Fair enough, I wouldn’t have thought Trouba was considered an 8M guy, but Can’t say I would be surprised.
- stackthepads

He's 25 years old RHD entering his prime years and just put up a 50 point season. He's been trending upward every season. I think we see $8M and still think about Letang, but think about how long ago Letang signed that contract. We have to compare relative to the market, not necessarily past contracts. Plus, as I pointed out earlier, this is a thin market.

Hell, I can see someone paying Edler $5M in this market.

Hell, I can see someone paying Edler $5M in this market.
- Rinosaur

I think I read somewhere on a Vancouver website that he was looking to get a contract closer in the 6 million range.

I would love to have Trouba, but I think someone would out bid us in a trade. I do hope Schultz holds some value with WPG. I think if JR can get rid of JJ. Somehow upgrade our Defense and get us another solid winger (if Kessel is moved). I think we will have a successful off-season. I am still hoping he doesn't blow the offseason by signing Simmons, Phaneuf or some other player who is regressing quickly.

Okay... Jack Johnson gone yet?

Fair enough, I wouldn’t have thought Trouba was considered an 8M guy, but Can’t say I would be surprised.
- stackthepads

The guy produces at a 1st pairing rate for a defenseman and is stout at defense although not necessarily elite. All around defenseman that don’t have holes in their game like him are rare. He’s not elite but he’s very good. Next tier down.

The guy produces at a 1st pairing rate for a defenseman and is stout at defense although not necessarily elite. All around defenseman that don’t have holes in their game like him are rare. He’s not elite but he’s very good. Next tier down.
- Victoro311

That's why I can at least consider him, because he's so solid all around. He had a career best offensive year and might not be a top PP option right now.

The other point is his youth, this contract is the rare one that will probably look better in a few years as salaries rise and he is still in his prime.

interesting tidbit from the PG:

Only three of the 25 selections Rutherford has made as Pittsburgh’s GM have played in the NHL. Two of them — Kapanen and Daniel Sprong — have been traded. The other is Dominik Simon, a nice fifth-round find for the Penguins back in 2015.

also Molinari just posted an article about Rutherford wanting more leadership in the locker room. Ugh that is such a dangerous sign to me.

also Molinari just posted an article about Rutherford wanting more leadership in the locker room. Ugh that is such a dangerous sign to me.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yeah that's brutal to hear. Probably means another year of Cullen too.

Okay... Jack Johnson gone yet?
- Guile

Now he won’t be playing with a top 100 player in the league like Toews, although I’m willing to bet the lesser Russian Evgeni Malkin will be able to help him out a little bit if that is the route the Penguins take.
- Ryan_Wilson

interesting tidbit from the PG:

Only three of the 25 selections Rutherford has made as Pittsburgh’s GM have played in the NHL. Two of them — Kapanen and Daniel Sprong — have been traded. The other is Dominik Simon, a nice fifth-round find for the Penguins back in 2015.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

True, but that's only going back 4 drafts, meaning that most of the players are going to spend at least 2 years in juniors before becoming pro, and most will need AHL time. Couple in the fact that he's had no first round picks since 2014 (his own doing), it's not surprising.

Yeah that's brutal to hear. Probably means another year of Cullen too.
- MattStrat

"Rutherford, it should be noted, doesn’t think better intangibles are the Penguins’ only need. He cited identifying – and, if necessary, acquiring – a few strong defensive forwards as a priority in coming months."

Seriously...reading this article is a rollercoaster... there is a glimmer of hope and then its slammed down with the thought of "defensive forwards". We're going to trade Phil for some guy that scores 12-15 goals but is known to be a 200 ft player and a good locker room guy.

True, but that's only going back 4 drafts, meaning that most of the players are going to spend at least 2 years in juniors before becoming pro, and most will need AHL time. Couple in the fact that he's had no first round picks since 2014 (his own doing), it's not surprising.
- jmatchett383

Good point. Some of the guys still show promise (Bjorksqvist, Drozg, Addison) of becoming NHLers. Last year's draft seemed to buck GMJR's trend of drafting grit (Hall, Lauzon, etc) and getting players with actual upside. Not to mention the non-drafted players JR has pursued like ZAR and Plotnikov.

"Rutherford, it should be noted, doesn’t think better intangibles are the Penguins’ only need. He cited identifying – and, if necessary, acquiring – a few strong defensive forwards as a priority in coming months."

Seriously...reading this article is a rollercoaster... there is a glimmer of hope and then its slammed down with the thought of "defensive forwards". We're going to trade Phil for some guy that scores 12-15 goals but is known to be a 200 ft player and a good locker room guy.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

hahaha

Not sure how any of us can trust the man with cap space...

That's why I can at least consider him, because he's so solid all around. He had a career best offensive year and might not be a top PP option right now.

The other point is his youth, this contract is the rare one that will probably look better in a few years as salaries rise and he is still in his prime.
- Tojo.

Hits Pts/60 at even strength has actually been remarkably consistent the past 3 seasons at 1.2, 1.2, and 1.3, which for a defenseman is pretty damn good. I agree that his raw production will take a dip here due to lack of PP1 time, but his production last year only looks inflated because he actually played 82 games which he hadn’t done before since his like second season. He’s been playing at the same high level for about three seasons now.

also Molinari just posted an article about Rutherford wanting more leadership in the locker room. Ugh that is such a dangerous sign to me.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Probably a big part of why Hornqvist won't be traded.

Hits Pts/60 at even strength has actually been remarkably consistent the past 3 seasons at 1.2, 1.2, and 1.3, which for a defenseman is pretty damn good. I agree that his raw production will take a dip here due to lack of PP1 time, but his production last year only looks inflated because he actually played 82 games which he hadn’t done before since his like second season. He’s been playing at the same high level for about three seasons now.
- Victoro311

Yeah I wasn't disagreeing with anything you said. He got more PP time and put up bigger numbers this year, but otherwise he's the same guy.

If spending big on a defenseman, I'd prefer one who really tilts the ice like Letang does. But as you said earlier, Trouba does everything well, no weaknesses. You guys are definitely talking me into him.

I'm also ready to thank Schultz for his contributions and move on. Maybe he does it again in a contract year, but he's gone a little backwards since his breakout year instead of building on it.

Yeah I wasn't disagreeing with anything you said. He got more PP time and put up bigger numbers this year, but otherwise he's the same guy.

If spending big on a defenseman, I'd prefer one who really tilts the ice like Letang does. But as you said earlier, Trouba does everything well, no weaknesses. You guys are definitely talking me into him.
- Tojo.

Kessel/J.Johnson for Zucker/V.Rask.

Schultz/Aston-Reese/Low pick for Trouba (and sign him for $7.5M).

Try to get JT Miller or Panarin some Fn how

I'm also ready to thank Schultz for his contributions and move on. Maybe he does it again in a contract year, but he's gone a little backwards since his breakout year instead of building on it.
- Tojo.

Well to be fair he did miss almost 5 months last season with a knee injury that took him out only a few weeks into the season. He also was very important when Letang went down in 2017 while paired with Cole. He played top D mins and caliber.

Having said all of this if Schultz is moved out and someone like Subban or Trouba end up a Pen, well then happy trails Schultzy....but I think with the current D on contract right now, he's pretty important. Right handed that fits system well and produces.

I'm also ready to thank Schultz for his contributions and move on. Maybe he does it again in a contract year, but he's gone a little backwards since his breakout year instead of building on it.
- Tojo.

I think he’s the same guy just being asked to do more. Schultz is too bad at actual defense to step up in a meaningful way when Letang goes down and isn’t good enough to thrive with a lack luster partner. I think Schultz is a solid mid pairing guy but we don’t have anyone that can maintain the top pairing at a respectable level when Letang inevitably gets hurt. That’s why I’d love to upgrade Schultz to a guy like Trouba.

I think he’s the same guy just being asked to do more. Schultz is too bad at actual defense to step up in a meaningful way when Letang goes down and isn’t good enough to thrive with a lack luster partner. I think Schultz is a solid mid pairing guy but we don’t have anyone that can maintain the top pairing at a respectable level when Letang inevitably gets hurt. That’s why I’d love to upgrade Schultz to a guy like Trouba.
- Victoro311

Generally agree with you here. Though... Schultz @ $5M and no assets lost vs. Trouba at $8M with premium assets traded away... is a different story.

If WPG is interested in a straight up swap of Schultz for Trouba (maybe thats what you meant to begin with) I could get on board.

hahaha

Not sure how any of us can trust the man with cap space...
- MattStrat

GMJR later added:
"I think that’s something we have to watch for, probably: A shutdown center."

Interesting. IIRC that's the verbiage he used when we first traded for McCann. Maybe he feels neither McCann or Bjug are "shutdown" centers....which means we could back to the everlasting quest for a 3C....