Ok. I'll argue it all I want: Nylander was bad this year. There's no denying that. He had his moments when he got his legs moving, but his hands didn't follow. He is far better than his results this year showed, and next year is the year to decide. You don't bail on him now unless someone is buying high.

My argument is that he is more IMPORTANT than Kapanen, Hyman or Kadri because of what I believe he will do. If he sucks next year, then it's too bad, but if he breaks camp with the team and plays with the team, I'd expect him to regain his form and have a natural progression from his 2018 results. THAT Nylander is someone who is important.

I'd agree that Marleau is probably staying, but let's see how he feels in August. I am torn on Zaitsev. He was good in the playoffs - if he can play like that, his $4.5m isn't too bad. If he plays like he did for a large portion of the season . . .ugh!

If they're looking for cap relief, it's a certainty that Brown goes. Then you're probably looking at Johnsson. Most of the talent on the Marlies are lefties - Korshkov, Engvall, Mikheyev, Timashov and Marchment; only Bracco is a righty.
- Monkeypunk

so Nylander is a great player because you believe he is..

With all the signings thus far and the current cap-situation...I believe this will most-likely take place this off-season...

W.Nylander - Traded (Free-Up Cap space. Return: Prospect or D /Draft pick? - Replaced by Bracco)
C.Brown - Traded ($2.1 Mill can be replaced by a cheaper forward option internally - Mikheyev?)
A.Johnsson - Traded (will want too much money...will fetch a prospect player - replaced by Petan?)
T.Ennis - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Marchment or Brooks)
J.Gardiner - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Sandin or Liljegren)
R.Hainsey - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Rosen)

With all the signings thus far and the current cap-situation...I believe this will most-likely take place this off-season...

W.Nylander - Traded (Free-Up Cap space. Return: Prospect or D /Draft pick? - Replaced by Bracco)
C.Brown - Traded ($2.1 Mill can be replaced by a cheaper forward option internally - Mikheyev?)
A.Johnsson - Traded (will want too much money...will fetch a prospect player - replaced by Petan?)
T.Ennis - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Marchment or Brooks)
J.Gardiner - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Sandin or Liljegren)
R.Hainsey - Not Re-signed (will be replaced internally - Rosen)
- Sandro

Moore replaces brown. Bracco replaces nylander. Sandin replaces gardiner. Dman acquired in nylander deal replaces hainsey. Hutch replaces sparks.

I personally don't think we are going to have to pay Johnson and kap as much as people think on bridge deals. We didn't have to pay K adri that much on his....or Reilly even on a long term one. I know that was then and this is now, but they (kap and johnsson) had 40 point seasons....not exactly something that deserves that much attention.
And hainsey will come back on a much cheaper deal.

so Nylander is a great player because you believe he is..
- MaximusAurelius

It's more than just me who believes that, but basically when you bet on potential, that's how it works, yes.

I would still bet on his potential.

Moore replaces brown. Bracco replaces nylander. Sandin replaces gardiner. Dman acquired in nylander deal replaces hainsey. Hutch replaces sparks.

I personally don't think we are going to have to pay Johnson and kap as much as people think on bridge deals. We didn't have to pay K adri that much on his....or Reilly even on a long term one. I know that was then and this is now, but they (kap and johnsson) had 40 point seasons....not exactly something that deserves that much attention.
And hainsey will come back on a much cheaper deal.
- mykokes

Gardiner averaged 21:13 TOI/G last year.

You really want to hand those minutes to a guy who has played 0:00 TOI in the NHL?

Moore replaces brown. Bracco replaces nylander. Sandin replaces gardiner. Dman acquired in nylander deal replaces hainsey. Hutch replaces sparks.

I personally don't think we are going to have to pay Johnson and kap as much as people think on bridge deals. We didn't have to pay K adri that much on his....or Reilly even on a long term one. I know that was then and this is now, but they (kap and johnsson) had 40 point seasons....not exactly something that deserves that much attention.
And hainsey will come back on a much cheaper deal.
- mykokes

I don't know about Hainsey.

I agree about Kap and Johnsson, though. I think 2x$2.2 for Kap and maybe 1x$2 for Johnsson, assuming he takes arbitration. Of course I thought Nylander would come in around $6.5 and Matthews at $10.5, so who knows!

Gardiner averaged 21:13 TOI/G last year.

You really want to hand those minutes to a guy who has played 0:00 TOI in the NHL?
- Atomic Wedgie

Why not? Mccavoy, Carlo, and so many others before have done it. This isn't like schenn, telling you this kid is the real deal.

And if you really want to discuss gardiners icetime...how many minutes was he getting in the Bruins series?

that's life as a leafs fan my friend
- Symba.007

Sometimes, we get nice things.

Then they get broken.

Gardiner averaged 21:13 TOI/G last year.

You really want to hand those minutes to a guy who has played 0:00 TOI in the NHL?
- Atomic Wedgie

Don't Kid yourself, I would not be surprised if a guy like Rasmus Sandin can come in next season and play 20 minutes a night. This guy is a solid all-round D-Man. our best D-Man in our system.
the good thing is, you have Rielly back there, as your work-horse.

And those who say Babcock hides kids on the bench or in the press box, this team is littered with kids that have been thrown into prominent roles, once they have shown there abilities.

Babcock is just stupidly stubborn at times. It's always been his way or no way.

Don't Kid yourself, I would not be surprised if a guy like Rasmus Sandin can come in next season and play 20 minutes a night. This guy is a solid all-round D-Man. our best D-Man in our system.
the good thing is, you have Rielly back there, as your work-horse.
- Sandro

And muzzin is more than capable of playing big minutes too. While he won't put up gardiners points, he is that little bit different type this team needed.

- AdamFrench

?

I should add it also doesn't have to be nylander that's moved, it can also be K adri.

And muzzin is more than capable of playing big minutes too. While he won't put up gardiners points, he is that little bit different type this team needed.
- mykokes

I agree..Muzzin can play 20-22 min a night. he will def chip-in offensively. he will give you 40-45 points.

Gardiner averaged 21:13 TOI/G last year.

You really want to hand those minutes to a guy who has played 0:00 TOI in the NHL?
- Atomic Wedgie

Other teams do it, why not the Leafs? Seriously, look around the NHL. Teams going farther are doing that.
Dermott's usage should be much higher already than it is.

Ron Hainsey on the 1st pair is worse than having a rookie take those minutes.

Why not? Mccavoy, Carlo, and so many others before have done it. This isn't like schenn, telling you this kid is the real deal.

And if you really want to discuss gardiners icetime...how many minutes was he getting in the Bruins series?
- mykokes

He was injured.

You want to bring in Sandin? OK.

But don't say he replaces Gardiner. Somebody else is going to have to step into those minutes, and putting a rookie there (in the Toronto limelight) is homicide.

And those who say Babcock hides kids on the bench or in the press box, this team is littered with kids that have been thrown into prominent roles, once they have shown there abilities.

Babcock is just stupidly stubborn at times. It's always been his way or no way.
- mykokes

surely Sandin / Liljegren or both could get time next season.
but protected minutes like Babcock does with most of the young guys.

So your top 4 d-men in TOI will be Rielly Muzzin Dermott and Zaitsev, with the other guys getting less time.

The issue on D is who are going to be your 4 PK'ing D-men; Zaitsev and Muzzin and then Dermott and ?? or are we going to put Rielly on the PK?
Leafs need a 3rd pairing D-man that is good at penalty killing.

So it seems quite obvious that Leafs are looking for a 2nd/3rd pairing that knows how to kill penalties, ideally right handed.

so Nylander is a great player because you believe he is..
- MaximusAurelius

As pissed as I was at nylander during these playoffs, fact is he is a player that's already at 22 capable of putting up 20 plus goals and 60 points. He has a lot of growing up to do sure, but will he get better....the evidence that he will far outweighs your opinion. I grant you that is he what this team needs going forward is a fair question. But the way you go on about how much he sucks is somewhat absurd.

He was injured.

You want to bring in Sandin? OK.

But don't say he replaces Gardiner. Somebody else is going to have to step into those minutes, and putting a rookie there (in the Toronto limelight) is homicide.
- Atomic Wedgie

People wanted to run Carlo out of town last year in his sophomore season as a 20-21 year old. I could only imagine what could happen in Toronto.

I should add it also doesn't have to be nylander that's moved, it can also be K adri.
- mykokes

If Marner signs for 9.5, Kap for 2.5, Johnsson for 2, and you trade Brown . . .

You end up with:

Hyman-Tavares-Marner
Johnsson-Matthews-Nylander
Moore-Kadri-Kapanen
Marleau-Gauthier-Petan

Rielly-Dermott
Muzzin-Zaitsev
Sandin-Rosen

Andersen
Sparks

Which totals $80.6m, unless I've made a mistake - leaving about $2.5m extra, before using Horton's IR. Which means there is room for improvement on top of what they have.

I should add it also doesn't have to be nylander that's moved, it can also be K adri.
- mykokes

If Marleau is ready to move on then this is all moot but assuming he isn't (and that's what it sounded like from his exit interview) then they've got work to do.

I think the market will determine what route they take. If someone is willing to part with an affordable top pairing RH dman then Nylander can go. If not then they'll have to piece together a couple of moves that save cap space. Is the full contract of NZ tradeable? If so then moving him and Brown might be the best option.

If Marleau refuses to move on and nobody's offering enough for Nylander and nobody's willing to take NZ's contract then they turn some combination of Brown plus Kapanen or Johnsson or maybe Kadri.

He was injured.

You want to bring in Sandin? OK.

But don't say he replaces Gardiner. Somebody else is going to have to step into those minutes, and putting a rookie there (in the Toronto limelight) is homicide.
- Atomic Wedgie

For those of us that lived through the 80's ...amen.

He was injured.

You want to bring in Sandin? OK.

But don't say he replaces Gardiner. Somebody else is going to have to step into those minutes, and putting a rookie there (in the Toronto limelight) is homicide.
- Atomic Wedgie

Didn't seem to hurt Reilly, and again, how many minutes was gardiner playing in the Bruins series wedgie. And it can't be homicide as there are too many other lightning rods on this team that draw our attention. Case in point, nylander. This isn't the leafs of the 80s where every kid was a savior. The saviors are already here.

And it took a good 3 years before everyone turned on gardiner, and Murphy and Phaneuf were vets.

The kids on d we go east on, schenn got a 4 year bye, Reilly stunk a few years in and we have him a break. A 20 year old kaberle and Markov walked on this team as kids with no issues. And sandin really might be the best of this group (maybe not Reilly in terms of upside, but much more mature at the same age if you ask me.)

surely Sandin / Liljegren or both could get time next season.
but protected minutes like Babcock does with most of the young guys.

So your top 4 d-men in TOI will be Rielly Muzzin Dermott and Zaitsev, with the other guys getting less time.

The issue on D is who are going to be your 4 PK'ing D-men; Zaitsev and Muzzin and then Dermott and ?? or are we going to put Rielly on the PK?
Leafs need a 3rd pairing D-man that is good at penalty killing.

So it seems quite obvious that Leafs are looking for a 2nd/3rd pairing that knows how to kill penalties, ideally right handed.
- MaximusAurelius

Babcock has been very reluctant to pair Rielly with Dermott and/or Zaitsev. I think they're going to either bide their time with another year of Hainsey or add somebody via trade. Muzzin and Zaitsev on pairing two and Dermott/Rosen on pairing three ...something like that.