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Forums :: Vancouver Canucks :: HB Thinktank - Socialism vs. Capitalism: a false dichotomy
Author Message
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 7:58 PM ET
All of the boomers are seniors now, they mostly collect and still hold a lot of money and property.

This was never going to be an easy time on the rest of the population. It's bad, but it could be much worse. It will get better.

- golfingsince

The 90's and 2000 to 2015 period were the best times to become prosperous with personal wealth, the current generation of kids coming into the workforce will have a much more difficult time unless things change dramatically.
golfingsince
Location: This message is Marwood approved!
Joined: 11.30.2011

Oct 3 @ 7:59 PM ET
You wouldn't know this because you do nothing but take from society, you contribute nothing, however, I'm trying to relay to him that being of good social standing does not preclude you from having an opinion on the state of affairs in your country.

Between my brothers and sisters and I we have eight young adult children between the ages of 25 and 35 trying to make a go of things, it's not as rosy as he would make it seem.

- Pacificgem


Meh, there's path.

I have a teen and a pre-teen and in many ways the path(s) seem much easier than when I was at their place in life. It involves hard work, an that's taught at home........or should be.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:05 PM ET
Meh, there's path.

I have a teen and a pre-teen and in many ways the path(s) seem much easier than when I was at their place in life. It involves hard work, an that's taught at home........or should be.

- golfingsince

Oh it's not dire, for them, but it is concerning. I know they struggle, and that's not necessarily a bad thing as it builds character and wherewithal. When I first graduated from university I was making $18 an hour and was able to buy a seven year old house for $68,000. That's just a fairytale now, the housing crisis in Canada is a major issue for younger generation Canadians.

If you're personal wealth is great, though, your opinions are hollow and meaningless, apparently.
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: The Clit Whisperer
Joined: 10.22.2011

Oct 3 @ 8:06 PM ET
Because, as I said, I have grown children who are trying to make it in the country and I have siblings and friends my age who's kids and families are trying to start life as adults in the country. We discuss current events, I apparently see the country different than you. I'm not sticking my head in the sand pretending nothing is wrong because my life is good. You just come off like you don't really see any issues in Canada, kinda blasé, because your life is good everyone's life must be good, I don't feel that way.

You continually fall back into this false narrative that because my life is good that I shouldn't be alarmed about the state of our country, like you're not alarmed. I don't feel that way, despite my social standing. You're not concerned, I am.

- Pacificgem


Oh, I think there are issues that need attention. I've been more vocal about it than most. But I'm not going to exaggerate and say crazy shit like "never seen anything like it before" and use the term "broken" for long standing, systemic Canadian issues like taxes, economy, healthcare, and housing.

Ask your Dad what it was like in the 80's when inflation hit 14% and the highest earners were being charged 70% income tax. Just for comparison, today's inflation is 2% and highest income tax rate is 33%.

Every Canadian generation has economic issue to deal with. You thinking that today's or tomorrow's generation has it so hard. As the numbers show, it's just not true. Previous generations have had it so much worse. Stop being such an alarmist.
golfingsince
Location: This message is Marwood approved!
Joined: 11.30.2011

Oct 3 @ 8:08 PM ET
The 90's and 2000 to 2015 period were the best times to become prosperous with personal wealth, the current generation of kids coming into the workforce will have a much more difficult time unless things change dramatically.
- Pacificgem


Either the health standard will rise substantially or the cost will drop dramatically. At the 2021 census boomers still accounted for a 1/4 of our population. My 87 year old aunt just had her 2nd hip replaced on the taxpayers dime last week. She paid into it, she's entitled to it. Right now, there's an imbalance between who's paying in and who's drawing from it. It will change.

We will always pay more because our land is so vast, wether it's taxes for infrastructure or freight charges laid into the cost of goods. We do not produce enough at home, or even regionally.

We do not need to send our kids into the world at 18. Education is readily available closer to home, at a fraction of the cost for most people. You do not need Harvard Law to practice in Huntsville. With online learning so advanced, you can literally get a top education no matter where you live.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:19 PM ET
Oh, I think there are issues that need attention. I've been more vocal about it than most. But I'm not going to exaggerate and say crazy shit like "never seen anything like it before" and use the term "broken" for long standing, systemic Canadian issues like taxes, economy, healthcare, and housing.

Ask your Dad what it was like in the 80's when inflation hit 14% and the highest earners were being charged 70% income tax. Just for comparison, today's inflation is 2% and highest income tax rate is 33%.

Every Canadian generation has economic issue to deal with. You thinking that today's or tomorrow's generation has it so hard. As the numbers show, it's just not true. Previous generations have had it so much worse. Stop being such an alarmist.

- bloatedmosquito

Now I think you're the one whose exaggerating lol, "crazy shit" haha...that's rich. You know the truth, those of us under 90 years old (or something like that) have never seen or been through a global pandemic, as in "we've never seen anything like that before" or the financial fall-out from it. Sure, we'll get through it, if we change the government out to one that doesn't spend freely like the current one.

And broken, I believe that's a perfectly suitable word for a government who refuses to generate money for the country despite the wealth of natural resources available to it. Their system of governance is broken and failing Canadians.

All that being said, you're reading to much into my typed words, I'm concerned, clearly, but things could be much worse, and they will be if things don't change, but we have not hit Soviet standard of living levels yet....if you keep voting Liberal we will though!!
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:25 PM ET
I love it, some good exchanges, no personal attacks, well I did attack Weedwood because he's such a useless twat, but a good exchange...time for a cigar and a Dos Equis out by the pool.
golfingsince
Location: This message is Marwood approved!
Joined: 11.30.2011

Oct 3 @ 8:29 PM ET
I love it, some good exchanges, no personal attacks, well I did attack Weedwood because he's such a useless twat, but a good exchange...time for a cigar and a Dos Equis out by the pool.
- Pacificgem

Desperate times call for desperate measures
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: The Clit Whisperer
Joined: 10.22.2011

Oct 3 @ 8:37 PM ET
I love it, some good exchanges, no personal attacks, well I did attack Weedwood because he's such a useless twat, but a good exchange...time for a cigar and a Dos Equis out by the pool.
- Pacificgem


Atta boy.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:43 PM ET
Atta boy.
- bloatedmosquito

You come across as someone who’s very serious, you’re not a lot of fun at parties are you. By the book bloated. Another good alt for you.

You know, if you’re not exaggerating a little bit on a public anonymous forum, you’re not really trying.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:46 PM ET
Desperate times call for desperate measures
- golfingsince

We have a double door fridge in our garage, it’s chalked full of on sale beers, my wife just can’t help herself. She loves a good deal. Whether we need it or not. Women are just built differently with their thought processes. She needs to go back to work or go back to volunteering.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 8:55 PM ET
🚨 Breaking: Initial reports that Hashem Safieddine, Hezbollah's new leader that replaced Nasrallah, was eliminated moments ago.


Heaven must be running out of virgins!!
Marwood
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Cumberland, BC
Joined: 03.18.2010

Oct 3 @ 9:04 PM ET
🚨 Breaking: Initial reports that Hashem Safieddine, Hezbollah's new leader that replaced Nasrallah, was eliminated moments ago.


Heaven must be running out of virgins!!

- Pacificgem

Well, if heaven runs out of beer they know where to send people.
golfingsince
Location: This message is Marwood approved!
Joined: 11.30.2011

Oct 3 @ 9:25 PM ET
Well, if heaven runs out of beer they know where to send people.
- Marwood

XX marks the spot
bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: The Clit Whisperer
Joined: 10.22.2011

Oct 3 @ 9:39 PM ET
You come across as someone who’s very serious, you’re not a lot of fun at parties are you. By the book bloated. Another good alt for you.

You know, if you’re not exaggerating a little bit on a public anonymous forum, you’re not really trying.

- Pacificgem


I'm just debating for something to do. I'm off this week to use up my accumulated vacation time. Using up 300+ hours of paid vacation is not easy to do, especially as a Project Manager. See, I'm struggling too.
boonerbuck
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Not Quesnel, BC
Joined: 10.11.2005

Oct 3 @ 11:00 PM ET
I agree that Israel is looking for war. They have been trying to eliminate Palestinians for a very long time. But please, you make it sound like the "Palestinians" are somehow absolved from any wrong doing themselves. That's a bit naive.

What about Black September?

What about the Palestinian insurgency in South Lebanon?

What about the Sadat assassination?

How about the four civil wars in Gaza between Fatah and Hamas?

Palestinians have a complicated history throughout the region. Not all conflict in the region involves Israel. There's a reason why there is little sympathy for the Palestinian cause throughout the Arab world. They have burned many bridges (pun intended) through their own actions outside of their conflict with Israel.

Saying that, Israel's gone all in on their Dahiya Doctrine in regards to Gaza, and I don't think anyone is going to stop them.

- bloatedmosquito


Jews and Muslims coexisted peacefully in Palestine before Europeans created Israel. Ironically, it was Europeans who tried to exterminate Jews in Europe followed by Europeans/USA who wouldn't take the displaced people and decided to hand over land to them that wasn't theirs to give. We are told it was humanitarian but you can count on it being a ploy by the west to keep a forever foothold in the middle east.

Before all that, Iran was Jewish friendly with a long existence of peace going back to the days when the conquering Persians released the Jews from Babylonian captivity. This is all on USA and Europe. Everything after the creation is cause and effect. People love to bring up what the Palestinians have done to Israel. This was not an issue before our people in the west created the situation. In fact, it was the Zionists engaged in what is called terrorism when the shoe is on the other foot with bombing and ambushes. Of course the narrative is "freedom fighters" in our history books, schools and media.

The British back stabbed the Palestinians. They promised to return Palestine to the Arabs if they sided with the British against the Ottomans. They pushed the Turks out together and the promise was never fulfilled. Instead, this is what the people who helped us defeat the Ottomans got. Their homes and land stolen by the hundreds of thousands by Europeans(not even middle easterners), shoved into the worlds largest refugee camp and getting exterminated.


bloatedmosquito
Vancouver Canucks
Location: The Clit Whisperer
Joined: 10.22.2011

Oct 3 @ 11:14 PM ET
Jews and Muslims coexisted peacefully in Palestine before Europeans created Israel. Ironically, it was Europeans who tried to exterminate Jews in Europe followed by Europeans/USA who wouldn't take the displaced people and decided to hand over land to them that wasn't theirs to give. We are told it was humanitarian but you can count on it being a ploy by the west to keep a forever foothold in the middle east.

Before all that, Iran was Jewish friendly with a long existence of peace going back to the days when the conquering Persians released the Jews from Babylonian captivity. This is all on USA and Europe. Everything after the creation is cause and effect. People love to bring up what the Palestinians have done to Israel. This was not an issue before our people in the west created the situation. In fact, it was the Zionists engaged in what is called terrorism when the shoe is on the other foot with bombing and ambushes. Of course the narrative is "freedom fighters" in our history books, schools and media.

The British back stabbed the Palestinians. They promised to return Palestine to the Arabs if they sided with the British against the Ottomans. They pushed the Turks out together and the promise was never fulfilled. Instead, this is what the people who helped us defeat the Ottomans got. Their homes and land stolen by the hundreds of thousands by Europeans(not even middle easterners), shoved into the worlds largest refugee camp and getting exterminated.

- boonerbuck


I don't know where you're getting this account of history but it's wrong.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 3 @ 11:19 PM ET
Jews and Muslims coexisted peacefully in Palestine before Europeans created Israel. Ironically, it was Europeans who tried to exterminate Jews in Europe followed by Europeans/USA who wouldn't take the displaced people and decided to hand over land to them that wasn't theirs to give. We are told it was humanitarian but you can count on it being a ploy by the west to keep a forever foothold in the middle east.

Before all that, Iran was Jewish friendly with a long existence of peace going back to the days when the conquering Persians released the Jews from Babylonian captivity. This is all on USA and Europe. Everything after the creation is cause and effect. People love to bring up what the Palestinians have done to Israel. This was not an issue before our people in the west created the situation. In fact, it was the Zionists engaged in what is called terrorism when the shoe is on the other foot with bombing and ambushes. Of course the narrative is "freedom fighters" in our history books, schools and media.

The British back stabbed the Palestinians. They promised to return Palestine to the Arabs if they sided with the British against the Ottomans. They pushed the Turks out together and the promise was never fulfilled. Instead, this is what the people who helped us defeat the Ottomans got. Their homes and land stolen by the hundreds of thousands by Europeans(not even middle easterners), shoved into the worlds largest refugee camp and getting exterminated.

- boonerbuck

There’s no such thing as Palestine and the Land of Israel existed in and before biblical times, long before Europe existed. That differs from the current bordered version, but the Land of Israel is thousands of years old. Israelite culture was largely Canaanite in nature.
boonerbuck
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Not Quesnel, BC
Joined: 10.11.2005

Oct 3 @ 11:37 PM ET
There’s no such thing as Palestine and the Land of Israel existed in biblical times, long before Europe existed. That differs from the current bordered version, but the Land of Israel is thousands of years old.
- Pacificgem


You realize you are contradicting yourself in this post. You say there is no such thing as Palestine but follow that up with the land of Israel being mentioned in the Bible thousands of years ago. If that's supposed to be some kind of validation... then let me you remind you that Palestine is also spoken of in the bible and the name remained until less than a century ago.

The state of Israel is a European creation. This is a fact. The kingdom of the Jews was actually called Judah which included what is now Jordan and Syria and other neighboring countries. Israel was also the land of the Caninities. Caninities, Jews, Arabs, Persians, Greeks, Romans, many have occupied this land after stealing it from others. Who were the first? None of them.
boonerbuck
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Not Quesnel, BC
Joined: 10.11.2005

Oct 3 @ 11:52 PM ET
I don't know where you're getting this account of history but it's wrong.
- bloatedmosquito


How do you figure the Brits didnt (frank) over the Palestinians and Arabs? Yes, many still fought for the Ottomans, but it was promised to the Arabs if they helped drive out the Ottomans which they did, and things would be different. By giving it to European Jews, and backing the Zionists, this situation was created.

Don't tell me you are one of those people that buy that this was started over hate and religion? It was proven these people could coexist in the region. Clearly this is a post 1948 issue. You can read interviews with elderly people talking about Jews and Arabs living in the same neighborhoods babysitting each other's children and living peacefully. The Zionists were bombing the British then. Not because of occupation but for a radical ideal. Zionism.
Pacificgem
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Swedish4Ever, BC
Joined: 07.01.2007

Oct 4 @ 12:27 AM ET
You realize you are contradicting yourself in this post. You say there is no such thing as Palestine but follow that up with the land of Israel being mentioned in the Bible thousands of years ago. If that's supposed to be some kind of validation... then let me you remind you that Palestine is also spoken of in the bible and the name remained until less than a century ago.

The state of Israel is a European creation. This is a fact. The kingdom of the Jews was actually called Judah which included what is now Jordan and Syria and other neighboring countries. Israel was also the land of the Caninities. Caninities, Jews, Arabs, Persians, Greeks, Romans, many have occupied this land after stealing it from others. Who were the first? None of them.

- boonerbuck

You wrote “Europeans created Israel”, which is untrue, they created the State of Israel. I’m just arguing semantics in your verbiage, as the Land of Israel has been around for thousands of years.

Also, I misspoke, as you know, you’re correct in that the historical Palestine region has also been around for thousands of years, a name given to the region by the Romans, however, there is no current universally recognized state or country of Palestine.
boonerbuck
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Not Quesnel, BC
Joined: 10.11.2005

Oct 4 @ 1:07 AM ET
You wrote “Europeans created Israel”, which is untrue, they created the State of Israel. I’m just arguing semantics in your verbiage, as the Land of Israel has been around for thousands of years.

Also, I misspoke, as you know, you’re correct in that the historical Palestine region has also been around for thousands of years, a name given to the region by the Romans, however, there is no current universally recognized state or country of Palestine.

- Pacificgem


Yes, I'm talking about the state of Israel being created by Europeans. It was the theme of the posts so there should be no confusion. With that being said, there was never a sovereignty called Israel before 1948 either. Moot argument if anyone tries to attempt that. many people try to discredit sympathy for these people with that argument which is purely cherry picking.

Universities are only 2nd to USA congress for letting the Israeli lobby set their policies and curriculum. Students have all kinds of freedoms to protest etc yet anything supporting the Palestinians is banned. Even showing a flag which is common enough in universities even if against policy which is ignored usually unless it's nazi/confederate etc... imagine being lumped in with them... No issues if you protested things like African apartheid(in the past) yet protest apartheid in Israel... and that is exactly what it is, and you are a racist monster and can kiss your education goodbye.
DariusKnight
Vancouver Canucks
Location: "The Alien has landed in Vancouver!"
Joined: 03.09.2006

Oct 4 @ 2:07 AM ET
Now I think you're the one whose exaggerating lol, "crazy shit" haha...that's rich. You know the truth, those of us under 90 years old (or something like that) have never seen or been through a global pandemic, as in "we've never seen anything like that before" or the financial fall-out from it. Sure, we'll get through it, if we change the government out to one that doesn't spend freely like the current one.

And broken, I believe that's a perfectly suitable word for a government who refuses to generate money for the country despite the wealth of natural resources available to it. Their system of governance is broken and failing Canadians.

All that being said, you're reading to much into my typed words, I'm concerned, clearly, but things could be much worse, and they will be if things don't change, but we have not hit Soviet standard of living levels yet....if you keep voting Liberal we will though!!

- Pacificgem


Yeah, bullpoop man, there was the Spanish Flu just before the Great Depression. You're not winning that argument.
boonerbuck
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Not Quesnel, BC
Joined: 10.11.2005

Oct 5 @ 2:01 AM ET


Uh huh...
LordHumungous
Vancouver Canucks
Location: Greetings from the Humungous. Ayatollah of rock and rolla!
Joined: 08.15.2014

Oct 5 @ 2:57 PM ET
Outstanding!!!

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