admitting he’s bad defensively “ups his value”

Either a team is going to say we can make him a top pairing D man and he’s just been in a bad situation or he’s going to turn into a 5 mil #4 D man ala Tyler Myers
- sbroads24

Make lemonade. You can't keep trading guys for parts and futures.

We should keep him because in 4-5 years he might turn it around on another team?

I’m not following what you’re point is.

It isn’t working here, and he’s now 3rd on this depth chart at the most.

I can agree that he can look better in a different role. But he isn’t going to be Brent Burns here.
- sbroads24

The Wild didn’t think Brent Burns would be Brent Burns either. That’s my point. Risto has done in the last 3 years what only a few other d-men have done offensively in Sabres history (3 straight 40+ point seasons). If we gave Eichel 60% d-zone starts I’m sure his numbers wouldn’t be as good either. Risto will improve as the team around him improves and when they can play him in a normal role and not as a defensive specialist which he clearly isn’t.

The Wild didn’t think Brent Burns would be Brent Burns either. That’s my point. Risto has done in the last 3 years what only a few other d-men have done offensively in Sabres history (3 straight 40+ point seasons). If we gave Eichel 60% d-zone starts I’m sure his numbers wouldn’t be as good either. Risto will improve as the team around him improves and when they can play him in a normal role and not as a defensive specialist which he clearly isn’t.
- Pegullaville

For the love of god.

He’s top 25 in o zone start and top 10 in Pp time

He’s used everywhere

Wanna know how to decrease his D use? Have him stop getting hemmed in his end and icing the puck

McDavid is the best player in the world, will be the best player since Gretzky once his career is over. I’m the biggest Eichel supporter there is on this site but yes, I would move Eichel, Risto, Nylander and the two first rounders for McDavid.
- Pegullaville

We'll revisit this one in 3-5 years, or when all the players involved are at least 25

Make lemonade. You can't keep trading guys for parts and futures.
- Wetbandit1

Sure. And that’s fine. It’s just nonsensical to think it’s going to up his value

Sure. And that’s fine. It’s just nonsensical to think it’s going to up his value
- sbroads24

RHD who can play in all situations are always going to have value. Ask Toronto how easy it is to find one. I couldn’t believe that we got Montour when we did. There must be something to montour we haven’t seen yet in the small sample size that we saw him. If not we got fantastic value.

RHD who can play in all situations are always going to have value. Ask Toronto how easy it is to find one. I couldn’t believe that we got Montour when we did. There must be something to montour we haven’t seen yet in the small sample size that we saw him. If not we got fantastic value.
- Pegullaville

You mean the guy who’s situation were saying he can’t handle?

Listen, you want to argue he can be an effective 4 on a good team in the right spot, I’ll listen.

If we’re saying giving him 10-15% less D zone starts and hundreds of less minutes (lot of those with #9) is going to make him desirable I think that’s nuts.

It’s just going to turn him into Bogo and Myers. Decent #4 D men who pretty much everyone agrees are overpaid

You mean the guy who’s situation were saying he can’t handle?

Listen, you want to argue he can be an effective 4 on a good team in the right spot, I’ll listen.

If we’re saying giving him 10-15% less D zone starts and hundreds of less minutes (lot of those with #9) is going to make him desirable I think that’s nuts.

It’s just going to turn him into Bogo and Myers. Decent #4 D men who pretty much everyone agrees are overpaid
- sbroads24

I see both sides of the argument. I think he can be an effective #4, however I can see why we would want to maximize his value before Dahlin takes over PP1 minutes full time. With Bogo on the shelf though it would have to take an overpayment to move Risto.

Sure. And that’s fine. It’s just nonsensical to think it’s going to up his value
- sbroads24

Why do I give a poop about his value if I'm keeping him?

I see both sides of the argument. I think he can be an effective #4, however I can see why we would want to maximize his value before Dahlin takes over PP1 minutes full time. With Bogo on the shelf though it would have to take an overpayment to move Risto.
- Pegullaville

It just all depends on how good you think he is.

I think he’s bordering on being a bottom pairing D man.

I see the flashes of brilliance which gives me pause, but it’s few and far between.

I would trade him for almost any young top 6 forward.

And to be quite honest, IMO, playing on a bad team is the singular reason he’s scored so much. His PP points with Eichel wouldn’t be there on a team like TB. He wouldn’t sniff O zone time down by a goal on a team like NSH with Ellis/Subban/Josi ahead of him

Why do I give a poop about his value if I'm keeping him?
- Wetbandit1

Because the post you responded to was strictly taking about upping his value

I see both sides of the argument. I think he can be an effective #4, however I can see why we would want to maximize his value before Dahlin takes over PP1 minutes full time. With Bogo on the shelf though it would have to take an overpayment to move Risto.
- Pegullaville

If Dahlin hasn't taken over those PP1 duty, I don't want that coach.

If Dahlin hasn't taken over those PP1 duty, I don't want that coach.
- Lunaion

Dahlin should be this upcoming season. There are a few months in between today and the game opener though. That’s what I was referring to. If someone overpays for Risto, then move him. If not, keep him and bring his minutes down to the 18-20 minute range and upgrade the team around him and we won’t notice his deficiencies as much.

Because the post you responded to was strictly taking about upping his value
- sbroads24

I was responding to the bolded. The fact that you, twice, mentioned his actual O-Zone starts without giving his much higher D-Zone starts. And you damn well know that the ratio is more important than either number on its own. And by keeping the O-Zone about equal but drastically reducing his D-zone starts makes him a better player.

I agree, I think Montour makes Risto redundant. Theyre both 2nd pair, RHD, PP guys imo. But if the return sucks this year, they need to suck it up and play Risto in a 3rd pair role for 15 minutes a night, give him 60-65% o zone starts in a 3rd pair role where he's overpaid, and watch his value skyrocket.

But if there's a nice return for him this off-season, you take it
- jcragcrumple

Or just pair Risto with Dahlin